Peter Czanik <pczanik@fang.fa.gau.hu> writes:

Hello,

Andreas Jaeger wrote:

...

FYI: We have found some showstoppers and need some more time to fix them, so Beta4 is at least a day late...

What is the status of the current factory release? Is that already fixed, or the whole thing will be rebuilt this night? My mirror is

No, I still do not have a fix :-((, the fix will be in the next sync. It will only be a couple of files that need to be updated.

almost ready (still from gwdg, as at stage I still have permission denied...), and would like to know what to tell to those, who mirror my machine. BTW: there is Hungarian a school, where about 200 computers are running on factory! Bye,

That's risky ;-) Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126

Peter Czanik <pczanik@fang.fa.gau.hu> writes:

Hello,

Andreas Jaeger wrote:

...

It will only be a couple of files that need to be updated.

OK. Please let us know, when it's uploaded, so I can sync manually.

It will be together with the release...

...

...

BTW: there is Hungarian a school, where about 200 computers are running on factory! Bye,

That's risky ;-)

I know :) He uses FreeBSD next to SUSE Linux, just like me. Both of us use FreeBSD-STABLE, a constantly updated, but fully stable source distribution and he thought, that it has the same function for SUSE Linux. He learned the hard way, that it's another concept :) Bye,

Oops ;-) Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126

On Thu, Feb 16, 2006 at 06:01:05PM +0100, Azerion - Gmail wrote:

Op donderdag 16 februari 2006 11:41, schreef Andreas Jaeger:

...

FYI: We have found some showstoppers and need some more time to fix them, so Beta4 is at least a day late...

First off all: What do you mean with showstoppers? Are these the 'blockers' from the buglist?

The package installation changes, as discussed...

Second: Maybe it is an idea to have, in the future, more time between the beta's so that the time is more flexible. The first roadmap was fast like an Ferrari but now it has to be slowed down to a Lada :P. I see that some blockers are introduced with ZEN, so that is a reason that you could not calculate into she roadmap. But maybe some more time does not hurt.

We always do it this fast for SUSE Linux ... There is no easy way to be slower. ;)

If the beta is finished, and the development is 4 days ahead of the schedule, you have 4 more days for the next beta so that will be ready in time as well even when strange things happen. And if you have 'remaining time' with all releases then you can releases the Final earlier then planned on the roadmap....That's nice to show up in news with insteas of 'had been delayed'

Ciao, Marcus

People have never been aware about the pace it was going. All we saw was a new release every six months or so. Never had anybody witnessed the dirtyness of it all. :-)

That's true, but that is what I wanted to say. It IS open now, and we CAN see it. That means that de press can see it also, and so can bashers. If you have some more time between the beta's (even when that time is only external en the beta is allready finished internal within the planned time) you can clean up the messy-look. No delay-reports because the beta was ready 4 days earlier. Nobody sees the delay between internal finish and the release. All we can see is the delay between the planned finish and the release. The system of planning more time then expected gives the possibility of hiding delays for the public. And 7 days more between beta's is still a fast schedule....

You are abovious not the only ones that has get to get used to this openess. Keep up the good work. You have been doing a great job in the past few years and when I see what is going on behind the scenes, I apreciate it even more.

Copy, paste :D. Development is still fast. First I said it went from Ferrari to Lada, but that is not true. It went from Space Shuttle to Ferrari...slower...but still extremely fast. Azerion

_open_SUSE is not about hiding stuff from the public but to open it to the public. If you don't want to see the delay, you can just download a beta 7 days after it's original release day and no longer read the mailing list thus not seeing short delays any more.

That's a bit true, but then: the roadmap is public so the public sees the delay. And the public does not have to know about delay internal. But okey, endusers never check roadmaps. Idea trashed :-D Azerion

On Thursday 16 February 2006 14:01, houghi wrote:

On Thu, Feb 16, 2006 at 07:58:15PM +0100, Azerion - Gmail wrote:

...

That's a bit true, but then: the roadmap is public so the public sees the delay. And the public does not have to know about delay internal. But okey, endusers never check roadmaps.

<Shocked> What they don't read that? Next ypu are going to tell me the user manual for the users is not read by the users.

houghi

No people actually doesn't understand what they read ;) Mathieu

On Thu, Feb 16, 2006 at 08:08:07PM +0100, Azerion - Gmail wrote:

Did you ever saw you're mother checking a roadmap? 99% of the PC end-users does not even know what a roadmap is...If you ask: what is a manual they will know. You can not compare roadmaps an manuals....

If only they did not look. What people do is complain there is no manual. You need to give them a manual and you send them one. THEN they do not look in the manual even if it tells them on page one where the on/off button is. SIGH! houghi -- Nutze die zeit. Sie ist das Kostbarste was wir haben, denn es ist unwiederbringliche Lebenszeit. Leben ist aber mehr als Wert und Arbeit, und das Sein wichtiger als das tun. Johannes Müller-Elmau

Azerion - Gmail <azerion@gmail.com> writes:

Op donderdag 16 februari 2006 11:41, schreef Andreas Jaeger:

...

FYI: We have found some showstoppers and need some more time to fix them, so Beta4 is at least a day late...

First off all: What do you mean with showstoppers? Are these the 'blockers' from the buglist?

Some of the worst blockers from the buglist: * Installation from physical CD media is not working (network installation works as well as install from the first CD - just the media change is not handled correctly). * If you did an installation from an ftp tree with packages for multiple architectures in it - like the factory tree - sometimes the package for the wrong architecture was choosen.

Second: Maybe it is an idea to have, in the future, more time between the beta's so that the time is more flexible. The first roadmap was fast like an Ferrari but now it has to be slowed down to a Lada :P. I see that some blockers are introduced with ZEN, so that is a reason that you could not calculate into she roadmap. But maybe some more time does not hurt.

We'll do some extra betas until all this has settled down. Beta4 will be a bit rough as seen from the list of "Most Annoying Bugs".

If the beta is finished, and the development is 4 days ahead of the schedule,

That won't happen ;-(

you have 4 more days for the next beta so that will be ready in time as well even when strange things happen. And if you have 'remaining time' with all

We have some puffer in it to make a timely release but sometimes it just does not work.

releases then you can releases the Final earlier then planned on the roadmap....That's nice to show up in news with insteas of 'had been delayed'

We're currently doing weekly betas - and in the past I've been critized because not all of our betas were not published... Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE Linux Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126