[opensuse-translation] Other translations
Hi, we are preparing - together with Mozilla and LibreOffice - small workshop for translators for upcoming Czech Linux Days https://www.linuxdays.cz/2017/en/ I'm going to show our Weblate https://l10n.opensuse.org/languages/cs/ Of course. It's good tool. Instructions https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Localization_guide seem to me bit brief, but together with https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-2.13.1/ it should be enough. I hope... :-/ Other point is documentation. Wiki (Well, I don't like WikiMedia as CMS, so I don't work in this area...) https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation has also bit brief and outdated (e.g. no word about Leap!) information. Who is responsible for that and should keep it updated? At least the general information. It doesn't look very encouraging for the newcomers (last edited 5 years ago)... Anyway, our https://cs.opensuse.org/ is not in the best state (bit poor). Our problem. More generally, are there guidelines, what (at least) should be translated? Hot to keep multilingual pages of various languages similar? I mean same design, structure, etc. Might be I'm asking obvious question, I'm not really familiar with MediaWiki... Are there any plans/possibilities to translate https://doc.opensuse.org/ ? Just in case there would be some volunteer. ;-) How it is done, when new version is released? What about other tools and web applications? Do they have support/possibility of being translated? If so, how? Are there any other projects to be translated (not hosted on Weblate)? Right now, I'd like to get complete overview and sort things little bit... Have a nice day, V. -- Vojtěch Zeisek Komunita openSUSE GNU/Linuxu Community of the openSUSE GNU/Linux https://www.opensuse.org/ https://trapa.cz/
Hi,
Gesendet: Dienstag, 26. September 2017 um 12:58 Uhr Von: "Vojtěch Zeisek" <vojtech.zeisek@opensuse.org> An: "mailinglist openSUSE" <opensuse-translation@opensuse.org> Betreff: [opensuse-translation] Other translations
Hi, we are preparing - together with Mozilla and LibreOffice - small workshop for translators for upcoming Czech Linux Days https://www.linuxdays.cz/2017/en/ I'm going to show our Weblate https://l10n.opensuse.org/languages/cs/ Of course. It's good tool. That's a great idea! Thaks you do it. :-) Instructions https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Localization_guide seem to me bit brief, but together with https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-2.13.1/ it should be enough. I hope... :-/ Other point is documentation. Wiki (Well, I don't like WikiMedia as CMS, so I don't work in this area...) https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation has also bit brief and outdated (e.g. no word about Leap!) information. Who is responsible for that and should keep it updated? At least the general information. It doesn't look very encouraging for the newcomers (last edited 5 years ago)... Everybody can contribute to the wiki. We don't have any special responsibilities. We have some pages where you need admin permissions for editing. If you have problems, you can ask your questions on the wiki mailinglist. Why do we need the word Leap in the Translation help? That's one portal and it will be updated/ created during every release by the release management team (call on the mailinglist). In addition, Leap pages of the English wiki are updated in general by the release management team.
Anyway, our https://cs.opensuse.org/ is not in the best state (bit poor). Our problem. More generally, are there guidelines, what (at least) should be translated? Hot to keep multilingual pages of various languages similar? I mean same design, structure, etc. Might be I'm asking obvious question, I'm not really familiar with MediaWiki...
I believe the German wiki has the most content after the English wiki. Most important portals like main page (by any admin) and Leap/ Tumbleweed portals should be translated first. Look that you don't have any red links any more. After that you can take the next portal. We have a separate mailing list for wiki maintainers. We support you there with the wiki update. :-) Everybody can learn using MediaWiki and contribute there. You can copy content and change the text to your language.
Are there any plans/possibilities to translate https://doc.opensuse.org/ ? doc.opensuse.org is part of the SUSE documentation team. You can create Pull Requests with contributions on github (https://github.com/SUSE/doc-sle). You would need additional tools for translations. We had a long discussion about our different tools at openSUSE: https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2017-01/msg00005.html If you want to contribute to documentation (translation), you should contribute to the wiki. That's easy to use and should be updated continously. My recommendation: Subscribe the wiki mailinglist!
