Hi, Am 25.04.2016 um 16:33 schrieb Rainer Klier:

hi all,

thunderbird 45 is out since 2016/04/12. https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/45.0/releasenotes/

does anybody know when it will reach openSUSE? currently latest available version is 38.7.2

The main reason why Thunderbird (and Firefox etc) is updated to more recent versions within an openSUSE distribution is security. Version 45.0 does not have additional important security fixes which aren't in 38.7.2. Therefore up to now there was no reason to update to 45.0. This will change as soon as there are known security issues which won't be fixed in any upcoming 38.x version. Alternatively you can get TB 45 from the mozilla repo already. Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Hi, Em Seg, 2016-04-25 às 16:48 +0200, Wolfgang Rosenauer escreveu:

The main reason why Thunderbird (and Firefox etc) is updated to more recent versions within an openSUSE distribution is security.

Version 45.0 does not have additional important security fixes which aren't in 38.7.2. Therefore up to now there was no reason to update to 45.0. This will change as soon as there are known security issues which won't be fixed in any upcoming 38.x version.

I think this is true for Leap, but what about Tumbleweed? Is there anything preventing to update Thunderbird to the newest version? Regards, --  Ronan Arraes Jardim Chagas -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

On 25.04.2016 22:59, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

Am 25.04.2016 um 18:10 schrieb Ronan Arraes Jardim Chagas:

...

Hi,

Em Seg, 2016-04-25 às 16:48 +0200, Wolfgang Rosenauer escreveu:

...

The main reason why Thunderbird (and Firefox etc) is updated to more recent versions within an openSUSE distribution is security.

Version 45.0 does not have additional important security fixes which aren't in 38.7.2. Therefore up to now there was no reason to update to 45.0. This will change as soon as there are known security issues which won't be fixed in any upcoming 38.x version.

I think this is true for Leap, but what about Tumbleweed? Is there anything preventing to update Thunderbird to the newest version?

The version argument does not apply for Tumbleweed. But for Tumbleweed there are build issues I haven't sorted out yet. Thunderbird 45 does not build for TW at the moment.

Wolfgang

Phew. I almost sent a disgruntled answer to your previous email about pointlessness of "security" hold ups in supposedly rolling releases until that one came. The idea of such big and important software being artificially frozen by distribution all while Mozilla buries the remains of its credibility is genuinely unsettling. Also, I use my own FF and TB builds and while FF build may have significant changes, TB's spec is changed mostly to link against system libraries as much as possible. Shouldn't official openSUSE's FF and TB builds try to do the same ? It's bad enough that both of them`ship with a copy of fat libxul.so and both try to duplicate SIP-client functionality badly.

On 26.04.2016 00:37, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

Am 25.04.2016 um 20:27 schrieb Sergey Kondakov:

...

On 25.04.2016 22:59, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

...

The version argument does not apply for Tumbleweed. But for Tumbleweed there are build issues I haven't sorted out yet. Thunderbird 45 does not build for TW at the moment.

Phew. I almost sent a disgruntled answer to your previous email about pointlessness of "security" hold ups in supposedly rolling releases until that one came. The idea of such big and important software being artificially frozen by distribution all while Mozilla buries the remains of its credibility is genuinely unsettling.

Also, I use my own FF and TB builds and while FF build may have significant changes, TB's spec is changed mostly to link against system libraries as much as possible. Shouldn't official openSUSE's FF and TB builds try to do the same ? It's bad enough that both of them`ship with a copy of fat libxul.so and both try to duplicate SIP-client functionality badly.

There were long times I tried to do something like this. We shipped Firefox on top of xulrunner for quite some time. The plan was to ship Thunderbird on top of xulrunner as well. There were times we had system cairo, system-a and system-b and whatnot. All it caused was build issues to fix, strange bugs only happening on openSUSE and so on. On major Firefox updates we needed to switch back to FF provided libs again because we couldn't update system libs as easy as Firefox. I probably can point to many more examples if I let pass by the last 16 years. At some point I stopped for most dependencies because it's one thing: just not worth it.

