[opensuse-factory] compiz suggestion
I haven't heard anyone who got compiz working out of the box with OS 11.1. I would suggest letting the installation delete .conf/compiz. Otherwise it doesn't seem to work at all. Maybe also add the SKIP_CHECKS by default? Erik. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Putrycz, Erik wrote:
I haven't heard anyone who got compiz working out of the box with OS 11.1. I would suggest letting the installation delete .conf/compiz. Otherwise it doesn't seem to work at all. Maybe also add the SKIP_CHECKS by default?
The way I see it the checks would pass if the whitelist was implemented;
otherwise every card I've tried (r200, r300) simply works and does not
come up with any failures or weirdness.
It's a shame this could not be a ship_stopper but it's really annoying
that there are articles that say "Compiz should work out of the box with
opensource drivers!" yet enabling it in Desktop Effects does NOTHING and
never has to my knowledge.
I can't even find the script that *starts* Compiz on a default install,
and one package recommended by most wikis and articles (compiz-kde) was
not installed for me.
I can't believe everyone here uses GNOME and never tested KDE. Half the
Novell guys *ARE* KDE :D
I don't want to file a bug on it because I simply don't have the details
to provide; but anyone who is testing it can see the result, you enable
it, and nothing happens, you start it manually, and the command is missing
that every article provides. Nobody documented HOW you're meant to do it
with openSUSE 11.1 or what the differences are between Ubuntu (which has
the most forum posts on Google for "Compiz problems" none of which have
the solutions that work in SUSE because the implementation is not nearly
the same)
Does someone from Novell want to sit down and try this stuff on their
box, click the button with the Radeon driver sitting there, and work out
why it doesn't work at all, and what is missing, before we ship? Does
someone want to give David Reveman a nudge? :D
--
Matt Sealey
I can't believe everyone here uses GNOME and never tested KDE. Half the Novell guys *ARE* KDE :D
Gnome and Nvidia (official driver) are not working any better. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Putrycz, Erik wrote:
I can't believe everyone here uses GNOME and never tested KDE. Half the Novell guys *ARE* KDE :D
Gnome and Nvidia (official driver) are not working any better.
Does compiz-gnome get installed by default?
--
Matt Sealey
On Wed, 2008-12-03 at 11:19 -0600, Matt Sealey wrote:
I can't even find the script that *starts* Compiz on a default install, and one package recommended by most wikis and articles (compiz-kde) was not installed for me.
that's compiz-manager
--
Rodrigo Moya
Matt Sealey wrote:
I can't even find the script that *starts* Compiz on a default install, and one package recommended by most wikis and articles (compiz-kde) was not installed for me.
That is a sore spot with me as well. Many of us relied on Fusion-Icon to start compiz when we wanted it running and then to stop it when we needed it stopped (like to play a video, or to work with rdesktop in seamless mode, and a host of others that don't do well with compositing) The fusion-icon systray icon provided a very convenient way for users that shy away from the command line and Alt+F2 to switch to and from kwin and between kde and emerald decorations. This is where there is absolutely no consistency at all in the development of KDE4 and the desktop for 11.1. With the staggering amount of resources and effort spent to dumb down konqueror for dolphin so that "it is easier for new users" instead of focusing on bringing KDE4 functionality up to par, you would think that fusion-icon would be a priority since it makes things "easier for new users." But, no. -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E. | openSoftware und SystemEntwicklung Rankin Law Firm, PLLC | Countdown for openSuSE 11.1 www.rankinlawfirm.com | http://counter.opensuse.org/11.1/small -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Tuesday 09 of December 2008, David C. Rankin wrote:
Matt Sealey wrote:
I can't even find the script that *starts* Compiz on a default install, and one package recommended by most wikis and articles (compiz-kde) was not installed for me.
There is no script, the window manager in KDE is launched directly by the session manager, with the command it gets from the window manager during the previous session save (or as 'compiz ccp' on the first launch). See https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=389416 for details. As for the missing package, I can see compiz-kde4 installed with my 11.1 KDE4 install, and if there is such a problem with KDE3, then you should probably report it to Compiz maintainers in bugzilla rathen than just complain here without a result.
