Sorry, forget to cc Factory 在 2012-9-2 上午12:17，"Rajko" <rmatov101@charter.net>写道：

In a few years all translations will be in :) How do you count items? Even in lines of text it is huge.

not yet. the last big improvement of zh_CN translation happened in 11.1 era. there're lots of fuzzys and 30% is totally missing. by lokalize. an item is a msgstr. not a line. a msgstr is at least one line.

New generation of Linux users is different type of users then last century Linux fans.

That explains it. Most of them dont even care what a distribution is. they only care if it can fix the problem she faces. That's my case. the first distro I use is Ubuntu 6.04. But it was not as beautiful as we were. so what are you waiting for? you are a woman, beauty should be all you care about. so I formated my desktop. It is even no logic in their choice. like Systemd dies in openSUSE? then openSUSE should go to hell,I'll use Arch. He dont even notice the fact he will face something more tough than systemd in Arch. That is, new generation is so unstable. They dont want to copy the discovery experience, they just want a. A simple answer. yes or no. if yes, how? if no, why? in 140 characters. then he can show off to others: ha! I sloved a problem! or I can tell why something cant work! b. The developer should be "geekish". They cant imagine the developers are nerds in their 40s, they think they should be just like a rock star...as social animal as they are. The change is so fast and the trend is so clear. at least in China. you are nobody even if you are the author of mysql. but you are somebody if you act cute in your twitter timeline even if you can only code helloworld. How can you imagine the generation who dont even care to know where Vietnanme is will learn who is Linus and respect him? especially he acts like a bastard in his google+? I found there're only few things they accept as "their way": * microblog. facebook. What if cant answer in 140 characters? okay use paste.o.o and give him the link.(that's the way they use such debug things.) What if others also want to know the answer? "if he's my follower he can see. if he's not my follower, then who cares the problem a person that is nobody to you?" * Q&A website like stackoverflow or quora. which clearly shows who you are, which part you are expert in. What if others want to know the same answer? Google is the new religion. No one can help you out if you are really out. And at least these sites are more search engine friendly than ML. if you only use Google you dont even know we have ML. they'll think we developers are actually active on linuxquestions.org or nabble.com or gmane.org. That's why ask.ubuntu.com stuff comes. * forums less popular than the first two. but a place everyone shoule be there, if you can browse the web. they tend to think everyone should visit the forum for at least 10m a day in his favorate area. So how can I tell them developers are actually in ML? they will say forget about the ML! they should be in forums tracing their users and fans! that's why there're complaints about "cant edit after 5m". they know it's for goodness of nntp. but in their mind nntp is something shouldnt exist at all in the new century after you have a powerful web browser. * wiki. The last front line. as a fallback. wiki is still popular because it has something social like many people edit a same page. So now you know why Mac has 15 year old developers while we dont. because openSUSE developers / expert users are mainly aged 30+. You already get used to the tools in last century. But your son aged people think they dont have access to such tools. or they dont even want to. they just choose to turn around and walk away if you force them to. We already lack behind in this area. to social doesnt mean to have an account and act like zombie or bots.

One developer can answer to one user, not to all that have a problem.

The only way to solve this is to have communication between developers

and halfway educated users, some kind of interest groups, or fandoms, so that there is someone that can actually answer to all users that have a problem, write wiki, make a movie.

Yes. That also why we developers need to reach our audience, the half educated users instead of waiting them to reach us. half educated users are still users. They probably good at reporting bugs and read wikis than ordinary users. but less chance to show up in a heavy traffic ML mainly talking about things they dont even have a concept. unless he himself is already a half edcuated developer like student majors in CS. That's why I didnt subscribe to our Kernel ML. because it's really painful to see emails I dont know what they are talking about filling my inbox full. So how could you hope kernel dev has a backup user group? even normal dev cant even know their meanings....

It would be not a problem if that is only one subject, but that is how it happens all over the wiki. It is more rule that docs are not checked for validity when revision of underlying software is changed then exception. In other words each developer, or software title, is missing fans that will take care of details, or notify responsible person about changes, so that developer can focus on software development, but docs are updated when needed.

yes. we need a fans' army who may dont know how it is coded but know how to set it up and get it worked. But that group is cultivated by yourself instead of growing themselves. If you are a kernel dev. dont expect to see users know the functions, never. but at least you should teach them what a kernel is and how to basically debug it. That part will never expires unless the dev tool is changed. To teach means at first you should prepare the tutorial, secondly you should make sure the tutorials reach the target group. eg: adrian and coolo have us all "half educated" users to help write packaging chapters. but that's rare case because they develop a dev concentrated tool. But it is taken as a common case which users will find them among us developers. What if you are an input method dev? the mechanics is no less painful than kernel and everyone use it. You need to hunt everywhere until a group of users knows how to solve common problems grows. and you keep them updated and growing. What if you just seat and wait? congrats! because after a few months you will find you dont even need to bother for that any more. users shrinks really fast because input method is the middleman between you and you computer, if you cant input, certainly you will change the tool ASAP. We openSUSE do have half educated users but I personally dont think they are growing. In forums you will see the QA desk is always the few people group. even in chit-chat forum... personally I think it may be because users are gathering at one place but devs gather at another. see XDA forum, devs dont even need to tell how to flash a rom on a particular device. but our users are still asking the repeated for a long time that make you sick questions. Marguerite -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org