Wolfgang

I'm using FF and TB with pretty much all system libs options _except xulrunner_ for about 2 years now (13.2 and Tumbleweed) and it works fine. BUT I had to patch libpng with apng patch and add 2 feature options to sqlite which were missing in openSUSE builds until recently. xulrunner is another story though, googling around Mozilla's bugzilla revealed that Mozilla's official policy is to keep xulrunner's code for FF, TB and standalone out of sync which makes changes of them both linking to it minimal. The only time FF crashed on me is because of its xrender and skia rendering code, so now I use cairo azure backend with forced acceleration and disabled xrender which has nothing to do with system libs. It does plenty of screw ups with gtk3 UI (plainly sucks) and EGL (hardcoded for mobiles) though.

Am Montag 25 April 2016, 16:48:34 schrieb Wolfgang Rosenauer:

Hi,

Am 25.04.2016 um 16:33 schrieb Rainer Klier:

...

hi all,

thunderbird 45 is out since 2016/04/12. https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/45.0/releasenotes/

does anybody know when it will reach openSUSE? currently latest available version is 38.7.2

The main reason why Thunderbird (and Firefox etc) is updated to more recent versions within an openSUSE distribution is security.

Version 45.0 does not have additional important security fixes which aren't in 38.7.2. Therefore up to now there was no reason to update to 45.0.

so what do I do when the thunderbird addons I use get updated and the new version requires the current Thunderbird? I can't help but think that policies like this one, while there definitely is a valid point to them, have more drawbacks than advantages to people who actually use the software... Cheers MH -- gpg key fingerprint: 5F64 4C92 9B77 DE37 D184 C5F9 B013 44E7 27BD 763C -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

On 04/26/2016 03:27 AM, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

Hi,

Am 26.04.2016 um 09:14 schrieb Mathias Homann:

...

Am Montag 25 April 2016, 16:48:34 schrieb Wolfgang Rosenauer:

...

Hi,

Am 25.04.2016 um 16:33 schrieb Rainer Klier:

...

hi all,

thunderbird 45 is out since 2016/04/12. https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/45.0/releasenotes/

does anybody know when it will reach openSUSE? currently latest available version is 38.7.2

The main reason why Thunderbird (and Firefox etc) is updated to more recent versions within an openSUSE distribution is security.

Version 45.0 does not have additional important security fixes which aren't in 38.7.2. Therefore up to now there was no reason to update to 45.0.

so what do I do when the thunderbird addons I use get updated and the new version requires the current Thunderbird?

I can't help but think that policies like this one, while there definitely is a valid point to them, have more drawbacks than advantages to people who actually use the software...

Guys, did you read my mail really? Those policies are in place to help users to not break their system. In the past those policies were quite strict but in case of Firefox and Thunderbird they are quite loose meanwhile. And this is only about 13.2 and 42.1. We are even talking on -factory here. So the reason why Thunderbird 45 is not in Factory/Tumbleweed yet because it does not build on i586 currently. Just help fixing it

The important message in my above mail was: As long as there are official, secure Thunderbird 38.x releases there is no need to upgrade and as long as those are available I guess that 99,9% of all available addons for TB will still work. In any case we are talking about 0-2 more TB releases which I estimate for 38.x before we need to go to 45.x anyway.

Wolfgang

Lock your version of Thunderbird in Yast so that it does not update. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Hi, Am 27.04.2016 um 08:19 schrieb cagsm:

tb 45 no sec updates? what do you mean? i see plenty of red and orange at: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/security/known-vulnerabilities/thunderbird/

tb 45 not important? please explain. thanks.

if you don't trust me, I cannot help. There are a lot of people who know better than I apparently. Can you please step up and do what I apparently cannot? If you would have read the site you are referring to sightly better you would have seen that 38.7 and 45.0 carry almost the same set of security fixes. The "almost" just comes from the fact that 45.0 probably had additional ones which were no problem in 38.x. If I wouldn't get useless questions I could actually work on something like trying to make 45.0 compile on TW/i586. (But actually I need to get out FF46 first because this more important right now.) Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am 27.04.2016 um 08:50 schrieb cagsm:

On Wed, Apr 27, 2016 at 8:41 AM, Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

...

