[opensuse-factory] [RFC] Drop package linux32 from Factory
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least? Thank you. * It is recommended by the pattern 'enhanced_base' at present. I will make the sr for the change if this is the route we take. -- Atri Bhattacharya Sun Oct 5 10:40:48 MST 2014 Sent from openSUSE 13.2beta1 on my laptop. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Sun, Oct 05, 2014 at 10:57:51AM -0700, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070]
I don't see why some mess in Gnome desktop files should be reason to drop a useful tool.
but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538].
Hm... someone did a mistake so we should remove the tool he used? And when someone else accidentally deletes his whole home directory with "rm -rf", should we, as a prevention, drop coreutils?
I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise.
While I don't use shortcuts for "32-bit terminal", others might and I don't think you presented sufficient arguments for dropping them.
If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
How about fixing the Gnome desktop files (bnc#841070) and learning not to blame useful tools for one's mistakes (bnc#435538) instead? Michal Kubeček -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On 10/05/2014 07:57 PM, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
linux32 is a simple shell script that is quite usefull for some development and debugging work. If it causes issues in Gnome, then something is wrong in Gnome. Let's fix the desktop files instead of dropping linux32, Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger aj@{suse.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GF: Jeff Hawn,Jennifer Guild,Felix Imendörffer,HRB16746 (AG Nürnberg) GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, Oct 06, 2014 at 08:29:27AM +0200, Andreas Jaeger wrote:
linux32 is a simple shell script that is quite usefull for some development and debugging work. If it causes issues in Gnome, then something is wrong in Gnome.
Let's fix the desktop files instead of dropping linux32,
I also fell for this at first. The "linux32" wrapper is in fact part of util-linux package. The "linux32" package contains desktop file for "32-bit terminal" (which is konsole run under linux32) and icons for it: mike@unicorn:~> rpm -ql linux32 /usr/share/applications/linux32.desktop /usr/share/icons/hicolor/128x128/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/24x24/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/256x256/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/32x32/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/64x64/apps/konsole-linux32.png Michal Kubeček -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On 10/06/2014 08:50 AM, Michal Kubecek wrote:
On Mon, Oct 06, 2014 at 08:29:27AM +0200, Andreas Jaeger wrote:
linux32 is a simple shell script that is quite usefull for some development and debugging work. If it causes issues in Gnome, then something is wrong in Gnome.
Let's fix the desktop files instead of dropping linux32,
I also fell for this at first. The "linux32" wrapper is in fact part of util-linux package. The "linux32" package contains desktop file for "32-bit terminal" (which is konsole run under linux32) and icons for it:
mike@unicorn:~> rpm -ql linux32 /usr/share/applications/linux32.desktop /usr/share/icons/hicolor/128x128/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/24x24/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/256x256/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/32x32/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/apps/konsole-linux32.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/64x64/apps/konsole-linux32.png
Indeed, not adding the desktop file is an option as well, Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger aj@{suse.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GF: Jeff Hawn,Jennifer Guild,Felix Imendörffer,HRB16746 (AG Nürnberg) GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2014-10-06 at 08:29 +0200, Andreas Jaeger wrote:
On 10/05/2014 07:57 PM, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
linux32 is a simple shell script that is quite usefull for some development and debugging work. If it causes issues in Gnome, then something is wrong in Gnome.
Let's fix the desktop files instead of dropping linux32,
Andreas
Hi, afaicr, KIWI is also using something called 'linux32', it used for building 32bit system on a 64bit machine. If it _is_ the same package, Marcus and his team will be in for a bitter surprise if it will be dropped... (not to mention the studio-group). Hans -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Tue, 2014-10-07 at 22:32 +0200, Hans Witvliet wrote:
On Mon, 2014-10-06 at 08:29 +0200, Andreas Jaeger wrote:
On 10/05/2014 07:57 PM, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
linux32 is a simple shell script that is quite usefull for some development and debugging work. If it causes issues in Gnome, then something is wrong in Gnome.
