[opensuse-factory] German locale setting always de_DE?
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead? I haven't tested it myself but it's probably set to de_DE as well for German- speaking Switzerland. Is there a reason behind this or is it an oversight?
Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead? I haven't tested it myself but it's probably set to de_DE as well for German- speaking Switzerland. Is there a reason behind this or is it an oversight?
What you set as region is your timezone not the locale - the settings are not related. That's the reason. Greetings, Stephan -- Lighten up, just enjoy life, smile more, laugh more, and don't get so worked up about things. Kenneth Branagh -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead? I haven't tested it myself but it's probably set to de_DE as well for German- speaking Switzerland. Is there a reason behind this or is it an oversight?
What you set as region is your timezone not the locale - the settings are not related. That's the reason.
The settings are somewhat related. If you pick language English (UK) you get your keyboard layout by default selected as English (UK) and your presumed location/timezone set to Europe/London We do the same with Traditional / Simplified Chinese also. Right now as we only offer "German - Deutsch" in the menu, every German speaker gets Tastaturbelegung set to Deutsch, and their presumed location/timezone as Europe/Berlin It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)? Presumably we could have Germany (DE), German (AT), and German (CH) in the language drop-down on the Welcome Screen. For DE and AT I assume that would set the default keyboard layout to the standard "Deutsch" that it does now - I'm not aware of Austrian keyboards being different from German ones. But for CH we could set it to "Deutsch (Schweiz)" that currently needs to be manually selected, but presumably are more common in Switzerland (can someone confirm?) And in all 3 cases, the default timezone/location could be selected to be a more likely accurate than the current "Europe/Berlin fur alles!" approach I can see how Swiss and Austrian users might like it..it would annoy me if there was only one English option and I was always presumed to be American by YaST. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On 12/01/2019 17.00, Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
...
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
At installation time there is a map, and we typically choose our country. I assumed that this phase selected both country-language and timezone. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 15.0 x86_64 at Telcontar)
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 17:25, Carlos E. R.
On 12/01/2019 17.00, Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
...
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
At installation time there is a map, and we typically choose our country. I assumed that this phase selected both country-language and timezone.
It does not - that map only sets the timezone. You're expected to click on the map to select the timezone if the suggested timezone is incorrect (which is informed by the langauge you picked on the first screen in the installer) We never ask users the same thing twice. Any other functionality in the map nor changing the order of the questions asked wouldn't really make much sense - you need to pick your Language and Keyboard layout on the first screen - so you can read our license and so YaST can accept your keyboard inputs correctly Getting your timezone/location correct is something which YaST doesn't need to get right to be able to continue with the installation, but we do need to give users an opportunity to correct it before they install, hence the map. Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Richard Brown wrote:
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Which is almost certainly an exception rather than the rule, so perhaps not the situation to set the default by. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (4.2°C) http://www.cloudsuisse.com/ - your owncloud, hosted in Switzerland. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 19:03, Per Jessen
Richard Brown wrote:
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Which is almost certainly an exception rather than the rule, so perhaps not the situation to set the default by.
Indeed, but also the topic of changing the default behaviour isn't the topic at hand..so lets steer the discussion back to the OP's original question Why isn't there strong support for regional de_* locales the same way there are for en_* and cn_* locales in openSUSE? I don't see why the needs of Austrian and Swiss users can't be met by the similar solutions we already have in place for Americans, Brits, Mainland Chinese and Taiwanese Chinese. Does anyone see a problem with applying that approach? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On samedi, 12 janvier 2019 19.11:45 h CET Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 19:03, Per Jessen
wrote: Richard Brown wrote:
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Which is almost certainly an exception rather than the rule, so perhaps not the situation to set the default by.
Indeed, but also the topic of changing the default behaviour isn't the topic at hand..so lets steer the discussion back to the OP's original question
Why isn't there strong support for regional de_* locales the same way there are for en_* and cn_* locales in openSUSE?
I don't see why the needs of Austrian and Swiss users can't be met by the similar solutions we already have in place for Americans, Brits, Mainland Chinese and Taiwanese Chinese.
Does anyone see a problem with applying that approach?
you can add fr_* (and as living in CH I would really love to see this) -- Bruno Friedmann Ioda-Net Sàrl www.ioda-net.ch Bareos Partner, openSUSE Member, fsfe supporter GPG KEY : D5C9B751C4653227 irc: tigerfoot -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 7:02 PM, Per Jessen
Richard Brown wrote:
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Which is almost certainly an exception rather than the rule, so perhaps not the situation to set the default by.