Am 27.04.2016 um 08:19 schrieb cagsm:

...

tb 45 no sec updates? what do you mean? i see plenty of red and orange at: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/security/known-vulnerabilities/thunderbird/

tb 45 not important? please explain. thanks.

if you don't trust me, I cannot help.

Didnt mean to upset you or something. I was only wondering as on that mozilla overview page on security they didnt speak about 38.x any more but about 45

This is how it works at Mozilla. Basically the same for Firefox and Thunderbird: 38.7 = 45.0; 38.8 = 45.1 = 46; from a security perspective. Those versions are usually released at around the same time containing the same set of security fixes. Use any of the MFSA's you see on this site like https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/security/advisories/mfsa2016-27/ Fixed in: Firefox 45 Firefox ESR 38.7 Thunderbird 38.7 Thunderbird 45 and you see what I mean.

Are you the suse maintainer of Firefox 46 as well? Thanks for your work.

Yes and thanks. I'm busy with the next release round right now and facing more and more difficulties to keep the stuff working on TW and especially i586. That's why I'm a bit under pressure right now. Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am 2016-04-27 um 08:59 schrieb Wolfgang Rosenauer:

...

Are you the suse maintainer of Firefox 46 as well? Thanks for your work.

Yes and thanks. I'm busy with the next release round right now and facing more and more difficulties to keep the stuff working on TW and especially i586. That's why I'm a bit under pressure right now.

it seems that you solved the problems. because i just installed FF 46 and TB 45 from http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/mozilla/openSUSE_Tumbleweed thanks a lot. but am i right in the assumption that despite the "official" FF 46 from mozilla.org your FF 46 build does not use/support GTK3 yet? -- Best Regards | Freundliche Grüße | Cordialement | Cordiali Saluti | *DI Rainer Klier* Research & Development, Technical Sales Consultant Namirial GmbH -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am 27.04.2016 um 17:47 schrieb Rainer Klier:

but am i right in the assumption that despite the "official" FF 46 from mozilla.org your FF 46 build does not use/support GTK3 yet?

There was a mail on the openSUSE lists some days ago: https://en.opensuse.org/Firefox-gtk3 Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am 2016-04-28 um 15:45 schrieb Bjoern Voigt:

Wolfgang Rosenauer wrote:

...

Am 27.04.2016 um 17:47 schrieb Rainer Klier:

...

but am i right in the assumption that despite the "official" FF 46 from mozilla.org your FF 46 build does not use/support GTK3 yet? There was a mail on the openSUSE lists some days ago: https://en.opensuse.org/Firefox-gtk3 I installed the Firefox-GTK3 version from the repository and found no errors so far.

it does not really work for me. it does not crash, but on system dialogs textinput boxes and buttons don't have a border. very strange. i can observe the same behaviour with the latest nvidia-settings utility from the binary nvidia driver from http://www.nvidia.com/download/driverResults.aspx/101818/en-us but as i am not needing this tool frequently i don't care. and when selecting text the highlighting does not work, i can't see what is selected. as both programs have the same GUI problems, i think they come from GTK3. and as the CPU acceleration (as described in https://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/software/desktop-linux/867667-firefox-...) also does not work with this gtk3 firefox version, it has no benefit for me. reverting back to GTK2 version from mozilla repo. -- Best Regards | Freundliche Grüße | Cordialement | Cordiali Saluti | *DI Rainer Klier* Research & Development, Technical Sales Consultant Namirial GmbH -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am 2016-05-02 um 14:05 schrieb Robert Kaiser:

Rainer Klier schrieb:

...

it does not crash, but on system dialogs textinput boxes and buttons don't have a border. very strange.

Possibly related to the issues related to GTK 3.20 CSS Node stuff, see https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1234158 and dependencies.

i think the origin of this bug lies somewhere in GTK or in gtk applications running on KDE. because the gtk3-based nvidia settings application has the same problems. and as there are many gtk-warnings regarding gtk.css when starting nvidia-settings, it may really be related to each other. -- Best Regards | Freundliche Grüße | Cordialement | Cordiali Saluti | *DI Rainer Klier* Research & Development, Technical Sales Consultant Namirial GmbH -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org