That is a sore spot with me as well. Many of us relied on Fusion-Icon to start compiz when we wanted it running and then to stop it when we needed it stopped (like to play a video, or to work with rdesktop in seamless mode, and a host of others that don't do well with compositing) The fusion-icon systray icon provided a very convenient way for users that shy away from the command line and Alt+F2 to switch to and from kwin and between kde and emerald decorations.
This is where there is absolutely no consistency at all in the development of KDE4 and the desktop for 11.1. With the staggering amount of resources and effort spent to dumb down konqueror for dolphin so that "it is easier for new users" instead of focusing on bringing KDE4 functionality up to par, you would think that fusion-icon would be a priority since it makes things "easier for new users." But, no.
There is absolutely no consistency at all in your reasoning: - the development of Dolphin is happening upstream, just like pretty much everything else in KDE4, and has little to do with openSUSE as such. - the default compositing solution in KDE4 is KWin, so if anything in that area with regard to KDE4 is a priority, that's it, and that is also what makes it easier for new users. - Fusion-Icon, as the name suggests, has nothing to do with KDE4, so if you have any problems with it, please report them to its developers - KDE4 has quite a reasonable support for any window/compositing manager that reasonably complies with relevant specifications, and if there is anything missing, it can be added, just like has been already done several times. - So, if you have any specific problems with window/compositing managers that have nothing to do with KDE, again, please discuss it with them. - I think you forgot to blame KDE4 for the global warming or the extinction of dinosaurs. -- Lubos Lunak KDE developer -------------------------------------------------------------- SUSE LINUX, s.r.o. e-mail: l.lunak@suse.cz , l.lunak@kde.org Lihovarska 1060/12 tel: +420 284 028 972 190 00 Prague 9 fax: +420 284 028 951 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 03 December 2008 08:49:01 am Putrycz, Erik wrote:
I haven't heard anyone who got compiz working out of the box with OS 11.1. I would suggest letting the installation delete .conf/compiz. Otherwise it doesn't seem to work at all. Maybe also add the SKIP_CHECKS by default?
Erik.
Add the Compiz XGL repository (Compiz packages without NOMAD patches). sudo zypper ar http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/X11:/XGL/openSUSE_Factory/ Compiz Note: The above one line Update the packages from that XGL Build Service repository: sudo zypper up -t package -r Compiz Switch to runlvl3 sudo init 3 login.. rm -rf ~/.config/compiz sudo init 5 Log back in.. and you should be good.... I also wrote a bit about it here.. http://www.benkevan.com/blog/opensuse-111-compiz-nomad-xrdp/ Good luck. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
rm -rf ~/.config/compiz
I got the compiz with Nomad working but only by deleting these settings. I even tried to delete the gconf settings but for some odd reason gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /apps/compiz doesn't do anything! Anyway once the ~/.config/compiz is deleted, the "Enable desktop effects" did work as expected, which is why I would suggest deleting these settings maybe in the compiz rpm itseft. Erik. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Wednesday 03 December 2008 09:46:29 am Putrycz, Erik wrote:
rm -rf ~/.config/compiz
I got the compiz with Nomad working but only by deleting these settings. I even tried to delete the gconf settings but for some odd reason gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /apps/compiz doesn't do anything! Anyway once the ~/.config/compiz is deleted, the "Enable desktop effects" did work as expected, which is why I would suggest deleting these settings maybe in the compiz rpm itseft.
Erik.
That does nothing for me. Because the GLX option will _NOT_ stay checked. libglx.so is there, and is the version from Compiz, so it should work right? But nope.. It doesn't unless I use non NOMAD version. The reason I believe it is nomad is because I can pull the source for that version, modify the spec files to not apply nomad and it works. Ben -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Ben Kevan wrote:
On Wednesday 03 December 2008 08:49:01 am Putrycz, Erik wrote:
I haven't heard anyone who got compiz working out of the box with OS 11.1. I would suggest letting the installation delete .conf/compiz. Otherwise it doesn't seem to work at all. Maybe also add the SKIP_CHECKS by default?
Erik.