I don't change language settings on installation, as long as I understand the default language, I will keep the default (also polish keyboard is basically US keyboard but with alt modifier having some additional characters which are interchangable with standard US keyboard characters so I don't even bother changing keyboard). I'm not in New York (same for >80% of US population). Maybe we could get location from user's network (which is a common practice nowadays). LCP [Stasiek] https://lcp.world -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 19:15,
I don't change language settings on installation, as long as I understand the default language, I will keep the default (also polish keyboard is basically US keyboard but with alt modifier having some additional characters which are interchangable with standard US keyboard characters so I don't even bother changing keyboard). I'm not in New York (same for >80% of US population). Maybe we could get location from user's network (which is a common practice nowadays).
Assuming we can put the appropriate geolocation libraries and database on the installation media without things getting out of hand, I think this isn't a bad feature request. Basically, you're asking for a feature for the yast2 "timezone" module to automatically set the suggested location based on network geolocation data first, with the fallback being the current behaviour of using the suggested location derived from the user chosen locale? I'll leave that to you to bug the YaST team with, they can add it to the pile of work you create for them ;) - Rich -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 19:15,
wrote: I don't change language settings on installation, as long as I understand the default language, I will keep the default (also polish keyboard is basically US keyboard but with alt modifier having some additional characters which are interchangable with standard US keyboard characters so I don't even bother changing keyboard). I'm not in New York (same for >80% of US population). Maybe we could get location from user's network (which is a common practice nowadays).
Assuming we can put the appropriate geolocation libraries and database on the installation media without things getting out of hand, I think this isn't a bad feature request.
We could offer this as a service instead, when/if an internet connection is available - http://geoip.jessen.ch/ - gives you the country code for the requestor's IP address. Is easy to set up on one of our public servers. (mirrorbrain has the info anyway). -- Per Jessen, Zürich (3.6°C) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Am 12.01.19 um 19:15 schrieb hellcp@opensuse.org:
On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 7:02 PM, Per Jessen
wrote: Richard Brown wrote:
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Which is almost certainly an exception rather than the rule, so perhaps not the situation to set the default by.
I don't change language settings on installation, as long as I understand the default language, I will keep the default (also polish keyboard is basically US keyboard but with alt modifier having some additional characters which are interchangable with standard US keyboard characters so I don't even bother changing keyboard). I'm not in New York (same for >80% of US population). Maybe we could get location from user's network (which is a common practice nowadays).
LCP [Stasiek] https://lcp.world
oh no!!, please not that. Let's not go the way that the system knows better than the user. Anyway, I'm wondering. AFAIK one can change the keyboard settings during installation. It should be possible there to change to Austrian. Otherwise: +1 for having the choice just like for British and American Karl -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On 12/01/2019 19.25, Karl Sinn wrote:
Am 12.01.19 um 19:15 schrieb hellcp@opensuse.org:
On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 7:02 PM, Per Jessen
wrote: Richard Brown wrote:
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Which is almost certainly an exception rather than the rule, so perhaps not the situation to set the default by.
I don't change language settings on installation, as long as I understand the default language, I will keep the default (also polish keyboard is basically US keyboard but with alt modifier having some additional characters which are interchangable with standard US keyboard characters so I don't even bother changing keyboard). I'm not in New York (same for >80% of US population). Maybe we could get location from user's network (which is a common practice nowadays).
LCP [Stasiek] https://lcp.world
oh no!!, please not that. Let's not go the way that the system knows better than the user.
Geolocation could be used to automatically propose the user a setting that is better suited that somewhere in USA for everybody as done now. Then click on the map to choose the correct country if the guess was wrong. I understand that the map currently is used only for the timezone, but why not use it for more?
Anyway, I'm wondering. AFAIK one can change the keyboard settings during installation. It should be possible there to change to Austrian.
During installation I click on Spain, which gives me the Madrid time zone, then select Spanish keyboard and EN language as default, with Spanish as secondary language. It is easy to customize. If not the map, it could be a list of choices: language and countries taken from the list of available locales. Or directly list the entire list of locales, expanding on the side what EN_uk means. This list is longer to browse, but less error prone to code. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 15.0 x86_64 at Telcontar)
On 13/01/2019 04:45, hellcp@opensuse.org wrote:
On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 7:02 PM, Per Jessen
wrote: Richard Brown wrote:
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Which is almost certainly an exception rather than the rule, so perhaps not the situation to set the default by.
