[opensuse-factory] Announcement: Software management for openSUSE
openSUSE is focusing on native software management by using YaST and libzypp, the package management library. ZENworks Linux Management is Novell's solution for enterprise-class resource management for desktops and servers. ZENworks components are fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution. Product development for both ZENworks and SUSE Linux Enterprise concentrates on continued interoperability solutions for remote and local software management. Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126
Hi, And so for the next openSUSE ( the 10.3 ) we will have ZEN works? Best regards Vincenzo 2007/4/18, Andreas Jaeger <aj@suse.de>:
openSUSE is focusing on native software management by using YaST and libzypp, the package management library.
ZENworks Linux Management is Novell's solution for enterprise-class resource management for desktops and servers. ZENworks components are fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
Product development for both ZENworks and SUSE Linux Enterprise concentrates on continued interoperability solutions for remote and local software management.
Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126
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Vincenzo, On Wed, 2007-04-18 at 16:47 +0200, Vincenzo Barranco wrote:
Hi, And so for the next openSUSE ( the 10.3 ) we will have ZEN works?
Did you read the email? -- SNIP --
and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution. -- SNIP --
Best regards
Vincenzo
2007/4/18, Andreas Jaeger <aj@suse.de>:
openSUSE is focusing on native software management by using YaST and libzypp, the package management library. ZENworks Linux Management is Novell's solution for enterprise-class resource management for desktops and servers. ZENworks components are fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
Product development for both ZENworks and SUSE Linux Enterprise concentrates on continued interoperability solutions for remote and local software management.
Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126
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On Wed, 2007-04-18 at 16:47 +0200, Vincenzo Barranco wrote:
Hi, And so for the next openSUSE ( the 10.3 ) we will have ZEN works? Best regards
Vincenzo
2007/4/18, Andreas Jaeger <aj@suse.de>:
openSUSE is focusing on native software management by using YaST and libzypp, the package management library.
ZENworks Linux Management is Novell's solution for enterprise-class resource management for desktops and servers. ZENworks components are fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products
*****************************************************
and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
Ken Schneider --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
"Vincenzo Barranco" <barravince@gmail.com> writes:
Hi, And so for the next openSUSE ( the 10.3 ) we will have ZEN works?
We will *not* have ZENworks for openSUSE anymore, it will be removed in the next Alpha. We will use the native tools only - zypper, opensuse-updater and YaST, Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126
Andreas Jaeger wrote:
We will *not* have ZENworks for openSUSE anymore, it will be removed in the next Alpha.
so we will be able to keep the "zen attitude" :-)) jdd -- http://www.dodin.net Lucien Dodin, inventeur http://lucien.dodin.net/index.shtml --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Am Mittwoch, 18. April 2007 16:59 schrieb Andreas Jaeger:
"Vincenzo Barranco" <barravince@gmail.com> writes:
Hi, And so for the next openSUSE ( the 10.3 ) we will have ZEN works?
We will *not* have ZENworks for openSUSE anymore, it will be removed in the next Alpha. We will use the native tools only - zypper, opensuse-updater and YaST,
THANK YOU VERY MUCH! -- Machs gut | http://www.iivs.de/schwinde/buerger/tremmel/ | http://packman.links2linux.de/ Manfred | http://www.knightsoft-net.de --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
This is very good news. I have never felt comfortable with the overall reliability and integration of ZENworks in openSUSE. I'm glad to see the last of it. -Ted Andreas Jaeger wrote:
"Vincenzo Barranco" <barravince@gmail.com> writes:
Hi, And so for the next openSUSE ( the 10.3 ) we will have ZEN works?
We will *not* have ZENworks for openSUSE anymore, it will be removed in the next Alpha. We will use the native tools only - zypper, opensuse-updater and YaST,
Andreas
-- Theodore Bullock, <tbullock@canada.com, tedbullock@gmail.com> Software Engineering Student, University of Calgary GPG Fingerprint = 3B8E 8B0E D296 AACB 7BE2 24F2 1006 B7BE C8AC 5109 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Andreas Jaeger escribió: . ZENworks components are
fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
Ok. that's good news. :-) now we can focus on a single solution instead of having to provide a large number of instructions depending of $PACKAGEMANAGER the user has.
