[opensuse-factory] EOL feature
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, I'm seeing several people asking (forums) why their 11.2 is now complaining about problems connecting to repos, or not being able to update their machines. I know the reason, but couldn't somebody design a feature that tells the user of their system that support is about to finish, or finished already? Add it to package kit or zypper or YaST. Or all. Perhaps there is time enough to add the feature to factory, for this release? - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAk3f+vgACgkQtTMYHG2NR9VaWACeNKAQToOWmMBalnsMNxMMVIF0 G8EAn1tftzK1Vab/g0a8+X7vUhqbU6NZ =4x4g -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
The mirrors are still out there. I don't understand why we need to break people's package managers after a certain time. Sure its EOL, sure it's not suggested to use, etc, etc. But why do we need to break people's package managers? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Le 27/05/2011 22:06, Andrew Joakimsen a écrit :
Sure its EOL, sure it's not suggested to use, etc, etc. But why do we need to break people's package managers?
symlink the old URL and the new? jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://www.youtube.com/user/jdddodinorg http://jdd.blip.tv/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 05/27/2011 10:26 PM, jdd wrote:
Le 27/05/2011 22:06, Andrew Joakimsen a écrit :
Sure its EOL, sure it's not suggested to use, etc, etc. But why do we need to break people's package managers?
symlink the old URL and the new?
jdd
Unfortunately, there's only one mirror keeping the old version. Only one way, more communication about it. Was on opensuse-security, on -project, on lizards, but seems insufficient. -- Bruno Friedmann Ioda-Net Sàrl www.ioda-net.ch openSUSE Member & Ambassador GPG KEY : D5C9B751C4653227 irc: tigerfoot -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Fri, 2011-05-27 at 22:33 +0200, Bruno Friedmann wrote:
On 05/27/2011 10:26 PM, jdd wrote:
Le 27/05/2011 22:06, Andrew Joakimsen a écrit :
Sure its EOL, sure it's not suggested to use, etc, etc. But why do we need to break people's package managers?
symlink the old URL and the new?
jdd
Unfortunately, there's only one mirror keeping the old version.
Only one way, more communication about it. Was on opensuse-security, on -project, on lizards, but seems insufficient.
And I dropped the ball on getting an article written up on news.o.o which would have propogated over to Forums. Mea culpa! But that doesn't solve the problem completely, because there are users for sure who do not follow the news of openSUSE in any of its various forms. I was a user of openSUSE for several years before I even began to get involved in the community and read the news about openSUSE stuff. So, any news article will not reach all users. The idea of a warning system of some kind as the current version nears EOL is an interesting idea, but there's going to have to be a way to do it without freaking out a user who panics at the sight of any warning or suspects this must be malware (on Windows, this is the kind of warning that malware thrives on.) The warning method would have to be "disable-able" too for administrators if openSUSE is deployed in large environments or support staff will get inundated with needless calls from panicked workers when they already know and have a plan for migration. :-) Bryen -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
The idea of a warning system of some kind as the current version nears EOL is an interesting idea, but there's going to have to be a way to do it without freaking out a user who panics at the sight of any warning or suspects this must be malware (on Windows, this is the kind of warning that malware thrives on.)
The warning method would have to be "disable-able" too for administrators if openSUSE is deployed in large environments or support staff will get inundated with needless calls from panicked workers when they already know and have a plan for migration. :-)
Maybe I think of it a little bit too simplistic, but what about something like this: Before we get any release EOL, we publish a last / final 'security' update for aaa_base with a 'license' text, that is actually an announcement of EOL of any given release. We could even go as far and suggest to keep a 'repository' alive for the last two EOL products, containing only meta data and the 'security' update to aaa_base, for not to have any time a user dropping out into package manager / repository issues. * aaa_base of course can be replaced with any other package we ensure is there... but it should be something deep enough, which users do not fiddle with. So surely not any kernel... they tend to be replaced :) Maybe even a system like on SLE (sorry to bring it up :) ) but there is a bunch of scripts supporting the move forward to newer service packs for example. And generally those updater scripts are pushed as update, containing descriptive text what to do next. It would help us get the users updated to the next releases. Dominique -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 11:31:15PM +0200, Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
The idea of a warning system of some kind as the current version nears EOL is an interesting idea, but there's going to have to be a way to do it without freaking out a user who panics at the sight of any warning or suspects this must be malware (on Windows, this is the kind of warning that malware thrives on.)
