On Tue, 2022-10-04 at 15:33 +0000, Milachew wrote:
I think the GNOME patterns need to be rebuilt.
Primarily : - more than once I heard users complain that after installation the desktop is overloaded with games and third-party applications - when you try to remove unnecessary applications by deleting patterns, there is some confusion with them. So the GNOME patterns is also a Wayland patterns, e.g.
While I would never disagree with revising the default patterns from time to time, more specifics about the bloat installed on a default TW GNOME desktop are necessary for a clearer discussion. The only 'third' party apps installed by default, to my eyes at least, are * Firefox (obviously mandatory) * LibreOffice (also mandatory, imho) * GIMP (same) * YaST (openSUSE feature). We have a few lightweight games installed by default, these used to the core suite of GNOME games not too long ago. I feel that the default system would be rather drab and dry without any games at all. Everything else comes from the current "Core" suite of GNOME apps. I think we have gnome-terminal instead of the newer 'console' and 'gedit' intead of the newer 'gnome-text-editor'; we could probably switch them, but to me it seems the two newer apps are not feature-ready to replace the older ones yet. So, to me it seems our default GNOME is pretty slim already, not a lot of bloat there anyway.
What I suggest: - make the following patterns:
In particular, I think the GNOME patterns available on openSUSE are quite (too?) modular. Indeed we aready have the following different patterns: * patterns-gnome-devel_gnome :GNOME Development * patterns-gnome-gnome :GNOME Desktop Environment (Wayland) * patterns-gnome-gnome_basic :GNOME Desktop Environment (Basic) * patterns-gnome-gnome_basis :GNOME Base System * patterns-gnome-gnome_basis_opt :GNOME Base System * patterns-gnome-gnome_games :GNOME Games * patterns-gnome-gnome_ide :GNOME Integrated Development Environment * patterns-gnome-gnome_imaging :GNOME Graphics * patterns-gnome-gnome_internet :GNOME Internet * patterns-gnome-gnome_multimedia :GNOME Multimedia * patterns-gnome-gnome_office :GNOME Office * patterns-gnome-gnome_utilities :GNOME Utilities * patterns-gnome-gnome_x11 :GNOME Desktop Environment (X11) * patterns-gnome-gnome_yast :YaST GNOME User Interfaces Are you suggesting reducing the number of modules or increasing them by adding these new patterns you suggest?
* base GNOME with everything you need to run the environment itself without GNOME Core, but with a browser (for Internet access), an update viewer and package source code (which, as I understand it, is mandatory in openSUSE) * GNOME Core - respectively, all applications from the GNOME core, taken from here: https://apps.gnome.org/en/,
Are you suggesting to install this "GNOME Core" suite by default? But, isn't this pretty much what we have by default, except that we eschew Calendar in favour of the Evolution email and calendar suite? As you can see the above list of core GNOME apps does not list any email clients, so I think this is a net positive for openSUSE.
except for Logs (because there is YaST),
We could probably remove this from the default installed apps, yeah.
Photo (because there is eog),
Two entirely different apps, Photos is a photo manager/viewer while EOG is merely an image viewer and I see the value in keeping both.
Web browser (because there is Firefox)
It is already not installed by default AFAIK.
and Video (VLC can be supplied instead).
Please no! Videos integrates with the GNOME DE significantly better (theme, HiDPI, etc.), and we do not want to introduce Qt apps into default GNOME patterns anyway (although we _have to_ because of YaST).
That's all and the GNOME base will be as a GNOME system role. * leave the rest as is, fixing them if the patterns above catch applications from the rest - remove the Wayland patterns by spliting it with the GNOME Base (or leave as is, but add it to Basic GNOME and rename it to gnome_wayland pattern)
I don't see a Wayland pattern when searching with zypper. Do you mean: patterns-gnome-gnome | GNOME Desktop Environment (Wayland) But that is the default GNOME pattern installed on TW.
I think to reduce the GNOME base just as much, because GNOME Core can change its composition (except for settings and the file manager, their changes are quite rare so far) and a separate package for such changes will be easier to maintain in the future.
I would argue the different GNOME patterns are mostly very good as they are. We are not an upstream GNOME desktop, so we should decide on the merits/de-merits of our own steady, consistent defaults rather than simply going by whatever upstream GNOME calls 'Core', which as I understand changes all too frequently. As an aside: perhaps we could do with a minor name change as 'patterns-gnome-gnome_basic' and 'patterns-gnome-gnome_basis' are rather too similar... but that would be almost all that I would do. Cheers, -- Atri Bhattacharya <badshah400>