Just in case there would be some volunteer. ;-) How it is done, when new version is released? What about other tools and web applications? Do they have support/possibility of being translated? If so, how? Are there any other projects to be translated (not hosted on Weblate)? Right now, I'd like to get complete overview and sort things little bit... Have a nice day, V.
We have only the wiki beside of weblate. I write "Call for Translations" for every release. That's the time stamp for wiki translations, too. ;-) Some days before the release pages like repositories and main pages should be updated. Our new search in the wiki is a really good help to test all.
-- Vojtěch Zeisek
Komunita openSUSE GNU/Linuxu Community of the openSUSE GNU/Linux
Best regards, Sarah -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-translation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-translation+owner@opensuse.org
Hi Dne úterý 26. září 2017 17:32:57 CEST, Sarah Julia Kriesch napsal(a):
Gesendet: Dienstag, 26. September 2017 um 12:58 Uhr Von: "Vojtěch Zeisek" <vojtech.zeisek@opensuse.org> An: "mailinglist openSUSE" <opensuse-translation@opensuse.org> Betreff: [opensuse-translation] Other translations
we are preparing - together with Mozilla and LibreOffice - small workshop for translators for upcoming Czech Linux Days https://www.linuxdays.cz/2017/en/ I'm going to show our Weblate https://l10n.opensuse.org/languages/cs/ Of course. It's good tool.
That's a great idea! Thaks you do it. :-)
Anyone to join? :-)
Instructions https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Localization_guide seem to me bit brief, but together with https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-2.13.1/ it should be enough. I hope... :-/ Other point is documentation. Wiki (Well, I don't like WikiMedia as CMS, so I don't work in this area...) https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation has also bit brief and outdated (e.g. no word about Leap!) information. Who is responsible for that and should keep it updated? At least the general information. It doesn't look very encouraging for the newcomers (last edited 5 years ago)...
Everybody can contribute to the wiki. We don't have any special
So how is the consistency kept then? I don't wont to drive the discussion to the Wiki solely, but this is obvious question to emerge...
responsibilities. We have some pages where you need admin permissions for editing. If you have problems, you can ask your questions on the wiki mailinglist. Why do we need the word Leap in the Translation help? That's one portal and it will be updated/ created during every release by the release management team (call on the mailinglist). In addition, Leap pages of the English wiki are updated in general by the release management team.
Look at https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation#Portals The list seems to be outdated. Obviously it is. Yes, I can edit it, but I don't know how this process (creation and maintenance of multilingual oS Wiki) is organized and the page then seems to be abandoned. I.e. if I'd edit it, it might be useless as nobody could care, as seen by non-existing maintenance of the Wiki page...
Anyway, our https://cs.opensuse.org/ is not in the best state (bit poor). Our problem. More generally, are there guidelines, what (at least) should be translated? Hot to keep multilingual pages of various languages similar? I mean same design, structure, etc. Might be I'm asking obvious question, I'm not really familiar with MediaWiki...
I believe the German wiki has the most content after the English wiki. Most important portals like main page (by any admin) and Leap/ Tumbleweed portals should be translated first. Look that you don't have any red links any more. After that you can take the next portal. We have a separate mailing list for wiki maintainers. We support you there with the wiki update. :-) Everybody can learn using MediaWiki and contribute there. You can copy content and change the text to your language.
Yes. As one-time task it can work. But as far as I know, there are no traces of changes regarding state of translations. If something is changed in the English original, how to easily see which corresponding translated section needs to be updated in other languages?