Den Wednesday 18 April 2007 15:17:33 skrev Andreas Jaeger:
ZENworks Linux Management is Novell's solution for enterprise-class resource management for desktops and servers. ZENworks components are fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
Great. A load off everyone's shoulders, not least bugzilla. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
As Spock said: "It's a logical decision". Thanks. 2007/4/18, Andreas Jaeger <aj@suse.de>:
openSUSE is focusing on native software management by using YaST and libzypp, the package management library.
ZENworks Linux Management is Novell's solution for enterprise-class resource management for desktops and servers. ZENworks components are fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
Product development for both ZENworks and SUSE Linux Enterprise concentrates on continued interoperability solutions for remote and local software management.
Andreas -- Andreas Jaeger, aj@suse.de, http://www.suse.de/~aj/ SUSE LINUX Products GmbH, GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany GPG fingerprint = 93A3 365E CE47 B889 DF7F FED1 389A 563C C272 A126
-- Samuel Partida Amores ----------------------------------- samuel.partida@gmail.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Hi, On Wed, 18 Apr 2007, Samuel Partida wrote:
As Spock said: "It's a logical decision".
But unfortunately not for SLES - there the hassle has to go on (by order), and that may affect the business part of SUSE/Novell. Dark clouds at the moment. Let's hope this shit will turn into gold without help from the community. Not the best chance... Viele Grüße Eberhard Mönkeberg (emoenke@gwdg.de, em@kki.org)
Eberhard Moenkeberg escribió:
But unfortunately not for SLES - there the hassle has to go on (by order), and that may affect the business part of SUSE/Novell.
well.. you probably know what happends to a part of a commercial product if cause to loose money..it becomes either an documented bug or disappears..that pressure is higher than comunnity pressure I guess ;-P
Let's hope this shit will turn into gold without help from the community. Not the best chance...
It probably has a chance to improve if 1. is not marketed as be integrated with yast ( integration will never work, it hurts so much...) 2. if rug is separated from the zmd daemon (yes,rug is fine IMHO) and ZMD dissapears from the scene. 3. it is fixed to achieve better performance (I guess that requires fixing not only Zenworks but mono and other components) Finally, Im pleased with this announce and invite the rest of the contributors to test zypper and related stuff **madly**. I can now stop bugging people about Zenworks problems and use my time in a more productive and less annoying task.
Hi, On Wed, 18 Apr 2007, Cristian Rodriguez R. wrote:
Eberhard Moenkeberg escribió:
But unfortunately not for SLES - there the hassle has to go on (by order), and that may affect the business part of SUSE/Novell.
well.. you probably know what happends to a part of a commercial product if cause to loose money..it becomes either an documented bug or disappears..that pressure is higher than comunnity pressure I guess ;-P
Surely, they have to turn "bad" management decision into "good" result, but without help of the community now.
Let's hope this shit will turn into gold without help from the community. Not the best chance...
It probably has a chance to improve if
1. is not marketed as be integrated with yast ( integration will never work, it hurts so much...)
2. if rug is separated from the zmd daemon (yes,rug is fine IMHO) and ZMD dissapears from the scene.
3. it is fixed to achieve better performance (I guess that requires fixing not only Zenworks but mono and other components)
Surely, almost everytime high-level is low-performance. But this is not known to managers: they have to deserve it in practice before they "believe" it (almost never "understand"). This result usually is coming too late for the business.
Finally, Im pleased with this announce and invite the rest of the contributors to test zypper and related stuff **madly**. I can now stop bugging people about Zenworks problems and use my time in a more productive and less annoying task.
Yes. But I fear about SLES usage quality - we have more than 1000 licenses here - already lowered by number against the past years due to changed pricing models (more money for the same number of servers - obviously Novell does not reflect RedHat's "educational" prices); our new license contract may be the last by two reasons now... Viele Grüße Eberhard Mönkeberg (emoenke@gwdg.de, em@kki.org)
* Eberhard Moenkeberg <emoenke@gwdg.de> [Apr 19. 2007 00:45]:
Surely, they have to turn "bad" management decision into "good" result, but without help of the community now.
