Am 05.12.19 um 16:26 schrieb Ancor Gonzalez Sosa:

On 12/5/19 3:45 PM, Andrei Borzenkov wrote:

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On Thu, Dec 5, 2019 at 5:39 PM Imobach González Sosa wrote:

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* Help others to keep the Live Installation working.

Quoting blog:"live installation works reasonably well again"

I would not call installation suffering problem below "working reasonably well".

https://bugzilla.opensuse.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1155687

Fair enough.

But let me use this opportunity to clarify something, just in case it's not explained clear enough in the blog entry.

Years ago, the YaST Team stopped supporting installation from the openSUSE live versions due to maintainability reasons and lack of resources. Since then, the YaST installer is only designed to run on top of the regular installation media. That's the only environment for which we develop and test every change in the installer.

At some point, someone brave enough came with an alternative way of building installable live images - adding the network installer to the live image. And they managed to make it work after tweaking several things in both the live image and YaST. The YaST team appreciates that kind of neat initiatives and tries to be supportive with them.

But the original situation still stands - the YaST Team still doesn't have enough resources to consider the installation or upgrade from the live images as a first-class citizen. So if there is a bug which affects the live installation/upgrade but does not affect the officially supported installation media, this is the most the YaST team can offer at this point:

- allocating resources to fix the bug... only when other priorities allow it - doing changes... as long as they don't risk the supported scenarios - making no commitment about keeping it working in the future

Which doesn't mean we don't care. But we want to make sure the expectations about the time-frame for fixes and improvements are clear.

Given more than 500 bug reports on YaST at bugzilla, I wonder what this "YaST: highlights of development" is about? Regards, Frank -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am 17.12.19 um 10:44 schrieb Josef Reidinger:

V Fri, 6 Dec 2019 00:05:27 +0100 Frank Krüger napsáno:

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<snip/>

Given more than 500 bug reports on YaST at bugzilla, I wonder what this "YaST: highlights of development" is about?

Regards, Frank

Hi Frank, it is true that there is many bug reports in bugzilla for YaST component, but it does not mean we do not work on it. It is just about priorities and also about amount of incoming bugs. We usually get daily around 10 bug reports. So it means that if we fix 10 bugs daily, we are still on that high amount and take also in consideration that we do not get bugs just for openSUSE, but also for SLE which pays our salaries. What is source of this bugs? As YaST is mostly integration tool, it really depends on various tools to do its job, so many bugs comes from fact that tools are changing and yast needs to react and usual way how we know about it is that we get bug report. Another source is user error/ UX problems that something is badly understood and as result it does not work as expected. And of course we are also just only humans, so we introduce bugs when we do changes like another bug fixes or new features. Is it too much bugs? Well YaST source code has approximately around 500k LOC, so it is it around 1 bug per 1k LOC, which is not bad and probably means that there is still a lot of undiscovered bugs. How you can help with it? As it seems you worry about number of bugs, so of course you can help with fixing bugs ( we welcome any patches ), triage it ( trying to reproduce it, ensure that everything is clear and YaST logs are attached) or even trying to find workaround and document it till real fix appears.

I hope this brings some light into amount of bugs YaST have and we welcome any your contribution.

Josef

Thanks a lot for providing deeper insight into the YAST team's work and workload as well as the possibilities to contribute. I appreciate it! Regards, Frank -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org