[opensuse-project] openSUSE Board Meeting Minutes, March 25
Board Meeting March 25 7-9pm UTC Federico Mena Quintero (federico1) Michael Löffler (michl) Bryen Yunashko (suseROCKs) Pascal Bleser (yaloki) Status of old action items * AI henne, create board blog a spotlight.opensuse.org WIP * AI all, get Member approval done -henne and yaloki want to hack the thing that it becomes more efficient * Trademark guide lines, AI: zonker to do next steps for v2 -WIP, for feeback please use: http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_Trademark_Guidelines_use_cases - Boards view on cusomized versions - limited use of openSUSE customized distro allowed (eg. for friends, in my LUG) - broader audience should ask for permission, esp. as they want PR through the openSUSE mark like "You want to distribute media with marks on them. Fine. But if you want prestige, come to us." * Improvment of IRC cloak and email address handling - suseROCKs and yaloki should become side admins at freenode - WIP - already applied * openSUSE conference - will take place in Nuremberg, Sept 17-20 - zonker will establish a program committee - AI: zonker to announce it * openSUSE Foundation The discussion about an own openSUSE foundation came up again on several places. Especially for receiving donations and support with them directly the community (travel, hardware etc.) a foundation would be a huge step forward. Today it's pretty complicated and everything needs to go through the body of Novell. We're in agreement that such a move will be only succesful if we do it together with Novell (in the sense of make Novell participating in the creation of such a foundation). Yaloki came up with some urls of organization which do "donation collection" for other open source projects: http://conservancy.softwarefreedom.org/ http://www.spi-inc.org/about-spi AI: michl checks on foundation creation in Germany AI: yaloki to get more inforamtion about the existing organizations * Seperate openSUSE bugzilla Not all are happy with the openSUSE bugzilla. We had a discussion about pros and cons for having a seperate instance for openSUSE. - Federico: as for me, I'll heartily recommend not having a separate/different bug tracker - it's a major pain in the ass. We had that situation in bugzilla.ximian.com and an internal bug tracker, and it sucks big rocks - yaloki: Novell Bugzilla sucks big rocks for non-novell employees and the unnecessary complexity of bugzilla might put off people to file bugs - our Bugzilla is just too complicated + ichain is not appreciated by some people - get rid of ichain, Lauch pad might be a possibillity -> move to email discussion Membership Advantages - suseRocks came up with the idea to get each member a free LWN account AI: michl to ask zonker -- Michael Löffler, Product Management SUSE LINUX Products GmbH - Nürnberg - AG Nürnberg - HRB 16746 - GF: Markus Rex -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
Le jeudi 09 avril 2009, à 11:26 +0200, Michael Loeffler a écrit :
AI: michl checks on foundation creation in Germany
Hrm. From what I know from KDE eV and the GNOME Foundation, I have the feeling that having a foundation based in Germany (compared to the US) requires some stricter things. This is not necessarily a bad thing, but it makes life harder from time to time... Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 09 April 2009 01:13:22 pm Vincent Untz wrote:
Le jeudi 09 avril 2009, à 11:26 +0200, Michael Loeffler a écrit :
AI: michl checks on foundation creation in Germany
Hrm. From what I know from KDE eV and the GNOME Foundation, I have the feeling that having a foundation based in Germany (compared to the US) requires some stricter things. This is not necessarily a bad thing, but it makes life harder from time to time...
Vincent
Vincent, You are correct. We just went through a several month process to setup a Scribus .eV in Germany. Its taking ages to get the final OK. I would recommend looking at a French Association under the 1901 law* or working with one of the American software groups like Software conservancy. A 501c3 non profit takes time to setup and often requires professional help from a lawyer and often an accountant. The reporting rules are quite strict to maintain tax free status. That is where the expertise of Software Conservancy is helpful. Cheers, Peter * http://paris.angloinfo.com/countries/france/loi1901.asp (English) * http://www.associations.gouv.fr/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Thursday 09 April 2009, P Linnell wrote:
You are correct. We just went through a several month process to setup a Scribus .eV in Germany. Its taking ages to get the final OK.