I don't change language settings on installation, as long as I understand the default language, I will keep the default (also polish keyboard is basically US keyboard but with alt modifier having some additional characters which are interchangable with standard US keyboard characters so I don't even bother changing keyboard). I'm not in New York (same for >80% of US population). Maybe we could get location from user's network (which is a common practice nowadays).
LCP [Stasiek] https://lcp.world
That can become alot of fun in places like Australia where we have 5 timezones depending on your state and not all IP addresses are allocated state by state by ISP's. -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On 12/01/2019 17.53, Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 17:25, Carlos E. R.
wrote: On 12/01/2019 17.00, Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
...
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
At installation time there is a map, and we typically choose our country. I assumed that this phase selected both country-language and timezone.
It does not - that map only sets the timezone. You're expected to click on the map to select the timezone if the suggested timezone is incorrect (which is informed by the langauge you picked on the first screen in the installer)
We never ask users the same thing twice. Any other functionality in the map nor changing the order of the questions asked wouldn't really make much sense - you need to pick your Language and Keyboard layout on the first screen - so you can read our license and so YaST can accept your keyboard inputs correctly
Getting your timezone/location correct is something which YaST doesn't need to get right to be able to continue with the installation, but we do need to give users an opportunity to correct it before they install, hence the map.
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
Ok, then: first ask language and keyboard, add another box for possible countries given that selection. Or guess the country on next screen from the map. Or ask country after asking for timezone... Whatever work best, the combinations of countries/languages is limited by the existing locales. -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 15.0 x86_64 at Telcontar)
12.01.2019 19:53, Richard Brown пишет:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 17:25, Carlos E. R.
wrote: On 12/01/2019 17.00, Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
...
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
At installation time there is a map, and we typically choose our country. I assumed that this phase selected both country-language and timezone.
It does not - that map only sets the timezone. You're expected to click on the map to select the timezone if the suggested timezone is incorrect (which is informed by the langauge you picked on the first screen in the installer)
We never ask users the same thing twice. Any other functionality in the map nor changing the order of the questions asked wouldn't really make much sense - you need to pick your Language and Keyboard layout on the first screen - so you can read our license and so YaST can accept your keyboard inputs correctly
This thread is about locale settings not translations. As was mentioned elsewhere there is single German translation so initial dialog is simply the wrong place, because as you say its purpose is to select translation not locale.
Getting your timezone/location correct is something which YaST doesn't need to get right to be able to continue with the installation, but we do need to give users an opportunity to correct it before they install, hence the map.
Any idea of putting the map first doesn't make much sense to me - I may be in Germany, but I don't want German as my language on openSUSE.
It is not about *language* - it is about *locale*. Locale has more properties than just language. User may want German language bug not de_DE locale. As far as I can tell currently there is no place in SUSE installer where locale used by installed system can be adjusted (that is what "Details" button on full YaST2 Language dialog does). Whether default locale is derived from initial language selection or time zone map is irrelevant here (except for choosing at which step to present locale customization). -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
As far as I can tell currently there is no place in SUSE installer where locale used by installed system can be adjusted
Potentially leaving the user with confusing date formats (day and month swapped) and number formats, and a foreign currency as the default currency. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Gesendet: Samstag, 12. Januar 2019 um 17:24 Uhr Von: "Carlos E. R."
An: oS-fctry Betreff: Re: [opensuse-factory] German locale setting always de_DE? On 12/01/2019 17.00, Richard Brown wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
...
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
One reason is that we have only 1 German in our language list of translations[1]. We have 2 Chinese Translation Teams, 4 in English, 3 Norwegian and 2 Portuguese. Austria is using the same language as used in Germany. So they accept our translations. I didn't hear any feedback by our users in Switzerland in the last years.
At installation time there is a map, and we typically choose our country. I assumed that this phase selected both country-language and timezone.
Best regards, Sarah [1] https://l10n.opensuse.org/languages/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Am Samstag, 12. Januar 2019, 17:00:04 CET schrieb Richard Brown:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead? I haven't tested it myself but it's probably set to de_DE as well for German- speaking Switzerland. Is there a reason behind this or is it an oversight?
What you set as region is your timezone not the locale - the settings are not related. That's the reason.
