[opensuse-kde] Policy for KRxy
Hey everybody! What's the policy for patches to KRxy? AFAIR KRxy repos were meant to be more stable, i.e. less patching and rebuilding than KDF. Ideally only updated once a month, i.e. for a new upstream release. Of course it makes sense to update non-SC apps and fix packaging bugs. But what about other patches? Shouldn't they be restricted to "important" bugs? Important needs a definition. Crashes, data loss, regressions would come to my mind. Also, only patches that were accepted upstream should be pushed into KRxy. What are your thoughts? Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
On Saturday 04 Aug 2012 09:39:50 Sven Burmeister wrote:
Hey everybody!
What's the policy for patches to KRxy? AFAIR KRxy repos were meant to be more stable, i.e. less patching and rebuilding than KDF. Ideally only updated once a month, i.e. for a new upstream release.
Now that 12.2 is nearly done, I would suggest that we 1) Submit 4.8.5 to 12.2 and move KDE:Distro:Factory packages to KDE:Distro:Stable (the devel project for 12.2 maintenance, for those who have just tuned in) 2) Move KDE:Release:49 packages to KDE:Distro:Factory and make KR49 *fixed* links to KDF 3) Work together on 4.9 patching and updating in KDF 4) Update KR49 linked revisions regularly (fortnightly?).
Of course it makes sense to update non-SC apps and fix packaging bugs. But what about other patches? Shouldn't they be restricted to "important" bugs?
Important needs a definition. Crashes, data loss, regressions would come to my mind.
Also, only patches that were accepted upstream should be pushed into KRxy.
Or just 'no random hacking' rule, which would imply upstream patches or things we deliberately develop (we can but dream...) Will -- Will Stephenson, openSUSE Board, Booster, KDE Developer SUSE LINUX GmbH, GF: Jeff Hawn, Jennifer Guild, Felix Imendörffer, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstraße 5 90409 Nürnberg Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:43:15 schrieb Will Stephenson:
On Saturday 04 Aug 2012 09:39:50 Sven Burmeister wrote:
Hey everybody!
What's the policy for patches to KRxy? AFAIR KRxy repos were meant to be more stable, i.e. less patching and rebuilding than KDF. Ideally only updated once a month, i.e. for a new upstream release.
Now that 12.2 is nearly done, I would suggest that we
1) Submit 4.8.5
Where is 4.8.5? I don't see it anywhere... not even on kde.org? bye, MH -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:57:51 schrieb Mathias Homann:
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:43:15 schrieb Will Stephenson:
On Saturday 04 Aug 2012 09:39:50 Sven Burmeister wrote:
Hey everybody!
What's the policy for patches to KRxy? AFAIR KRxy repos were meant to be more stable, i.e. less patching and rebuilding than KDF. Ideally only updated once a month, i.e. for a new upstream release.
Now that 12.2 is nearly done, I would suggest that we
1) Submit 4.8.5
Where is 4.8.5? I don't see it anywhere... not even on kde.org?
Did you check KDF, the place were packages for openSUSE releases can be found since ages? Regarding upstream, just check the git repos and you will see that there are commits added to the 4.8 branch after 4.8.4 was released. Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am 04.08.2012 11:15, schrieb Sven Burmeister:
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:57:51 schrieb Mathias Homann:
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:43:15 schrieb Will Stephenson:
On Saturday 04 Aug 2012 09:39:50 Sven Burmeister wrote:
Hey everybody!
What's the policy for patches to KRxy? AFAIR KRxy repos were meant to be more stable, i.e. less patching and rebuilding than KDF. Ideally only updated once a month, i.e. for a new upstream release.
Now that 12.2 is nearly done, I would suggest that we
1) Submit 4.8.5
Where is 4.8.5? I don't see it anywhere... not even on kde.org?
Did you check KDF, the place were packages for openSUSE releases can be found since ages?
Regarding upstream, just check the git repos and you will see that there are commits added to the 4.8 branch after 4.8.4 was released.
Funny, here I thought that a) KDE:Release:48 was where the officially "blessed" KDE versions can be found, and b) www.kde.org is the authority on what is released, not a "factory" obs repo. I must have been wrong. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 11:32:26 schrieb Mathias Homann:
Am 04.08.2012 11:15, schrieb Sven Burmeister:
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:57:51 schrieb Mathias Homann:
Where is 4.8.5? I don't see it anywhere... not even on kde.org?