Are there any plans/possibilities to translate https://doc.opensuse.org/ ?
doc.opensuse.org is part of the SUSE documentation team. You can create Pull Requests with contributions on github (https://github.com/SUSE/doc-sle). You would need additional tools for translations. We had a long discussion
This is no-way. It is written in DocBook, isn't it? Me, personally, after HTML and TEX I'm not going for this new syntax, which is otherwise useless for me. And unless there are PO files and some tools to help keeping track how much is translated and so on (compare with Weblate), it is not user-friendly for translators. They wish to comfortably translate and use software they are familiar with (and use also for other tasks), not to "fight" with special technical tools.
about our different tools at openSUSE: https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2017-01/msg00005.html If you want
I'm not sure I fully got sense of that, but I'd highlight this particular message https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2016-12/msg00034.html
to contribute to documentation (translation), you should contribute to the wiki. That's easy to use and should be updated continously. My recommendation: Subscribe the wiki mailinglist!
Wiki is documentation? Well, what is https://doc.opensuse.org/ then? ;-) This always bit confused me and You did not make it clear. :-) I like doc.o.o as it is really valuable source of information, but with current methods I don't see possibility of it to being translated. Well, we don't have any volunteer to start to translate tomorrow, but if there is no tool to comfortably handle translations, there will be no one...
Just in case there would be some volunteer. ;-) How it is done, when new version is released? What about other tools and web applications? Do they have support/possibility of being translated? If so, how? Are there any other projects to be translated (not hosted on Weblate)? Right now, I'd like to get complete overview and sort things little bit...
We have only the wiki beside of weblate. I write "Call for Translations" for every release. That's the time stamp for wiki translations, too. ;-) Some days before the release pages like repositories and main pages should be updated. Our new search in the wiki is a really good help to test all.
Good. I'd strongly prefer any other new project to be translated to be available in Weblate. It's easy to use tool. V. -- Vojtěch Zeisek Komunita openSUSE GNU/Linuxu Community of the openSUSE GNU/Linux https://www.opensuse.org/ https://trapa.cz/
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 27. September 2017 um 09:48 Uhr Von: "Vojtěch Zeisek" <vojtech.zeisek@opensuse.org> An: opensuse-translation@opensuse.org Betreff: Re: [opensuse-translation] Other translations
Hi
Everybody can contribute to the wiki. We don't have any special
So how is the consistency kept then? I don't wont to drive the discussion to the Wiki solely, but this is obvious question to emerge...
Wiki maintainers can subscribe special pages in the English wiki they want to translate to their own language. So they receive update notifications that they have to update their own page.
Look at https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation#Portals The list seems to be outdated. Obviously it is. Yes, I can edit it, but I don't know how this process (creation and maintenance of multilingual oS Wiki) is organized and the page then seems to be abandoned. I.e. if I'd edit it, it might be useless as nobody could care, as seen by non-existing maintenance of the Wiki page...
That isn't outdated, because you can see only examples there. We have so many Portals that you can't list all there. If you want to have changes there, that would be a topic for the Wiki mailing list. Let's discuss it there not here.
Yes. As one-time task it can work. But as far as I know, there are no traces of changes regarding state of translations. If something is changed in the English original, how to easily see which corresponding translated section needs to be updated in other languages?
Every wiki page has a change log. You can watch it with clicking above on History. Additional to that you can receive change mails, if you subscribe the wiki page after adding anything to the English wiki. You'll receive more support on the wiki mailinglist...
Are there any plans/possibilities to translate https://doc.opensuse.org/ ?
doc.opensuse.org is part of the SUSE documentation team. You can create Pull Requests with contributions on github (https://github.com/SUSE/doc-sle). You would need additional tools for translations. We had a long discussion
This is no-way. It is written in DocBook, isn't it? Me, personally, after HTML and TEX I'm not going for this new syntax, which is otherwise useless for me. And unless there are PO files and some tools to help keeping track how much is translated and so on (compare with Weblate), it is not user-friendly for translators. They wish to comfortably translate and use software they are familiar with (and use also for other tasks), not to "fight" with special technical tools.
about our different tools at openSUSE: https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2017-01/msg00005.html If you want
I'm not sure I fully got sense of that, but I'd highlight this particular message https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2016-12/msg00034.html
to contribute to documentation (translation), you should contribute to the wiki. That's easy to use and should be updated continously. My recommendation: Subscribe the wiki mailinglist!