Let's fix the desktop files instead of dropping linux32,
Andreas
Hi,
afaicr, KIWI is also using something called 'linux32', it used for building 32bit system on a 64bit machine.
If it _is_ the same package, Marcus and his team will be in for a bitter surprise if it will be dropped... (not to mention the studio-group).
Hans, kiwi uses LINUX32, the script / tool, not linux32 the package
(they are unfortunately named but not the same.. they don't even really
relate together.linux32 (the package, in question to be dropped or at
least removed from the pattern), is just a collection of some icons and
a .desktop file.
linux32 (the tool/script) lives in the package util-linux and is not
meant to be touched by this.
Hope this clarifies the things.
Dominique
--
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger
Hello, Am Dienstag, 7. Oktober 2014 schrieb Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger:
Hans, kiwi uses LINUX32, the script / tool, not linux32 the package (they are unfortunately named but not the same.. they don't even really relate together.linux32 (the package, in question to be dropped or at least removed from the pattern), is just a collection of some icons and a .desktop file.
linux32 (the tool/script) lives in the package util-linux and is not meant to be touched by this.
Hope this clarifies the things.
It does, but it shows that the package name causes lots of confusion. Would it make sense to rename the linux32 package to "linux32-xterm"? (This package contains a .desktop file with Exec=xterm -e "linux32 \\$SHELL" and some icons) BTW: The confusing package name probably has historic reasons - a changelog entry from 2009 says that the linux32 binaries were moved to util-linux (but that should not stop us from renaming it ;-) Regards, Christian Boltz -- But for now is the most important to find how to put more hours in the day. The 24 is too little :-) [Rajko M in opensuse-wiki] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Hello, Am Montag, 20. Oktober 2014 schrieb Olaf Hering:
On Sat, Oct 18, Christian Boltz wrote:
Exec=xterm -e "linux32 \\$SHELL"
Maybe this should be xdg-terminal?
Sounds like a good idea. However renaming the package is the more important thing to do. I don't care if the package is called "linux32-xterm", linux32-terminal" or whatever, but the current name "linux32" is very confusing. Regards, Christian Boltz -- 240 TB also... das wären dann die Konfigurationsdateien. Und die ganzen "Nutzdaten"? MP3's? jpg's? Wo haben die Platz? [Andreas Feile in suse-linux] -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On 05.10.2014 19:57, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
Thank you.
* It is recommended by the pattern 'enhanced_base' at present. I will make the sr for the change if this is the route we take.
I don't think enhanced_base actually wants to recommend xterm - this is most likely an old artefact. Naming this package linux32 is very misleading as it's actually xterm32 :) But you need to fix the GNOME bug anyway as dropping this recommend won't remove the package from all existant openSUSE installations. Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2014-10-06 at 10:23 +0200, Stephan Kulow wrote:
On 05.10.2014 19:57, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
Thank you.
* It is recommended by the pattern 'enhanced_base' at present. I will make the sr for the change if this is the route we take.
I don't think enhanced_base actually wants to recommend xterm - this is most likely an old artefact. Naming this package linux32 is very misleading as it's actually xterm32 :)
But you need to fix the GNOME bug anyway as dropping this recommend won't remove the package from all existant openSUSE installations.
The bug is actually no bug; just the user was tipped off by so many
different terminals installed by default; and failed to ultimately find
gnome-terminal amongst the list (which is in the Utilities subfolder,
and the others are not).
The aim is to clean up the overview on 'new' installs. As such, removing
it from the base_enhanced pattern is already sufficient.
Dropping the linux32 package (which is in fact nothing but a collection
of icons and a .desktop file) is the 2nd option; whereas we see
need/reason for existence for 'linux32, the script', we fail to see need
for 'linux32, the launcher in the menu'. But if somebody DOES use it, we
also do not want to disrupt their workflows; so leaving it installable,
but not default installed IS acceptable to us.
