On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 7:16 AM, Rajko M. <rmatov101@charter.net> wrote:

On Sunday 31 August 2008 04:11:19 pm Alexey Eremenko wrote:

...

Well, seriously, removing KDE 3.x means pissing on a lot of Susers.

Removing it will do nothing good to the distro. Except it will leave a lot of users angry.

Is that the same Alexey that is pushing Contrib repository?

Yes, same one :)

If yes, can you tell me any practical difference between community created software in OBS and Novell/openSUSE DVD. Practical difference is something that makes software better, not some word "official" without any reference why one should consider OBS lesser official than some other source.

OBS is made for "extra" or "community" packages. "contrib" specifically was started because community people want to include packages into the distro, but Novell doesn't provides such a way. It is here to fill that hole. I strongly feel that KDE3 belongs to the "core", not to the "extras", which is why I trying to make sure it stays on the install DVD. KDE3 is my main production desktop, and likely to stay so.

What will be the same: Source code from KDE. Developers that build KDE.

What will be different: KDE3 missing on DVD created and distributed by Novell.

Difference is huge. It is like using Linux distro vs. compiling Linux-from-scratch. People want to have basic functionality available by default. KDE3 is such basic functionality. For me having no KDE3 equals having no GUI at all. (because it is the only GUI, that is considered "usable") I believe that others feel the same way. Would you use openSUSE, if it had no GUI at all ? Or if you had to download GUI from some third-party repository ? KDE4, GNOME, XFCE, whatever - is not for me. KDE4 feels totally alien to KDE3 users, but I already said so earlier. KDE4 feels like having another GNOME, and forcing it upon KDE users. KDE4 might be nice for GNOME users, but not for KDE3 users. Actually if you look into this discussion, then it reminds strongly "Desktop Environment Wars". KDE3 and KDE4 are _totally different_ desktops, having nothing in common. This is why openSUSE 11.0 decision to make them equal is right decision. It would be good idea to keep status-quo until good decision is found, that makes users of KDE3 happy. Currently we, KDE3 users, have nowhere to migrate. We feel trapped. (which causes anger, frustration and sentences like: "I would move to Kubuntu" from someone earlier in this topic) Good news: I had conversation with Dirk, openSUSE KDE4 maintainer, and I shown him many of the problems, and filled appropriate bug reports, so we may have a hope to solve them eventually, but not in 11.1.

Any business oriented guy will see this as opportunity, a gift from Novell. If demand is so huge as reactions on this list, than whoever jumps in will make a money. But better hurry, KDE3 madness will not last for a long. Kids that learn about Linux right now will grow with KDE4 and shape the future, not chew the past.

And you know such business oriented guys ? -- -Alexey Eromenko "Technologov" --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org