[opensuse-gnome] Default torrentclient in Gnome
(And once again forwarding to the list :) ) Hey, On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Christian Jäger <christian.jaeger@rub.de> wrote:
Hi Alan,
you have a great way of marketing your application; I remember that before the first inclusion of Monsoon as default BT app you also let it sound as if all we had to do was to send in some reports to fix the very few remaining bugs;
There is currently one major issue open in bugzilla: #485459. That bug has already been fixed in SVN of monotorrent (http://anonsvn.mono-project.com/viewvc?view=rev&revision=129752), about 3 days after it was reported.
and now years have gone by and Monsoon STILL is a pile of ...problems. See above.
Let's face it; it WON'T be fixed quick! Take your time, gather willing beta-testers and polish your product. Nothing will be fixed if I don't know about it.
But DON'T try to push Monsoon down our throats and turn thousands of openSUSE users into unwilling guinea-pigs. You are free to choose as you will. If you choose (along with opensuse) to not use monsoon as the default, there's nothing I can do about that. If you decide as a personal choice to not use it even if it's the default, there's nothing I can do about that either. All I can do is fix known issues and improve features and maybe one day attract you back through technical merit.
Alan.
Cheers, Chris
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I think what we need to do is get feedback from users: Is this client meeting their needs? -- Also the state of it in G:C and what broke. Anyone have any of these handy? On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 5:36 PM, Alan McGovern <alan.mcgovern@gmail.com> wrote:
(And once again forwarding to the list :) )
Hey,
On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Christian Jäger <christian.jaeger@rub.de> wrote:
Hi Alan,
you have a great way of marketing your application; I remember that before the first inclusion of Monsoon as default BT app you also let it sound as if all we had to do was to send in some reports to fix the very few remaining bugs;
There is currently one major issue open in bugzilla: #485459. That bug has already been fixed in SVN of monotorrent (http://anonsvn.mono-project.com/viewvc?view=rev&revision=129752), about 3 days after it was reported.
and now years have gone by and Monsoon STILL is a pile of ...problems. See above.
Let's face it; it WON'T be fixed quick! Take your time, gather willing beta-testers and polish your product. Nothing will be fixed if I don't know about it.
But DON'T try to push Monsoon down our throats and turn thousands of openSUSE users into unwilling guinea-pigs. You are free to choose as you will. If you choose (along with opensuse) to not use monsoon as the default, there's nothing I can do about that. If you decide as a personal choice to not use it even if it's the default, there's nothing I can do about that either. All I can do is fix known issues and improve features and maybe one day attract you back through technical merit.
Alan.
Cheers, Chris
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Am Dienstag, den 24.03.2009, 19:03 -0400 schrieb Steven Harms:
I think what we need to do is get feedback from users: Is this client meeting their needs?
How about a poll at forums.opensuse.org? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+help@opensuse.org
Am Dienstag, den 24.03.2009, 19:03 -0400 schrieb Steven Harms:
I think what we need to do is get feedback from users: Is this client meeting their needs?
OK, I've created a poll now: http://forums.opensuse.org/surveys-polls/411082-default-gnome-bittorrent-cli... -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+help@opensuse.org
On Wed, 2009-03-25 at 18:51 +0100, Christian Jäger wrote:
Am Dienstag, den 24.03.2009, 19:03 -0400 schrieb Steven Harms:
I think what we need to do is get feedback from users: Is this client meeting their needs?
OK, I've created a poll now: http://forums.opensuse.org/surveys-polls/411082-default-gnome-bittorrent-cli...
Forums poll is useful to know user opinions but that doesn't reflect what it should be done. Alan as made good points, he is upstream which means he can get fixes in time for oS releases, he also reflect the legal point of view on moonson and he also made a good point about user choice. I'm not a moonson user (i use transmission) but there's a point delivering a an application that is maintained by someone who also is involved with oS. Users can choose and remove moonson and replace by any other they want. Luis -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+help@opensuse.org
Hey, I think this thread (for me) has reached the end. I've mentioned all the points I wanted to mention, so I don't think I can add anything further to this. I'd just be restating my points and my position over and over. If there are particular issues which need to be raised with me, feel free to send me an email anytime. Or, if it's more appropriate, I'm sure everyone here knows where bugzilla is ;) Thanks for listening, Alan. On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 5:56 PM, Luis Medinas <lmedinas@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 2009-03-25 at 18:51 +0100, Christian Jäger wrote:
Am Dienstag, den 24.03.2009, 19:03 -0400 schrieb Steven Harms:
I think what we need to do is get feedback from users: Is this client meeting their needs?