(snip)
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
Presumably we could have Germany (DE), German (AT), and German (CH) in the language drop-down on the Welcome Screen.
For DE and AT I assume that would set the default keyboard layout to the standard "Deutsch" that it does now - I'm not aware of Austrian keyboards being different from German ones.
Yes, I also think German and Austrian keyboards are the same; it's other things like names of months and number/currency formats that make the difference. Here's what the KDE System Settings dialog shows as examples: *de_DE* Zahlen: 1.000,01 Zeit: Sonntag, 13. Januar 2019 19:29:00 CET (Langformat) 13.01.19 19:29 (Kurzformat) Währung: 24,00 € Maßsystem: Metrisch *de_AT* Zahlen: 1 000,01 Zeit: Sonntag, 13. Jänner 2019 19:29:00 CET (Langformat) 13.01.19 19:29 (Kurzformat) Währung: € 24,00 Maßsystem: Metrisch *de_CH* Zahlen: 1'000.01 Zeit: Sonntag, 13. Januar 2019 19:29:00 CET (Langformat) 13.01.19 19:29 (Kurzformat) Währung: CHF 24,00 Maßsystem: Metrisch The digit grouping is different in each of them. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On dimanche, 13 janvier 2019 19.43:53 h CET Maximilian Trummer wrote:
Am Samstag, 12. Januar 2019, 17:00:04 CET schrieb Richard Brown:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead? I haven't tested it myself but it's probably set to de_DE as well for German- speaking Switzerland. Is there a reason behind this or is it an oversight?
What you set as region is your timezone not the locale - the settings are not related. That's the reason.
(snip)
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
Presumably we could have Germany (DE), German (AT), and German (CH) in the language drop-down on the Welcome Screen.
For DE and AT I assume that would set the default keyboard layout to the standard "Deutsch" that it does now - I'm not aware of Austrian keyboards being different from German ones.
Yes, I also think German and Austrian keyboards are the same; it's other things like names of months and number/currency formats that make the difference. Here's what the KDE System Settings dialog shows as examples:
*de_DE* Zahlen: 1.000,01
Zeit: Sonntag, 13. Januar 2019 19:29:00 CET (Langformat) 13.01.19 19:29 (Kurzformat)
Währung: 24,00 €
Maßsystem: Metrisch
*de_AT* Zahlen: 1 000,01
Zeit: Sonntag, 13. Jänner 2019 19:29:00 CET (Langformat) 13.01.19 19:29 (Kurzformat)
Währung: € 24,00
Maßsystem: Metrisch
*de_CH* Zahlen: 1'000.01
Zeit: Sonntag, 13. Januar 2019 19:29:00 CET (Langformat) 13.01.19 19:29 (Kurzformat)
Währung: CHF 24,00
Maßsystem: Metrisch
The digit grouping is different in each of them.
And also note that Währung should be Währung: CHF 24.00 for de_CH as point is the decimal separator ... The funky things come when you compare fr_CH with de_CH in fr_CH you will have Numbers : 1 000,01 Currency: 24,00 CHF Obviously all people in CH have the numbers/currency normally set the same ;-) -- Bruno Friedmann Ioda-Net Sàrl www.ioda-net.ch Bareos Partner, openSUSE Member, fsfe supporter GPG KEY : D5C9B751C4653227 irc: tigerfoot -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Am Montag, 14. Januar 2019, 11:19:59 CET schrieb Bruno Friedmann:
And also note that Währung should be Währung: CHF 24.00 for de_CH as point is the decimal separator ... The funky things come when you compare fr_CH with de_CH in fr_CH you will have Numbers : 1 000,01 Currency: 24,00 CHF
Obviously all people in CH have the numbers/currency normally set the same ;-)
Yes indeed, thanks for this correction. I couldn't copy the text from the dialog so I typed it manually and this mistake slipped in. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On mardi, 15 janvier 2019 14.33:26 h CET Maximilian Trummer wrote:
Am Montag, 14. Januar 2019, 11:19:59 CET schrieb Bruno Friedmann:
And also note that Währung should be Währung: CHF 24.00 for de_CH as point is the decimal separator ... The funky things come when you compare fr_CH with de_CH in fr_CH you will have Numbers : 1 000,01 Currency: 24,00 CHF
Obviously all people in CH have the numbers/currency normally set the same ;-)
Yes indeed, thanks for this correction. I couldn't copy the text from the dialog so I typed it manually and this mistake slipped in.