The warning method would have to be "disable-able" too for administrators if openSUSE is deployed in large environments or support staff will get inundated with needless calls from panicked workers when they already know and have a plan for migration. :-)
Maybe I think of it a little bit too simplistic, but what about something like this:
Before we get any release EOL, we publish a last / final 'security' update for aaa_base with a 'license' text, that is actually an announcement of EOL of any given release.
We could even go as far and suggest to keep a 'repository' alive for the last two EOL products, containing only meta data and the 'security' update to aaa_base, for not to have any time a user dropping out into package manager / repository issues.
* aaa_base of course can be replaced with any other package we ensure is there... but it should be something deep enough, which users do not fiddle with. So surely not any kernel... they tend to be replaced :)
Maybe even a system like on SLE (sorry to bring it up :) ) but there is a bunch of scripts supporting the move forward to newer service packs for example. And generally those updater scripts are pushed as update, containing descriptive text what to do next. It would help us get the users updated to the next releases.
We did this previously (some releases ago), but the message display code is no longer there. We have post-update messages still, but... ... PackageKit and its updaters I think do not show them, so they are quite useless. Btw, the 11.2 update repo is still there, just the lots of buildservice repositories for 11.2 are gone, as Adrian just removed on the EOL day are the issue I guess. Ciao, Marcus -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Hello, on Freitag, 27. Mai 2011, Marcus Meissner wrote:
On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 11:31:15PM +0200, Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
Before we get any release EOL, we publish a last / final 'security' update for aaa_base with a 'license' text, that is actually an announcement of EOL of any given release.
We did this previously (some releases ago), but the message display code is no longer there.
We have post-update messages still, but... ... PackageKit and its updaters I think do not show them, so they are quite useless.
Did someone say that you should use post-update messages? ;-) PackageKit can display license texts - so IMHO the way to go is to provide an update for aaa_base with an EOL message as license. (I know that a EOL warning is, strictly speaking, not a license - but hey, we are searching for working solutions, not for 100% name compliance ;-)
Btw, the 11.2 update repo is still there,
The 11.1 repos are also still there, but the update repo come with a little problem. (This problem probably also exists for 11.2.) The update repos contain an expiration date to avoid that someone who uses a mirror directly (without download.o.o) doesn't notice if this mirror doesn't update the repo anymore (which could even be used by attackers to keep security holes open). The expiration date is a good idea to prevent "outdated mirror attacks", and I don't want to miss it. The problem is that this expiration date is no longer updated for 11.1 - which is somehow understandable, but also annoying when using evergreen. My daily update notificaton [1] sends me a warning every day that the 11.1 update repo is outdated :-/ And I don't want to remove the 11.1 update repo - otherwise when installing a new package, I could get a non-patched package that got an "official" security update, but not an evergreen update. The question is: how can we solve this? The easiest way is to regularly update the expiration date in the 11.1 update repo metadata. Just re-enable the script that did this while 11.1 was supported ;-) A more complex way (probably only for future releases) would be to have something in the evergreen repo metadata that can supress the "outdated repo" warning for the $version update repo. An alternative (and more secure) way would be a zypper config option that can selectively supress error messages ("supress 'outdated repo' warning for the 12.1-update repo"). Oh, there's a third way: allow evergreen to publish the updates in the official 11.1 update repos. And: Yes, I'm aware that some of my ideas might not be what the security team likes ;-) Regards, Christian Boltz [1] you probably know patch2mail ;-) BTW: the current version in home:cboltz also lists package updates by default to follow the update notification behaviour in 11.4. I did not update the factory package yet. -- Lies halt mal dclp.*, da faellt dir nix mehr ein. Wenn man ein Guerteltier ueber die Tastatur abrollt, kommt besserer PHP Code raus als da gepostet wird. [R. Huebenthal in darw] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-05-29 20:07, Christian Boltz wrote:
Oh, there's a third way: allow evergreen to publish the updates in the official 11.1 update repos.
Use a different update repo. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk3i8bQACgkQtTMYHG2NR9VOMACeJ22TDS3mVIELLVI9thM+kVNP crUAn2oY99YyRy87wuxmi843xn+OWMLk =NZKm -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-05-27 22:37, Bryen M. Yunashko wrote:
Only one way, more communication about it. Was on opensuse-security, on -project, on lizards, but seems insufficient.
And I dropped the ball on getting an article written up on news.o.o which would have propogated over to Forums. Mea culpa!
But that doesn't solve the problem completely, because there are users for sure who do not follow the news of openSUSE in any of its various forms. I was a user of openSUSE for several years before I even began to get involved in the community and read the news about openSUSE stuff. So, any news article will not reach all users.