Wiki is documentation? Well, what is https://doc.opensuse.org/ then? ;-) This always bit confused me and You did not make it clear. :-) I like doc.o.o as it is really valuable source of information, but with current methods I don't see possibility of it to being translated. Well, we don't have any volunteer to start to translate tomorrow, but if there is no tool to comfortably handle translations, there will be no one...
So it is... doc.opensuse.org is the job of the SUSE documetation team at the moment. The community doesn't contribute there. Christian and I try to improve this problem. We have introduced the github extension for the wiki. So we can receive upstream documentation from github in our wiki on an easy way. If you have new ideas, you can contribute that on the wiki mailinglist. We are on the wrong mailinglist here.
Just in case there would be some volunteer. ;-) How it is done, when new version is released?
There is a message on the wiki mailinglist that a new Leap portal exist and the wiki translation can begin. I write a "Call for Translations" to this mailinglist and the new Leap translation starts on Weblate. That should be some time before "new version is released"...
What about other tools and web applications? Do they have support/possibility of being translated? If so, how? Are there any other projects to be translated (not hosted on Weblate)? We are using Desktops like KDE, GNOME, Cinnamon, LXDE,... We are using translations from their projects. So you contribute to openSUSE, if you translate on https://l10n.kde.org/ as an example, too. I receive a list with not finished translated (but needed) translations in the release management team every year. That will be forwarded to this mailinglist, too. I don't have to do it, if we have a complete translated KDE. :-)
Good. I'd strongly prefer any other new project to be translated to be available in Weblate. It's easy to use tool.
You are right. If you have ideas for improvement something with tools for documentation, forward it on the wiki list, please. Best regards, Sarah
V.
-- Vojtěch Zeisek
Komunita openSUSE GNU/Linuxu Community of the openSUSE GNU/Linux
-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-translation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-translation+owner@opensuse.org
Dne pátek 29. září 2017 9:01:55 CEST, Sarah Julia Kriesch napsal(a):
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 27. September 2017 um 09:48 Uhr Von: "Vojtěch Zeisek" <vojtech.zeisek@opensuse.org> An: opensuse-translation@opensuse.org Betreff: Re: [opensuse-translation] Other translations
Everybody can contribute to the wiki. We don't have any special
So how is the consistency kept then? I don't wont to drive the discussion to the Wiki solely, but this is obvious question to emerge...
Wiki maintainers can subscribe special pages in the English wiki they want to translate to their own language. So they receive update notifications that they have to update their own page.
OK
Look at https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation#Portals The list seems to be outdated. Obviously it is. Yes, I can edit it, but I don't know how this process (creation and maintenance of multilingual oS Wiki) is organized and the page then seems to be abandoned. I.e. if I'd edit it, it might be useless as nobody could care, as seen by non-existing maintenance of the Wiki page...
That isn't outdated, because you can see only examples there. We have so many Portals that you can't list all there. If you want to have changes there, that would be a topic for the Wiki mailing list. Let's discuss it there not here.
Well, sort of. I'd see it as a guideline where to start... No?
Yes. As one-time task it can work. But as far as I know, there are no traces of changes regarding state of translations. If something is changed in the English original, how to easily see which corresponding translated section needs to be updated in other languages?
Every wiki page has a change log. You can watch it with clicking above on History. Additional to that you can receive change mails, if you subscribe the wiki page after adding anything to the English wiki. You'll receive more support on the wiki mailinglist...
OK, thank You for clarification and explanation.