Having gone through this with the KDE e.V. I know what you are talking about. It makes a difference though, if you go for the tax-exempt status or not. This takes additional effort and subjects you to some stricter rules. Just going for a plain e.V. is relatively straightforward. The fact that there are more than half a million e.V.s in Germany shows that it's pretty feasible. There are quite some free software related e.V.s in Germany now, KDE e.V. and Scribus e.V. being only two examples, so there is some experience with that which can be drawn upon. The advantage of an e.V. is that you get solid rules and well-defined procedures, which enforce that the organization is run in a transparent and democratic way. And for Germans being able to get tax benefits for donations, there is no other way than a tax-exempt e.V. in Germany. I'm not necessarily advocating an e.V., but I wouldn't exclude this option lightly. -- Cornelius Schumacher <cschum@suse.de> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Cornelius Schumacher wrote: [...]
I'm not necessarily advocating an e.V., but I wouldn't exclude this option lightly.
We're not excluding any option at this point, just investigating the pros and cons of each. Bryen and I have discussed with the folks of SPI-INC and we have a clear picture of that possibility now. We're still having a look at having our own non-for-profit (e.V.) as well as going through other umbrella organisations. Once we have clarified all options, we'll come up with a summary in order to discuss it with everyone. The primary driver behind this is obviously to be able to collect funds/donations for openSUSE directly, in order to sponsor activities, programs, travels, infrastructure, ... It's still a long way though :) cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org> /\\ http://opensuse.org -- I took the green pill _\_v FOSDEM::7+8 Feb 2009, Brussels, http://fosdem.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFJ4H8fr3NMWliFcXcRAiL/AJ9Qk7pPnhQN6i/ddwLkZh0SqJgQ9gCfdm2o guT4rX0YfWK9eoiN50tw/Vs= =EqUn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Saturday, 2009-04-11 at 13:29 +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote:
The primary driver behind this is obviously to be able to collect funds/donations for openSUSE directly, in order to sponsor activities, programs, travels, infrastructure, ... It's still a long way though :)
You may need to register in many countries, if donators want to fill for tax refunds or whatever they are called in their repective countries. Is there anything global for the EU at least? - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkngg54ACgkQtTMYHG2NR9UX+QCfaANwF7SiHNrMvPV3xqb1VxKG WDMAoJfGPiaG9ylJZIKJbQ04C6Xlj9Jo =1gS/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Carlos E. R. wrote:
On Saturday, 2009-04-11 at 13:29 +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote:
The primary driver behind this is obviously to be able to collect funds/donations for openSUSE directly, in order to sponsor activities, programs, travels, infrastructure, ... It's still a long way though :)
You may need to register in many countries, if donators want to fill for tax refunds or whatever they are called in their repective countries. Is there anything global for the EU at least?
There isn't. Or at least, not that I know of. There is barely any synchronisation between EU countries on tax level as of now. Tax refunds/exemption isn't the highest priority on my list though. If having the necessary status (e.g. in Germany) to have a non-for-profit with tax exemption comes with too many strings attached, I'd rather go for less hassle. It's part of the analysis we have to conduct though. cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org> /\\ http://opensuse.org -- I took the green pill _\_v FOSDEM::7+8 Feb 2009, Brussels, http://fosdem.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFJ4NLkr3NMWliFcXcRAmsJAKCZPMKmqj9jX+9v/mXZmpQsL1Zb6ACfUMFJ OXoXyARxC5WTPuLKaa4ssys= =h7/6 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Sat, 2009-04-11 at 19:27 +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
Carlos E. R. wrote:
On Saturday, 2009-04-11 at 13:29 +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote:
The primary driver behind this is obviously to be able to collect funds/donations for openSUSE directly, in order to sponsor activities, programs, travels, infrastructure, ... It's still a long way though :)
You may need to register in many countries, if donators want to fill for tax refunds or whatever they are called in their repective countries. Is there anything global for the EU at least?
There isn't. Or at least, not that I know of. There is barely any synchronisation between EU countries on tax level as of now.
Tax refunds/exemption isn't the highest priority on my list though. If having the necessary status (e.g. in Germany) to have a non-for-profit with tax exemption comes with too many strings attached, I'd rather go for less hassle. It's part of the analysis we have to conduct though.
cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org>
Just remember folks, we're definitely mindful of setting this up in a geographical location that benefits the most donors. But that's a moving target with no available statistical information about where the most likely openSUSE donors come from. As an example, here on our mailing list and in IRC, we observe perhaps most come from the EU area. But it was recently discovered in Facebook that there's a group of openSUSE supporters (somewhat quite active) that seems toe be mostly US residents. There's 2,300 members in that group! The other thing to consider is the costs. We're starting from scratch here with no pre-existing budget. (No the Board does not currently have a discretionary budget.) Having something set up in many regions would definitely prove cost-daunting for us. So we need to figure out how to catch the most flies with the least amount of honey. It's a challenge, and one we're definitely wading through because we want to make this happen. But at this point, we don't even know what our potential fundraising would be. We hear from people from time to time saying "I want to donate." But we don't know what this translates to financially. Would we raise only a couple of hundred dollars or thousands? Who knows at this early point. But we intend to find out! :-) -- Bryen Yunashko openSUSE Board Member openSUSE-GNOME Team Member GNOME-A11y Team Member www.bryen.com (Personal Blog) www.planet-a11y.net (Feed aggregator of the Accessibility Community) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
Bryen a écrit :
On Sat, 2009-04-11 at 19:27 +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote:
thousands? Who knows at this early point. But we intend to find out! :-)
but do we need many? in France, creating an association is very cheap - you not even have to be incorporated and if you do you have to have 3 people and approx €30 to publish in the official newspaper, no more. no. The problem is not of money, but of property. Say, if ever the new association become owner of the opensuse name, we have to be sure nobody will stole it! control is not that easy... jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-eic8MSSfM http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1412160445 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
On Sat, 2009-04-11 at 20:27 +0200, jdd wrote:
Bryen a écrit :
On Sat, 2009-04-11 at 19:27 +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote:
thousands? Who knows at this early point. But we intend to find out! :-)
but do we need many?
in France, creating an association is very cheap - you not even have to be incorporated and if you do you have to have 3 people and approx €30 to publish in the official newspaper, no more.
no. The problem is not of money, but of property.
Say, if ever the new association become owner of the opensuse name, we have to be sure nobody will stole it!
control is not that easy...
jdd
Yes. Control of identity is always a challenge. We have not even gotten to the point of discussing whether we would own the openSUSE name or if it will still be owned by Novell with permission from them to use it for this purpose. That's a whole 'nother ballgame, but yes an important part of the puzzle. We do however, have the authority now to determine who may use the openSUSE trademarks on their material (i.e. print, merchandise, websites, etc.)
-- http://www.dodin.net http://valerie.dodin.org http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-eic8MSSfM http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1412160445
-- Bryen Yunashko openSUSE Board Member openSUSE-GNOME Team Member GNOME-A11y Team Member www.bryen.com (Personal Blog) www.planet-a11y.net (Feed aggregator of the Accessibility Community) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
Hello, on Donnerstag, 9. April 2009, Michael Loeffler wrote:
* openSUSE conference - will take place in Nuremberg, Sept 17-20
Sounds interesting :-) Unfortunately the timing is bad for me - at this time I'll probably be busy with grape harvest...
* Seperate openSUSE bugzilla Not all are happy with the openSUSE bugzilla. We had a discussion about pros and cons for having a seperate instance for openSUSE. - Federico: as for me, I'll heartily recommend not having a separate/different bug tracker - it's a major pain in the ass. We had that situation in bugzilla.ximian.com and an internal bug tracker, and it sucks big rocks - yaloki: Novell Bugzilla sucks big rocks for non-novell employees and the unnecessary complexity of bugzilla might put off people to file bugs - our Bugzilla is just too complicated + ichain is not appreciated by some people - get rid of ichain, Lauch pad might be a possibillity -> move to email discussion
You you please give some details about which problems you see with the Novell bugzilla? The most important problem from my POV is the missing/locked user lookup for non-Novell people which is probably solvable [1]. What other problems do you see? What's the problem with iChain? IMHO it's "just" a login method and not a problem. What do I overlook? And, more important, what would be the replacement? BTW: I agree with Federico that a separate bugtracker will probably cause lots of headache and split the bugs across even more places. (I already have enough bugtracker accounts at different places - openSUSE/Novell, Sourceforge, several bugtrackers of upstream projects. Can someone please invent bugtracking.all-software.org? ;-)) Regards, Christian Boltz [1] ask for bug numbers, details and my ideas if you want, but I'd prefer to have a non-technical discussion for now ;-) -- Jedes Update mitzumachen finde ich sinnfrei. Man muss es ja nicht gleich so extrem wie ich praktizieren ;) [David Haller in suse-linux] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org
participants (9)
-
Bryen -
Carlos E. R. -
Christian Boltz -
Cornelius Schumacher -
jdd -
Michael Loeffler -
P Linnell -
Pascal Bleser -
Vincent Untz