Exactly.
The idea of a warning system of some kind as the current version nears EOL is an interesting idea, but there's going to have to be a way to do it without freaking out a user who panics at the sight of any warning or suspects this must be malware (on Windows, this is the kind of warning that malware thrives on.)
They are already freaking when package kit complains several times per hour with a popup complaining that it con not reach a repository. If we know that local email to root works on all systems, that would be enough. But to all users, perhaps. Ahhh! My system is spamming me! :-P
The warning method would have to be "disable-able" too for administrators if openSUSE is deployed in large environments or support staff will get inundated with needless calls from panicked workers when they already know and have a plan for migration. :-)
Yes, absolutely. And it should mention how to disable the package kit applet and where to get further info, like an EOL link that is created at the appropriate time with info on how to upgrade, where to get help, etc. The packagekit applet that is already pesking us could do this job. It could trigger on a date, then check for existence of the EOL link at opensuse.org, then not check for repos, or do and do not complain, and post the info to the user, who then can click on R&U, go away. If that is not possible, a weekly cron job, a script. Thus easy to disable. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk3gPC4ACgkQtTMYHG2NR9WaSwCbBpqRAzjJaGpjnqr6A5Lo1NTg 3NEAnjfKWJliEHbPl+R7Esq5na03U0Td =n4B8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-05-27 22:33, Bruno Friedmann wrote:
Only one way, more communication about it. Was on opensuse-security, on -project, on lizards, but seems insufficient.
All that communication is useless if the users do not read any of those, just use the system. Suddently updates fail, the packagekit applet starts complaining every 15 minutes with a popup. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk3gNtMACgkQtTMYHG2NR9UnEwCfWxbf/pqPlRlKyuX8owmTnW1S jaYAnA5HRRJS/lecEvbNe492xUxdGpYD =K5oW -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-05-27 22:06, Andrew Joakimsen wrote:
The mirrors are still out there. I don't understand why we need to break people's package managers after a certain time.
Sure its EOL, sure it's not suggested to use, etc, etc. But why do we need to break people's package managers?
The package managers are already broken. The packagekit applet is complaining here about every 15 minutes that it could not connect to a software source. I had to do: mv /usr/sbin/packagekitd /usr/sbin/packagekitd.noquiero to stop that nonsense. Look how many repos fail for me: Telcontar:~ # zypper refresh Repository 'NVIDIA Repository' is up to date. Download (curl) error for 'http://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/linux/misc/packman/suse/11.2/repodata/repomd.xml': Error code: User abort Error message: connect() timed out! Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'Packman Repository': Download (curl) error for 'http://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/linux/misc/packman/suse/11.2/repodata/repomd.xml': Error code: User abort Error message: connect() timed out! Skipping repository 'Packman Repository' because of the above error. Repository 'Google Talk Plugin' is up to date. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/plater/openSUSE_11.2/' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: home: Dave Plater': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/plater/openSUSE_11.2/' Skipping repository 'OBS: home: Dave Plater' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/server:/database/openSUSE_11.2/' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: Database': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/server:/database/openSUSE_11.2/' Skipping repository 'OBS: Database' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/KDE3/openSUSE_11.2/' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: KDE: KDE3': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/KDE3/openSUSE_11.2/' Skipping repository 'OBS: KDE: KDE3' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/UpdatedApps/openSUSE_11.2' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: KDE: UpdatedApps': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/UpdatedApps/openSUSE_11.2' Skipping repository 'OBS: KDE: UpdatedApps' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE%3a/Tools/openSUSE_11.2' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: oS: tools': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE%3a/Tools/openSUSE_11.2' Skipping repository 'OBS: oS: tools' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/OpenOffice.org%3a/STABLE/openSUSE_...' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: OpenOffice.org': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/OpenOffice.org%3a/STABLE/openSUSE_...' Skipping repository 'OBS: OpenOffice.org' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE:/11.2:/Contrib/standard' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: Contrib/standard': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE:/11.2:/Contrib/standard' Skipping repository 'OBS: Contrib/standard' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/games/openSUSE_11.2/' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: games': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/games/openSUSE_11.2/' Skipping repository 'OBS: games' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/hamradio/openSUSE_11.2' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: hamradio': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/hamradio/openSUSE_11.2' Skipping repository 'OBS: hamradio' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...' Skipping repository 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP (update)': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...' Skipping repository 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP (update)' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/science/openSUSE_11.2/' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: science': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/science/openSUSE_11.2/' Skipping repository 'OBS: science' because of the above error. Retrieving repository 'OBS: server: mail' metadata [done] Building repository 'OBS: server: mail' cache [done] File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/drivers:/webcam/openSUSE_11.2/' Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: Drivers for webcams': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/drivers:/webcam/openSUSE_11.2/' Skipping repository 'OBS: Drivers for webcams' because of the above error. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Source' is up to date. Repository 'libdvdcss repository' is up to date. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Non-Oss' is up to date. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Oss' is up to date. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Update' is up to date. Some of the repositories have not been refreshed because of an error. Telcontar:~ # - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk3gOWoACgkQtTMYHG2NR9V+yACfSrA1PwrTCGnTdVuNQSqtrMgB qv0AmwcQnODdpgRyO6Uw8DrE58WBk7sK =WkzD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On 2011-05-27 22:06, Andrew Joakimsen wrote:
The mirrors are still out there. I don't understand why we need to break people's package managers after a certain time.