Not your fault, it is a bug in systemsetting :-) -- Bruno Friedmann Ioda-Net Sàrl www.ioda-net.ch Bareos Partner, openSUSE Member, fsfe supporter GPG KEY : D5C9B751C4653227 irc: tigerfoot -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Richard Brown schrieb:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead? I haven't tested it myself but it's probably set to de_DE as well for German- speaking Switzerland. Is there a reason behind this or is it an oversight?
What you set as region is your timezone not the locale - the settings are not related. That's the reason.
The settings are somewhat related. If you pick language English (UK) you get your keyboard layout by default selected as English (UK) and your presumed location/timezone set to Europe/London We do the same with Traditional / Simplified Chinese also.
Right now as we only offer "German - Deutsch" in the menu, every German speaker gets Tastaturbelegung set to Deutsch, and their presumed location/timezone as Europe/Berlin
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
I looked into the topic for different reasons the other day. Adding Austria there is probably easy but that is just the tip of the iceberg. Instead of arguing whether or not to add this or that region to YaST it would make sense to get YaST to use the same database as Fedora https://github.com/mike-fabian/langtable. That one is way more complete and actually is actively maintained. I've filed a feature request for that already (fate#327107 for those who have access). That database also already contains the information needed for setting the locale based on geographic location. Besides the more complete database the Fedora installer has more goodies, for example it also allows to dynamically switch keyboard layouts in the installer at any point in time. So one can still enter eg the root password using latin characters with US layout even though the system gets installed with a different keyboard layout by default. cu Ludwig -- (o_ Ludwig Nussel //\ V_/_ http://www.suse.com/ SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard, Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 10:18:43 +0100
Ludwig Nussel
Richard Brown schrieb:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2019 at 11:12, Stephan Kulow
wrote: Am 11.01.19 um 21:36 schrieb Maximilian Trummer:
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead? I haven't tested it myself but it's probably set to de_DE as well for German- speaking Switzerland. Is there a reason behind this or is it an oversight?
What you set as region is your timezone not the locale - the settings are not related. That's the reason.
The settings are somewhat related. If you pick language English (UK) you get your keyboard layout by default selected as English (UK) and your presumed location/timezone set to Europe/London We do the same with Traditional / Simplified Chinese also.
Right now as we only offer "German - Deutsch" in the menu, every German speaker gets Tastaturbelegung set to Deutsch, and their presumed location/timezone as Europe/Berlin
It does lead to the question - why doesn't our install offer the locales German (German) | (Austrian) | (Swiss) the same way we offer English (UK) and English (US)?
I looked into the topic for different reasons the other day. Adding Austria there is probably easy but that is just the tip of the iceberg. Instead of arguing whether or not to add this or that region to YaST it would make sense to get YaST to use the same database as Fedora https://github.com/mike-fabian/langtable. That one is way more complete and actually is actively maintained. I've filed a feature request for that already (fate#327107 for those who have access). That database also already contains the information needed for setting the locale based on geographic location. Besides the more complete database the Fedora installer has more goodies, for example it also allows to dynamically switch keyboard layouts in the installer at any point in time. So one can still enter eg the root password using latin characters with US layout even though the system gets installed with a different keyboard layout by default.
cu Ludwig
JFYI: this is current set of locales yast knows about[1]. I agree with that feature to use some upstream database, that is ideally already packaged, so yast will just read it. But of course it need some priority from managers or community contribution, as YaST team currently is quite busy with various other features and bugs. Josef [1] https://github.com/yast/yast-country/tree/master/language/src/data/languages -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Maximilian Trummer
I noticed that openSUSE will always set the locale to de_DE, even if you set Europe - Austria as region during install. de_AT exists as a locale, so why isn't that picked instead?
In former times, it would be important as de_AT would need to refer to Schilling. Today I would expect no differences. Jörg -- EMail:joerg@schily.net (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin joerg.schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.org/private/ http://sf.net/projects/schilytools/files/' -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
participants (15)
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Andrei Borzenkov
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Bruno Friedmann
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Carlos E. R.
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hellcp@opensuse.org
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Joachim Wagner
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Joerg Schilling
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Josef Reidinger
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Karl Sinn
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Ludwig Nussel
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Maximilian Trummer
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Per Jessen
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Richard Brown
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Sarah Julia Kriesch
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Simon Lees
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Stephan Kulow