OK, I've created a poll now: http://forums.opensuse.org/surveys-polls/411082-default-gnome-bittorrent-cli...
Forums poll is useful to know user opinions but that doesn't reflect what it should be done. Alan as made good points, he is upstream which means he can get fixes in time for oS releases, he also reflect the legal point of view on moonson and he also made a good point about user choice. I'm not a moonson user (i use transmission) but there's a point delivering a an application that is maintained by someone who also is involved with oS. Users can choose and remove moonson and replace by any other they want.
Luis
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Am Dienstag, den 24.03.2009, 21:36 +0000 schrieb Alan McGovern:
Nothing will be fixed if I don't know about it.
Yes, but applications aren't made default choices for the openSUSE GNOME desktop for the sake of attracting more bug-reports... Quite the opposite, applications are chosen as defaults because they are known to work without problems. I think you havce gotten it the wrong way round; openSUSE is not there to serve as a testbed for Monsoon (or other experimental software BTW). 'Don't ask what the openSUSE userbase can do for you (help you developing your app by sending in bug-reports) but ask what you can do for openSUSE (gather some people who _voluntarily_ test Monsoon and send you bug-reports, then come back with a stable application)'. ;) Greets, Chris -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+help@opensuse.org
Hey, On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 7:35 AM, Christian Jäger <christian.jaeger@rub.de> wrote:
Am Dienstag, den 24.03.2009, 21:36 +0000 schrieb Alan McGovern:
Nothing will be fixed if I don't know about it.
Yes, but applications aren't made default choices for the openSUSE GNOME desktop for the sake of attracting more bug-reports... Quite the opposite, applications are chosen as defaults because they are known to work without problems.
So, for the third time. Could you please *name* some issues with Monsoon 0.20 and preferably file them in bugzilla. Alan. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+help@opensuse.org
Am Mittwoch, den 25.03.2009, 09:25 +0000 schrieb Alan McGovern:
So, for the third time. Could you please *name* some issues with Monsoon 0.20 and preferably file them in bugzilla.
No, I won't, because it would draw this thread completely off-topic. This thread discusses which torrent-client to have as default for 11.2, it is not about fixing specifics bugs of one of the candidates. I won't start bug-triaging for Monsoon in this thread, neither for Transmission or any other specific application because this is not the place for it. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+help@opensuse.org
On Wed, 2009-03-25 at 11:44 +0100, Christian Jäger wrote:
Am Mittwoch, den 25.03.2009, 09:25 +0000 schrieb Alan McGovern:
So, for the third time. Could you please *name* some issues with Monsoon 0.20 and preferably file them in bugzilla.
No, I won't, because it would draw this thread completely off-topic. This thread discusses which torrent-client to have as default for 11.2, it is not about fixing specifics bugs of one of the candidates.
I won't start bug-triaging for Monsoon in this thread, neither for Transmission or any other specific application because this is not the place for it.
This thread seems to have taken on an entirely different tone than what was originally intended and while I stepped back in this discussion up until now, I feel something needs to be said here to get this dialogue back on track. The tone has really started to change for the worse in this thread. First of all, I do not presently have an opinion one way or another about torrent clients because frankly, I don't really use torrents. I find them boorishly slow and unreliable, regardless of what client is being used. So, I am speaking from a totally impartial stance. That being said, the discussion here is about whether we should reconsider using Monsoon as the default client because of comments made over time by various users. Alan has come into the thread and asked some basic and fair questions, imo, about "what is wrong with Monsoon?", only to be pushed back with "I won't bug-triage." If we're going to have a real discussion about the pros and cons of which client to use, then we need to not take such antagonistic stances and be open about why we think a particular choice isn't effective. Let's please stay constructive and on track for real dialogue. After all, the decision isn't imminent and we have many months to go yet before making a final decision on anything default in GNOME. If Monsoon should be removed from the honor of being the default client, let's be fair and state *why*, not just because we're the only distro to have it. FYI: back in the original discussion, I tried out both Transmission and Monsoon as a newbie to torrenting and took the perspective of such a new and inexperienced user. I found Monsoon to work, and had an easier interface for the uninitiated and I found Transmission to not be intuitive to such a user. That's why, back then, I voted for Monsoon. Not based on technical merits, but based on end-user comprehension. Has anything changed in either client since then that re-defines new user ability to grasp and use torrenting? -- Bryen Yunashko openSUSE Board Member openSUSE-GNOME Team Member GNOME-A11y Team Member -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-gnome+help@opensuse.org
participants (5)
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Alan McGovern -
Bryen -
Christian Jäger -
Luis Medinas -
Steven Harms