Sure its EOL, sure it's not suggested to use, etc, etc. But why do we need to break people's package managers?
The package managers aren't broken... what seems to be broken is users failing to understand that the product is EOL and those repositories are supressed. Let's be realistic with a quick example... look carefully at the repositories which you pasted... they are either mirrors or private repositories... repositories that the user added... Now, the package manager is broken if the repositories aren't there? I'm sorry but I have some trouble understanding... But going further... Lets see things as they are... Keeping a repository alive over the life cycle costs resources (maybe needed by other projects which probably would deliever more value to the distribution), they cost man power to maintain (are you jumping forward to maintain them or just nagging about the fact they might be gone?).... Maintaining those repo's does involves heavy costs... lets be honest... for how many users? So far you failed to say if those reports are from 2 or 2.000.000 users.... Well if we're talking about 2.000.000 users, then we should probably look deeper into it... if we're talking about two users or less than 1% of the users.... the answer is simple, upgrade! Now for a change, what could be pretty much done easilly was the following to cover the communication problems and make sure users see the EOL message: 1. Add a EOL message to the YaST installer, make it very visible stating when that product terminates. 2. One month before the EOL add a small package which will force that any sessioned login on a console will print out: "This product life cycle finishes on $DATE. PLEASE UPGRADE!" 3. Add into the main page of openSUSE the following: + openSUSE 11.2 is no longer supported: + with 1 trillion downloads; + with 1 trillion bugs fixed; + with 1 trillion happy users which are now running openSUSE 11.4! + openSUSE 11.1 is no longer supported: + bla bla bla + bla bla bla And that's pretty much it... But just to continue being an a$$, please quantify the real number of users which have putted up such issue, so that we can see what is really happening... so far they can 2 or 2.000.000... being a bit more precise would help. Yet another unusefull contribution.
The package managers are already broken. The packagekit applet is complaining here about every 15 minutes that it could not connect to a software source.
I had to do:
mv /usr/sbin/packagekitd /usr/sbin/packagekitd.noquiero
to stop that nonsense.
Look how many repos fail for me:
Telcontar:~ # zypper refresh Repository 'NVIDIA Repository' is up to date. Download (curl) error for 'http://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/linux/misc/packman/suse/11.2/repodata/repomd.xml': Error code: User abort Error message: connect() timed out!
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'Packman Repository': Download (curl) error for 'http://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/linux/misc/packman/suse/11.2/repodata/repomd.xml': Error code: User abort Error message: connect() timed out!
Skipping repository 'Packman Repository' because of the above error. Repository 'Google Talk Plugin' is up to date. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/plater/openSUSE_11.2/'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: home: Dave Plater': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/plater/openSUSE_11.2/'
Skipping repository 'OBS: home: Dave Plater' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/server:/database/openSUSE_11.2/'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: Database': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/server:/database/openSUSE_11.2/'
Skipping repository 'OBS: Database' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/KDE3/openSUSE_11.2/'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: KDE: KDE3': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/KDE3/openSUSE_11.2/'
Skipping repository 'OBS: KDE: KDE3' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/UpdatedApps/openSUSE_11.2'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: KDE: UpdatedApps': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/UpdatedApps/openSUSE_11.2'
Skipping repository 'OBS: KDE: UpdatedApps' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE%3a/Tools/openSUSE_11.2'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: oS: tools': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE%3a/Tools/openSUSE_11.2'
Skipping repository 'OBS: oS: tools' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/OpenOffice.org%3a/STABLE/openSUSE_...'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: OpenOffice.org': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/OpenOffice.org%3a/STABLE/openSUSE_...'