Are there any plans/possibilities to translate https://doc.opensuse.org/ ?
doc.opensuse.org is part of the SUSE documentation team. You can create Pull Requests with contributions on github (https://github.com/SUSE/doc-sle). You would need additional tools for translations. We had a long discussion>
This is no-way. It is written in DocBook, isn't it? Me, personally, after HTML and TEX I'm not going for this new syntax, which is otherwise useless for me. And unless there are PO files and some tools to help keeping track how much is translated and so on (compare with Weblate), it is not user-friendly for translators. They wish to comfortably translate and use software they are familiar with (and use also for other tasks), not to "fight" with special technical tools.
about our different tools at openSUSE: https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2017-01/msg00005.html If you want
I'm not sure I fully got sense of that, but I'd highlight this particular message https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-wiki/2016-12/msg00034.html
to contribute to documentation (translation), you should contribute to the wiki. That's easy to use and should be updated continously. My recommendation: Subscribe the wiki mailinglist!
Wiki is documentation? Well, what is https://doc.opensuse.org/ then? ;-) This always bit confused me and You did not make it clear. :-) I like doc.o.o as it is really valuable source of information, but with current methods I don't see possibility of it to being translated. Well, we don't have any volunteer to start to translate tomorrow, but if there is no tool to comfortably handle translations, there will be no one...
So it is... doc.opensuse.org is the job of the SUSE documetation team at the moment. The community doesn't contribute there. Christian and I try to improve this problem. We have introduced the github extension for the wiki. So we can receive upstream documentation from github in our wiki on an easy way.
OK, good to know. Thank You for the effort.
If you have new ideas, you can contribute that on the wiki mailinglist. We are on the wrong mailinglist here.
I'd guess everything related to translations is discussed here...? :-)
Just in case there would be some volunteer. ;-) How it is done, when new version is released?
There is a message on the wiki mailinglist that a new Leap portal exist and the wiki translation can begin. I write a "Call for Translations" to this mailinglist and the new Leap translation starts on Weblate. That should be some time before "new version is released"...
This is all right, of course. I didn't have any doubts here. OK, it's not a discussion for this ML, but I was wondering about the workflow how new version of the documentation is created. How do they trace what is going to be upgraded? Things like that of course help work. But until there is some workflow for translations, it's not very important...
What about other tools and web applications? Do they have support/possibility of being translated? If so, how? Are there any other projects to be translated (not hosted on Weblate)?
We are using Desktops like KDE, GNOME, Cinnamon, LXDE,... We are using translations from their projects. So you contribute to openSUSE, if you translate on https://l10n.kde.org/ as an example, too. I receive a list with not finished translated (but needed) translations in the release management team every year. That will be forwarded to this mailinglist, too. I don't have to do it, if we have a complete translated KDE. :-)
Of course, but it's not openSUSE's issue, isn't it? :-)
Good. I'd strongly prefer any other new project to be translated to be available in Weblate. It's easy to use tool.
You are right. If you have ideas for improvement something with tools for documentation, forward it on the wiki list, please. -- Vojtěch Zeisek
Komunita openSUSE GNU/Linuxu Community of the openSUSE GNU/Linux https://www.opensuse.org/ https://trapa.cz/
Gesendet: Freitag, 29. September 2017 um 09:32 Uhr Von: "Vojtěch Zeisek" <vojtech.zeisek@opensuse.org> An: opensuse-translation@opensuse.org Betreff: Re: [opensuse-translation] Other translations
Look at https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation#Portals The list seems to be outdated. Obviously it is. Yes, I can edit it, but I don't know how this process (creation and maintenance of multilingual oS Wiki) is organized and the page then seems to be abandoned. I.e. if I'd edit it, it might be useless as nobody could care, as seen by non-existing maintenance of the Wiki page...
That isn't outdated, because you can see only examples there. We have so many Portals that you can't list all there. If you want to have changes there, that would be a topic for the Wiki mailing list. Let's discuss it there not here.
Well, sort of. I'd see it as a guideline where to start... No? You can see it as a guidline where to start. You should be able to understand our wiki structure. After that you can use "Most popular portals" under https://en.opensuse.org/Main_Page for starting with most important portals. Subscribe every translated page and you receive notifications about updates.