Add the Compiz XGL repository (Compiz packages without NOMAD patches).
sudo zypper ar http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/X11:/XGL/openSUSE_Factory/ Compiz
Note: The above one line
[snip] Well I'll try this on RC2 when I get home and see what happens. I don't see why NOMAD stops it all from working though. As far as I see it the problem is not NOMAD but the default configuration of Compiz as shipped, which is just not "shipped" to support ANY graphics card or driver. Deleting the settings and installing the missing packages (from the standard OSS repo) probably works just as well, but I have not yet found the right ingredients. Also; "Desktop Effects" in the standard Kickoff menu seems to be pretty useless and CCSM doesn't seem installed by default at all (what??) - we're looking at it now working out of the box if you were lucky enough to pick up the OTHER secret, magical box, which is hidden in the tenth dimension. http://wiki.compiz-fusion.org/FAQ#head-69976151c8b6468ee4a3e687557adee42d07f... This little question also happened to me once I installed compiz-kde, isn't this the default setting in SUSE though, or did the new FolderView thing just trash that?
I also wrote a bit about it here..
http://www.benkevan.com/blog/opensuse-111-compiz-nomad-xrdp/
Whee, I'm famous :D
--
Matt Sealey
On Wed, 2008-12-03 at 11:49 -0500, Putrycz, Erik wrote:
I haven't heard anyone who got compiz working out of the box with OS 11.1.
Not only that but the there are no ATI drivers for 11.1 and there is something preventing them from compiling that hasn't been resolved. https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=444912 If you have an ATI card running compiz and do an upgrade to 11.1, you will experience a major "down-grade" with respect to your desktop effects. If the problem with the ATI drivers compiling is on the ATI side then I understand we can't do much about that. If the problem is on the OpenSUSE side then that should be resolved before shipping. If the problem exists for all ATI and Nvidia cards then that is pretty severe (Ship Stop?). -- John Lange www.johnlange.ca -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
John Lange wrote:
On Wed, 2008-12-03 at 11:49 -0500, Putrycz, Erik wrote:
I haven't heard anyone who got compiz working out of the box with OS 11.1.
Not only that but the there are no ATI drivers for 11.1 and there is something preventing them from compiling that hasn't been resolved.
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=444912
If you have an ATI card running compiz and do an upgrade to 11.1, you will experience a major "down-grade" with respect to your desktop effects.
If the problem with the ATI drivers compiling is on the ATI side then I understand we can't do much about that. If the problem is on the OpenSUSE side then that should be resolved before shipping.
If the problem exists for all ATI and Nvidia cards then that is pretty severe (Ship Stop?).
Don't AMD run repos for their drivers for 10.2, 10.3, 11.0 right now?
It wouldn't be a ship stopper just because a 3rd party proprietary vendor
didn't bother to release new drivers packaged for the new OS. And I
wouldn't expect AMD to be building drivers against 11.1 until it hit a
very late RC (now, or what will be RC3 I guess, which will then hit GM, and
then you can but hope..).
As long as you're not tied to Factory and just want the new release, it
might actually be all fine.
Isn't AMD a Novell partner? Or does that only extend to the provision
of servers etc.? Can anyone on openSUSE get a response from the graphics
guys as to the scheduled next ATI driver release will be which supports
11.1?
--
Matt Sealey
On Thu, 2008-12-04 at 14:41 -0600, Matt Sealey wrote:
John Lange wrote:
On Wed, 2008-12-03 at 11:49 -0500, Putrycz, Erik wrote:
I haven't heard anyone who got compiz working out of the box with OS 11.1.
Not only that but the there are no ATI drivers for 11.1 and there is something preventing them from compiling that hasn't been resolved.
https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=444912
If you have an ATI card running compiz and do an upgrade to 11.1, you will experience a major "down-grade" with respect to your desktop effects.
If the problem with the ATI drivers compiling is on the ATI side then I understand we can't do much about that. If the problem is on the OpenSUSE side then that should be resolved before shipping.
If the problem exists for all ATI and Nvidia cards then that is pretty severe (Ship Stop?).
Don't AMD run repos for their drivers for 10.2, 10.3, 11.0 right now?