Skipping repository 'OBS: OpenOffice.org' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE:/11.2:/Contrib/standard'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: Contrib/standard': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/openSUSE:/11.2:/Contrib/standard'
Skipping repository 'OBS: Contrib/standard' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/games/openSUSE_11.2/'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: games': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/games/openSUSE_11.2/'
Skipping repository 'OBS: games' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/hamradio/openSUSE_11.2'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: hamradio': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/hamradio/openSUSE_11.2'
Skipping repository 'OBS: hamradio' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...'
Skipping repository 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP (update)': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/multimedia:/audio:/KMP/openSUSE_11...'
Skipping repository 'OBS: multimedia: audio: KMP (update)' because of the above error. File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/science/openSUSE_11.2/'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: science': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/science/openSUSE_11.2/'
Skipping repository 'OBS: science' because of the above error. Retrieving repository 'OBS: server: mail' metadata [done] Building repository 'OBS: server: mail' cache [done] File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/drivers:/webcam/openSUSE_11.2/'
Abort, retry, ignore? [a/r/i/?] (a): i Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: Drivers for webcams': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/drivers:/webcam/openSUSE_11.2/'
Skipping repository 'OBS: Drivers for webcams' because of the above error. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Source' is up to date. Repository 'libdvdcss repository' is up to date. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Non-Oss' is up to date. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Oss' is up to date. Repository 'openSUSE-11.2-Update' is up to date. Some of the repositories have not been refreshed because of an error. Telcontar:~ #
- -- Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/
iEYEARECAAYFAk3gOWoACgkQtTMYHG2NR9V+yACfSrA1PwrTCGnTdVuNQSqtrMgB qv0AmwcQnODdpgRyO6Uw8DrE58WBk7sK =WkzD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-- Nelson Marques /* As cicatrizes lembram-nos de onde estivemos, mas não ditam para onde vamos */ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-05-28 02:59, Nelson Marques wrote:
On 2011-05-27 22:06, Andrew Joakimsen wrote:
I'm sorry but I have some trouble understanding...
Then please read the first post. That is not the problem I was talking about.
But going further... Lets see things as they are... Keeping a repository alive over the life cycle costs resources (maybe needed by
I was not requesting that, either. You are misunderstanding the issue.
Now for a change, what could be pretty much done easilly was the following to cover the communication problems and make sure users see the EOL message:
1. Add a EOL message to the YaST installer, make it very visible stating when that product terminates.
Useless. The people using the machine after EOL may not be the same person that installed the machine.
2. One month before the EOL add a small package which will force that any sessioned login on a console will print out: "This product life cycle finishes on $DATE. PLEASE UPGRADE!"
Interesting, but many users don't use the console.
3. Add into the main page of openSUSE the following:
Many users do not check that webpage, till they have problems or want something.
And that's pretty much it... But just to continue being an a$$, please quantify the real number of users which have putted up such issue, so that we can see what is really happening... so far they can 2 or 2.000.000... being a bit more precise would help.
Several on the forums. I haven't counted them. :-) Which is a percent, others don't know there is a forum. Even less a mail list. :-P - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk3gVTEACgkQtTMYHG2NR9U09gCgmKZoRouxjPShdsyKSN8SqjKp VawAn0puu2GVc85iGYyp6wBViO0jxdfJ =k/j4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 21:39, Carlos E. R. <carlos.e.r@opensuse.org> wrote:
I just posted that long list to show that users do indeed get non working repos, contrary to what Andrew said.
I never said user's don't always get working repos, actually what I mean by "breaking the package manager" is exactly that. The package manager works perfectly fine until one day *poof* something is done on the server and any action you try to take in your package manager fails. IMO that's broken. On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 20:59, Nelson Marques <nmo.marques@gmail.com> wrote:
2. One month before the EOL add a small package which will force that any sessioned login on a console will print out: "This product life cycle finishes on $DATE. PLEASE UPGRADE!"
This mentality is why we have this issue to begin with. Just because there will be no future development work on a particular distribution doesn't mean there are users that still use it, are happy with it and have no compelling reason to upgrade. Now, I still see 11.1 repos on widehat.opensuse.org and download.opensuse.org so I don't understand what the issue is. If a 3rd party deleted their repo, that's beyond our control. -- Med Vennlig Hilsen, A. Helge Joakimsen -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-05-28 04:55, Andrew Joakimsen wrote:
On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 21:39, Carlos E. R. <> wrote:
I just posted that long list to show that users do indeed get non working repos, contrary to what Andrew said.