If you have new ideas, you can contribute that on the wiki mailinglist. We are on the wrong mailinglist here.
I'd guess everything related to translations is discussed here...? :-)
Öhmmm... No. We discuss the Translation here, not the wiki stuff. We are translating all what is integrated into software. The documentation team isn't subscribed on this mailinglist. If you want to contribute to documentation or the wiki, you have to ask on the other mailinglist.
Just in case there would be some volunteer. ;-) How it is done, when new version is released?
There is a message on the wiki mailinglist that a new Leap portal exist and the wiki translation can begin. I write a "Call for Translations" to this mailinglist and the new Leap translation starts on Weblate. That should be some time before "new version is released"...
This is all right, of course. I didn't have any doubts here. OK, it's not a discussion for this ML, but I was wondering about the workflow how new version of the documentation is created. How do they trace what is going to be upgraded? Things like that of course help work. But until there is some workflow for translations, it's not very important...
You'll need the documentation team for those discussions. They are on the wiki mailinglist and not here. :-) We are open, but the documentation team isn't part of the translation team.
What about other tools and web applications? Do they have support/possibility of being translated? If so, how? Are there any other projects to be translated (not hosted on Weblate)?
We are using Desktops like KDE, GNOME, Cinnamon, LXDE,... We are using translations from their projects. So you contribute to openSUSE, if you translate on https://l10n.kde.org/ as an example, too. I receive a list with not finished translated (but needed) translations in the release management team every year. That will be forwarded to this mailinglist, too. I don't have to do it, if we have a complete translated KDE. :-)
Of course, but it's not openSUSE's issue, isn't it? :-)
I believe you want to have openSUSE with a full translated desktop (or default desktops should be translated). Many customers would write us bugs if anything wouldn't be translated in the GUI. That's the reason for testing it. If any important part (for us) is missing in any language, we are doing this job, too. Other Linux distributions are doing the same with their default desktops. Many openSUSE Contributors are KDE Contributors or amywhere else, too. Best regards, Sarah -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-translation+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-translation+owner@opensuse.org
On 2017-09-29 09:01, Sarah Julia Kriesch wrote:
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 27. September 2017 um 09:48 Uhr Von: "Vojtěch Zeisek" <vojtech.zeisek@opensuse.org> An: opensuse-translation@opensuse.org Betreff: Re: [opensuse-translation] Other translations
Hi
Everybody can contribute to the wiki. We don't have any special
So how is the consistency kept then? I don't wont to drive the discussion to the Wiki solely, but this is obvious question to emerge...
Wiki maintainers can subscribe special pages in the English wiki they want to translate to their own language. So they receive update notifications that they have to update their own page.
Look at https://languages.opensuse.org/Help:Translation#Portals The list seems to be outdated. Obviously it is. Yes, I can edit it, but I don't know how this process (creation and maintenance of multilingual oS Wiki) is organized and the page then seems to be abandoned. I.e. if I'd edit it, it might be useless as nobody could care, as seen by non-existing maintenance of the Wiki page...
That isn't outdated, because you can see only examples there. We have so many Portals that you can't list all there. If you want to have changes there, that would be a topic for the Wiki mailing list. Let's discuss it there not here.
Yes. As one-time task it can work. But as far as I know, there are no traces of changes regarding state of translations. If something is changed in the English original, how to easily see which corresponding translated section needs to be updated in other languages?
Every wiki page has a change log. You can watch it with clicking above on History. Additional to that you can receive change mails, if you subscribe the wiki page after adding anything to the English wiki. You'll receive more support on the wiki mailinglist...
It is very difficult. Wiki needs special mode for translators, where we can see the page we translated with the modified sections in red, say, since the last time we translated it. Not a list (log) of all changes. The result is that wiki translations are done once, then left alone for years. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 42.2 x86_64 "Malachite" at Telcontar)
participants (3)
-
Carlos E. R. -
Sarah Julia Kriesch -
Vojtěch Zeisek