Did you check KDF, the place were packages for openSUSE releases can be found since ages?
Regarding upstream, just check the git repos and you will see that there are commits added to the 4.8 branch after 4.8.4 was released.
Funny, here I thought that a) KDE:Release:48 was where the officially "blessed" KDE versions can be found, and b) www.kde.org is the authority on what is released, not a "factory" obs repo.
I must have been wrong.
Indeed. Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Lørdag den 4. august 2012 11:32:26 Mathias Homann skrev:
Funny, here I thought that a) KDE:Release:48 was where the officially "blessed" KDE versions can be found, and b) www.kde.org is the authority on what is released, not a "factory" obs repo.
I must have been wrong.
Indeed. Cuz KR4x stuff is generally just links from KDF and kde.org makes tarballs available to packagers some days before announcing them to the general public. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 11:37:29 schrieb Martin Schlander:
Lørdag den 4. august 2012 11:32:26 Mathias Homann skrev:
Funny, here I thought that a) KDE:Release:48 was where the officially "blessed" KDE versions can be found, and b) www.kde.org is the authority on what is released, not a "factory" obs repo.
I must have been wrong.
Indeed.
Cuz KR4x stuff is generally just links from KDF and kde.org makes tarballs available to packagers some days before announcing them to the general public.
Ah ok... so if I wanted KDE 4.8.5 *now* i would use the K:D:F repo, but after the official release it'll be in K:R:48 as well... ... in that case my mistake was thinking that there would be no more 4.8 releases now that 4.9 has been officially released. my bad. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
On Saturday 04 Aug 2012 12:22:35 Mathias Homann wrote:
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 11:37:29 schrieb Martin Schlander:
Lørdag den 4. august 2012 11:32:26 Mathias Homann skrev:
Funny, here I thought that a) KDE:Release:48 was where the officially "blessed" KDE versions can be found, and b) www.kde.org is the authority on what is released, not a "factory" obs repo.
I must have been wrong.
Indeed.
Cuz KR4x stuff is generally just links from KDF and kde.org makes tarballs available to packagers some days before announcing them to the general public.
Ah ok... so if I wanted KDE 4.8.5 *now* i would use the K:D:F repo, but after the official release it'll be in K:R:48 as well...
... in that case my mistake was thinking that there would be no more 4.8 releases now that 4.9 has been officially released. my bad.
Ordinarily you'd have been right, but due to some mixups in kdelibs there is going to be this bonus release, in preparation by kde.org: http://mail.kde.org/pipermail/release-team/2012-July/006093.html The packages are being prepared in KDF but publish is disabled until we get the green light from kde.org. Will -- Will Stephenson, openSUSE Board, Booster, KDE Developer SUSE LINUX GmbH, GF: Jeff Hawn, Jennifer Guild, Felix Imendörffer, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstraße 5 90409 Nürnberg Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Lørdag den 4. august 2012 10:57:51 Mathias Homann skrev:
Where is 4.8.5? I don't see it anywhere... not even on kde.org?
It's not announced yet, but the finishing touches are being put on the official upstream tarballs these days. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:43:15 schrieb Will Stephenson:
4) Update KR49 linked revisions regularly (fortnightly?).
This sounds good to me.
Or just 'no random hacking' rule, which would imply upstream patches or things we deliberately develop (we can but dream...)
They should get a proper review though. If patches are created upstream but did not get a review upstream yet, i.e. no "Ship it!", then they should not be added unless the submitter guarantees that he tracks the patch upstream, updating it and in case it gets rejected removing it from the repos. Since that's quite tedious to do I would prefer to simply not submit any upstream patch which did not get at "Ship it!" upstream yet. Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Lørdag den 4. august 2012 11:26:03 Sven Burmeister skrev:
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:43:15 schrieb Will Stephenson:
4) Update KR49 linked revisions regularly (fortnightly?).
This sounds good to me.
Or just 'no random hacking' rule, which would imply upstream patches or things we deliberately develop (we can but dream...)
They should get a proper review though.
If patches are created upstream but did not get a review upstream yet, i.e. no "Ship it!", then they should not be added unless the submitter guarantees that he tracks the patch upstream, updating it and in case it gets rejected removing it from the repos. Since that's quite tedious to do I would prefer to simply not submit any upstream patch which did not get at "Ship it!" upstream yet.