Dominique
--
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger
On 10/06/2014 10:38 AM, Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
On Mon, 2014-10-06 at 10:23 +0200, Stephan Kulow wrote:
On 05.10.2014 19:57, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
Thank you.
* It is recommended by the pattern 'enhanced_base' at present. I will make the sr for the change if this is the route we take.
I don't think enhanced_base actually wants to recommend xterm - this is most likely an old artefact. Naming this package linux32 is very misleading as it's actually xterm32 :)
But you need to fix the GNOME bug anyway as dropping this recommend won't remove the package from all existant openSUSE installations.
The bug is actually no bug; just the user was tipped off by so many different terminals installed by default; and failed to ultimately find gnome-terminal amongst the list (which is in the Utilities subfolder, and the others are not).
The aim is to clean up the overview on 'new' installs. As such, removing it from the base_enhanced pattern is already sufficient.
Dropping the linux32 package (which is in fact nothing but a collection of icons and a .desktop file) is the 2nd option; whereas we see need/reason for existence for 'linux32, the script', we fail to see need for 'linux32, the launcher in the menu'. But if somebody DOES use it, we also do not want to disrupt their workflows; so leaving it installable, but not default installed IS acceptable to us.
I finally got it. Dropping the linux32 package - not the linux32 tool - is fine with me. And removing it from the patterns sounds fine as a first step, just send a patch for openSUSE-patterns package, Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger aj@{suse.com,opensuse.org} Twitter: jaegerandi SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GF: Jeff Hawn,Jennifer Guild,Felix Imendörffer,HRB16746 (AG Nürnberg) GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2014-10-06 at 11:11 +0200, Andreas Jaeger wrote:
On 10/06/2014 10:38 AM, Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
On Mon, 2014-10-06 at 10:23 +0200, Stephan Kulow wrote:
On 05.10.2014 19:57, Atri Bhattacharya wrote:
Hi! The presence of the linux32 package (installed by default on x86_64) causes issues including not behaving well with elements of the GNOME desktop [bnc#841070], but also more invasive ones such as [bnc#435538]. I request the consideration of dropping the package altogether from Factory if there is no reasonable use case which justifies otherwise. If this cannot be done because people do use this package, might I suggest removing it from the default patterns* and hiding the .desktop menu item from the applications menu (as promised in bnc#408320, then somehow reverted), in the least?
Thank you.
* It is recommended by the pattern 'enhanced_base' at present. I will make the sr for the change if this is the route we take.
I don't think enhanced_base actually wants to recommend xterm - this is most likely an old artefact. Naming this package linux32 is very misleading as it's actually xterm32 :)
But you need to fix the GNOME bug anyway as dropping this recommend won't remove the package from all existant openSUSE installations.
The bug is actually no bug; just the user was tipped off by so many different terminals installed by default; and failed to ultimately find gnome-terminal amongst the list (which is in the Utilities subfolder, and the others are not).
The aim is to clean up the overview on 'new' installs. As such, removing it from the base_enhanced pattern is already sufficient.
Dropping the linux32 package (which is in fact nothing but a collection of icons and a .desktop file) is the 2nd option; whereas we see need/reason for existence for 'linux32, the script', we fail to see need for 'linux32, the launcher in the menu'. But if somebody DOES use it, we also do not want to disrupt their workflows; so leaving it installable, but not default installed IS acceptable to us.
I finally got it. Dropping the linux32 package - not the linux32 tool - is fine with me. And removing it from the patterns sounds fine as a first step, just send a patch for openSUSE-patterns package,
Ok, Glad we could clear the confusion of two things having the same name :) Let's give people some more time to chime in and then submit the pattern change in a day or two (easy reversible after all). Dominique -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
participants (8)
-
Andreas Jaeger -
Atri Bhattacharya -
Christian Boltz -
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger -
Hans Witvliet -
Michal Kubecek -
Olaf Hering -
Stephan Kulow