I never said user's don't always get working repos, actually what I mean by "breaking the package manager" is exactly that. The package manager works perfectly fine until one day *poof* something is done on the server and any action you try to take in your package manager fails. IMO that's broken.
Ah, ok.
On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 20:59, Nelson Marques <> wrote:
2. One month before the EOL add a small package which will force that any sessioned login on a console will print out: "This product life cycle finishes on $DATE. PLEASE UPGRADE!"
This mentality is why we have this issue to begin with. Just because there will be no future development work on a particular distribution doesn't mean there are users that still use it, are happy with it and have no compelling reason to upgrade.
Yes, it happens a lot. I'm still using it, till I have time to upgrade. 11.4 had a lot of issues, many unsolved yet. An openSUSE version is at its best several months after release... and then it is removed.
Now, I still see 11.1 repos on widehat.opensuse.org and download.opensuse.org so I don't understand what the issue is. If a 3rd party deleted their repo, that's beyond our control.
No complaining with that. But there are users out there that simply are not aware that a version is EOL and don't understand why the updater is failing suddenly on several repos. The updater could be clever and warn the user that the version is EOL. The updater could simply check for existence of, for example, "http://opensuse.org/EOL/11.2.html" Simply a nice feature to have, IMHO. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk3g6VYACgkQtTMYHG2NR9V0tQCfciLJd86AslApkTs57gZaRTRg fIAAnAoYxv66lkL1Km3LTRQqdxvAa9Vg =E6KC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
* Carlos E. R. <carlos.e.r@opensuse.org> [05-27-11 20:00]:
On 2011-05-27 22:06, Andrew Joakimsen wrote:
The mirrors are still out there. I don't understand why we need to break people's package managers after a certain time.
Sure its EOL, sure it's not suggested to use, etc, etc. But why do we need to break people's package managers?
it doesn't *break* the package managers. Disable the inaccessable repos.
The package managers are already broken. The packagekit applet is complaining here about every 15 minutes that it could not connect to a software source.
I had to do:
mv /usr/sbin/packagekitd /usr/sbin/packagekitd.noquiero
to stop that nonsense.
Look how many repos fail for me:
Telcontar:~ # zypper refresh Repository 'NVIDIA Repository' is up to date. Download (curl) error for 'http://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/linux/misc/packman/suse/11.2/repodata/repomd.xml': Error code: User abort Error message: connect() timed out! Error retrieving metadata for 'OBS: KDE: KDE3': File '/repodata/repomd.xml' not found on medium 'http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/KDE%3a/KDE3/openSUSE_11.2/'
Skipping repository 'OBS: KDE: KDE3' because of the above error.
to fix: zypper rr "OBS: KDE: KDE3" or: zypper mr -d "OBS: KDE: KDE3" the inactive repos are not being maintained, why not remove them? -- (paka)Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 http://en.opensuse.org openSUSE Community Member Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-05-28 03:05, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
* Carlos E. R. <> [05-27-11 20:00]:
it doesn't *break* the package managers. Disable the inaccessable repos.
That is not the issue I'm reporting about. I know that repos have to be disabled, I know how to do that. The problem is that the "sudden failure" of all that repos (a fact that it published in advance, so that is not the issue, I don't want them back) takes by surprise many users that are not aware of EOL. I'm just suggesting that the package kit applet or something else should be aware of EOL and tell the user so. Maybe you haven't seen many posts here asking what is the matter with the repos. But in the forums there are several. The feature would be good for all those people. Some one appeared using 9 something...
the inactive repos are not being maintained, why not remove them?
Because I haven't bothered yet. I removed several repos a week or two ago, I left those for the moment. Now that those have disappeared, I will of course remove them, when I have time, or just upgrade, if I have more time. I just can't risk it right now. I just posted that long list to show that users do indeed get non working repos, contrary to what Andrew said. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk3gUmEACgkQtTMYHG2NR9UuiACeP8kBEuUMyPi4JfnW+8IFjJqF p1QAoJSkB5YO+2AIEB2PDYH3JKmcbkyn =TTKH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
participants (11)
-
Andrew Joakimsen -
Bruno Friedmann -
Bryen M. Yunashko -
Carlos E. R. -
Carlos E. R. -
Christian Boltz -
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger -
jdd -
Marcus Meissner -
Nelson Marques -
Patrick Shanahan