That sounds like a lot of work and bureaucracy. How about something managable like "stuff must exist in KDF for at least a week (or two?) before being linked from KR4x" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 11:34:20 schrieb Martin Schlander:
If patches are created upstream but did not get a review upstream yet, i.e. no "Ship it!", then they should not be added unless the submitter guarantees that he tracks the patch upstream, updating it and in case it gets rejected removing it from the repos. Since that's quite tedious to do I would prefer to simply not submit any upstream patch which did not get at "Ship it!" upstream yet.
That sounds like a lot of work and bureaucracy.
Tedious indeed, which is why I fear people just don't follow upstream patches after they submitted them to e.g. KDF. That's why I would like a simple and robust rule. Easy to follow, low risk of including patches/patch versions which never end-up in upstream code.
How about something managable like "stuff must exist in KDF for at least a week (or two?) before being linked from KR4x"
If a patch was accepted upstream, i.e. will be part of the next upstream release, it can go in. Having to wait for weeks before a crash is fixed does not sound sensible to me. Neither adding patches that could easily wait until the next upstream release. If a patch was not accepted upstream (yet), there is a reason for that, even if it is only that there was no review yet. Why would openSUSE's repos want unreviewed patches which might not even end-up in the upstream code and hence lead to confusion or openSUSE-specific regressions? Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
On Saturday 04 Aug 2012 10:43:15 Will Stephenson wrote:
On Saturday 04 Aug 2012 09:39:50 Sven Burmeister wrote: 1) Submit 4.8.5 to 12.2 and move KDE:Distro:Factory packages to KDE:Distro:Stable (the devel project for 12.2 maintenance, for those who have just tuned in)
2) Move KDE:Release:49 packages to KDE:Distro:Factory and make KR49 *fixed* links to KDF
3) Work together on 4.9 patching and updating in KDF
4) Update KR49 linked revisions regularly (fortnightly?).
Also, only patches that were accepted upstream should be pushed into KRxy.
Or just 'no random hacking' rule, which would imply upstream patches or things we deliberately develop (we can but dream...)
good thinking (all of it) In the meanwhile until KDF ist moved to KDS and KR49 is moved to KDF, I'd accept (upstream) patches (especially the packaging bugs like the one with kdeartwork4-wallpapers). The question is though when to accept in order to keep full rebuilds at a minimum - IIRC, KDF accepts Tuesdays and Fridays - KR49 could go for a similar rule but on different days, e.g. Mondays/Thursdays or Sunday/Wednesday. Anyway, KDF is probably not getting many updates until 12.2 release so the overlap in build time should not be that high... Nico -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Montag 06 August 2012, 09:44:28 schrieb Nico Kruber:
The question is though when to accept in order to keep full rebuilds at a minimum - IIRC, KDF accepts Tuesdays and Fridays - KR49 could go for a similar rule but on different days, e.g. Mondays/Thursdays or Sunday/Wednesday. Anyway, KDF is probably not getting many updates until 12.2 release so the overlap in build time should not be that high...
Aside from rules regarding specific days, how about blocking rebuilds for the artwork packages? These things at best change at point releases or (in case of the wallpaper package) never, yet they cause a huge chunks of traffic and datacaps are not uncommon around the world. Markus -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag 04 August 2012, 09:39:50 schrieb Sven Burmeister:
What's the policy for patches to KRxy? AFAIR KRxy repos were meant to be more stable, i.e. less patching and rebuilding than KDF. Ideally only updated once a month, i.e. for a new upstream release.
Aren't current KR packages usually liked to Factory? How would such a rule enforceable then?
What are your thoughts?
I don't think exact rules are needed. The general guideline to not blindly apply random patches that could harm users is a given for all non-home repos, right? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 4. August 2012, 10:56:11 schrieb Markus:
Am Samstag 04 August 2012, 09:39:50 schrieb Sven Burmeister:
What's the policy for patches to KRxy? AFAIR KRxy repos were meant to be more stable, i.e. less patching and rebuilding than KDF. Ideally only updated once a month, i.e. for a new upstream release.
Aren't current KR packages usually liked to Factory? How would such a rule enforceable then?
Links can be bound to revision numbers.
What are your thoughts?
I don't think exact rules are needed. The general guideline to not blindly apply random patches that could harm users is a given for all non-home repos, right?
I would consider guidelines helpful. And your approach does not prevent constant rebuilding. Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kde+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-kde+owner@opensuse.org
participants (6)
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Markus -
Martin Schlander -
Mathias Homann -
Nico Kruber -
Sven Burmeister -
Will Stephenson