Today, I sat and read this entire thread and I have a few comments: 1) It is often forgotten that NO ONE produces a desktop DVD with as much included software and utilities as openSUSE. Moving to 8 months cycle just to support new kernels and all of YaST2 is not that unreasonable. Add two desktops and 3 Gb of software and well, Thank you Team!!!! 2) if printing a cardboard box is keeping us from having a nice boxed set then dump the box and shrink wrap a nice manual with the DVD's ( a sticker would hurt my feelings , make them version agnostic so that we only have to print them when we need more) and a support certificate. 3) consider separating the applications from the distro and spinning regular "live CD's" that install as they do now. With separated applications and a commitment to refining each "live CD" , it could become an upgrade in place option instead of a patch CD and the BS could be asked to recompile all the applications for the new Live CD as we do know when we provide a repo for 11.0>11.1>11x. When a customer needs a new DVD due to bandwidth issues. It would seem that it's a lot cheaper to burn a copy of the BS repo. These "application" DVD's could also be sold separately. I know that a great deal of work goes into what is being done, but if these minor quality issues are keeping us from being number one then I say reduce the workload until the live CD's run perfect on 99% of the hardware and leave the apps to "ADD-ON" media. I repeat myself but the tools seem to already be in YaST to create patch and add-on cd's. Our example of how easy it is could make the technology an outstanding feature that puts us on top. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-project+help@opensuse.org