It wouldn't be a ship stopper just because a 3rd party proprietary vendor didn't bother to release new drivers packaged for the new OS. And I wouldn't expect AMD to be building drivers against 11.1 until it hit a very late RC (now, or what will be RC3 I guess, which will then hit GM, and then you can but hope..).
I guess it's what we've come to expect when you run opensource but I'm getting more and more tired of being a second rate computer citizen. I suppose if you look at it from another perspective; if Novell were to release SLED 11, they likely wouldn't do it until all of the graphics chip makers were lined up and had provided drivers. So in that respect I guess we get what we pay for :| My concern is that regardless of whatever perfectly reasonable explanations there are for these things, its always a frustration for the end users that their graphics cards don't work etc. etc. Sorry, I guess at this point I'm just venting... If you read this far, thanks for listening. - John Lange www.johnlange.ca -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
John Lange wrote:
On Thu, 2008-12-04 at 14:41 -0600, Matt Sealey wrote:
It wouldn't be a ship stopper just because a 3rd party proprietary vendor didn't bother to release new drivers packaged for the new OS. And I wouldn't expect AMD to be building drivers against 11.1 until it hit a very late RC (now, or what will be RC3 I guess, which will then hit GM, and then you can but hope..).
I guess it's what we've come to expect when you run opensource
You must be kidding, right? Don't you remember when Vista was released? There wasn't a decent graphics driver for ANY chipset for a year. It's how it is with all software development where multiple companies try and bring something together at the same time but have different schedules and priorities; some things get left behind.
I suppose if you look at it from another perspective; if Novell were to release SLED 11, they likely wouldn't do it until all of the graphics chip makers were lined up and had provided drivers. So in that respect I guess we get what we pay for :|
Fortunately the free Radeon drivers work great if you're running something lower than an r500. All the X2400 and X3400 owners are out of luck, and need to wait for AMD to do something, but the rest of us can run Compiz all we like. And the nVidia guys.. well.. they really are up the creek.
My concern is that regardless of whatever perfectly reasonable explanations there are for these things, its always a frustration for the end users that their graphics cards don't work etc. etc.
Like I said it's not just because it's Linux.
--
Matt Sealey
On Thu, 2008-12-04 at 23:45 -0600, Matt Sealey wrote:
John Lange wrote:
I guess it's what we've come to expect when you run opensource
You must be kidding, right?
Don't you remember when Vista was released? There wasn't a decent graphics driver for ANY chipset for a year.
No I'm not kidding. I can honestly answer "no" to that question. I've never used vista in my life and so no, I don't remember what it was like "upgrading" to Vista. Interesting that you cite that example though; are we shooting for a user upgrade experience equivalent to Vista?
Fortunately the free Radeon drivers work great if you're running something lower than an r500.
All the X2400 and X3400 owners are out of luck, and need to wait for AMD to do something,
I'm one of those poor bastards. # lspci |grep VGA VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc M76 [Radeon Mobility HD 2600 Series]
but the rest of us can run Compiz all we like. And the nVidia guys.. well.. they really are up the creek.
And apparently there are a large number of Intel video users who are also up the creek.
My concern is that regardless of whatever perfectly reasonable explanations there are for these things, its always a frustration for the end users that their graphics cards don't work etc. etc.
Like I said it's not just because it's Linux.
If OpenSUSE wants to compare itself to something then I think we should be shooting for the Mac experience, not the Vista one. ;) Again, I totally understand that this isn't something that SUSE has much control over but if there can be better coordination between SUSE and the critical driver makers that sure would be nice. John Lange -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Friday 05 December 2008 12:05:06 pm John Lange wrote:
Again, I totally understand that this isn't something that SUSE has much control over but if there can be better coordination between SUSE and the critical driver makers that sure would be nice.
This is still Release Candidate. When GM comes out ATI can do something about 11.1, not before. The problem for opensource is that bleeding edge software makes everybody around it busy, including ATI and Nvidia. I'm sure they have to decide about priorities, just as anybody else. -- Regards, Rajko -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
participants (8)
-
Ben Kevan -
David C. Rankin -
John Lange -
Lubos Lunak -
Matt Sealey -
Putrycz, Erik -
Rajko M. -
Rodrigo Moya