The community can help in creating a decent software management stack for openSUSE. This won't go unnoticed ...
Yes. But I fear about SLES usage quality - we have more than 1000 licenses here - already lowered by number against the past years due to changed pricing models (more money for the same number of servers - obviously Novell does not reflect RedHat's "educational" prices); our new license contract may be the last by two reasons now...
This list might be the wrong forum for this complaint. I'm sure your SLE sales representative can route you to the correct channel ;-) Klaus --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
* Cristian Rodriguez R. <judas_iscariote@shorewall.net> [Apr 19. 2007 00:22]:
1. is not marketed as be integrated with yast ( integration will never work, it hurts so much...)
Integration can work if executed properly.
2. if rug is separated from the zmd daemon (yes,rug is fine IMHO) and ZMD dissapears from the scene.
That's what zypper proved, as it can be used as rug replacement in scripts.
3. it is fixed to achieve better performance (I guess that requires fixing not only Zenworks but mono and other components)
Having a native, standards-based, flexible remote management solution for all management needs (inventory, monitoring, ...) would be the ideal solution.
Finally, Im pleased with this announce and invite the rest of the contributors to test zypper and related stuff **madly**. I can now stop bugging people about Zenworks problems and use my time in a more productive and less annoying task.
Feel yourself invited to participate in the ongoing refactoring of the software management stack ;-) See http://en.opensuse.org/Libzypp/Devel. Klaus --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Integration can work if executed properly.
Properly is one of the words that didnt come through my mind by the time after 10.1 release... As Eberhard said, the enterprise madness continues. I have had already to recommend some companies to not use SLES, because on test they have had the joy to find the zmd "operating". So Novell will suffer the consequences, bad or good ones... About the zypper front, maybe it needs more work. I myself am cc´ed in lots of enhancements bugs opened about zypper, and they are all in "new" state... In the end, this is great news Marcio --- druid --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, Apr 19, 2007 at 02:56:14PM -0300, Druid wrote:
Integration can work if executed properly.
Properly is one of the words that didnt come through my mind by the time after 10.1 release...
As Eberhard said, the enterprise madness continues. I have had already to recommend some companies to not use SLES, because on test they have had the joy to find the zmd "operating". So Novell will suffer the consequences, bad or good ones...
SLE10 SP1 will have a stack slightly better than the 10.2 one. SO it will be better. Ciao, Marcus --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Hi, On Thu, 19 Apr 2007, Druid wrote:
Integration can work if executed properly.
Properly is one of the words that didnt come through my mind by the time after 10.1 release...
As Eberhard said, the enterprise madness continues. I have had already to recommend some companies to not use SLES, because on test they have had the joy to find the zmd "operating". So Novell will suffer the consequences, bad or good ones...
Maybe it would have been sufficient to tell them "insserv -r novell-zmd". ;-))
About the zypper front, maybe it needs more work. I myself am cc´ed in lots of enhancements bugs opened about zypper, and they are all in "new" state...
In the end, this is great news
Viele Grüße Eberhard Mönkeberg (emoenke@gwdg.de, em@kki.org)
Maybe it would have been sufficient to tell them "insserv -r novell-zmd". ;-))
If you remember well the 10.1 situation, having it not running is simply not enough. The crazy helpers keep running and sync´ing the metadata, etc etc etc Its not enough to tell them not to run. And if I told them to simply do that, who would knwo waht would happen with support contract, patch deployment, all that stuff... Dont want that to become my problem... regards Marcio --- druid --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
As Eberhard said, the enterprise madness continues. I have had already to recommend some companies to not use SLES, because on test they have had the joy to find the zmd "operating". So Novell will suffer the consequences, bad or good ones... For SLES: Remove the zmd related packages right _after_ you've established your connection to the customer center (activation key, online-update source). Live will go on without this monster, just click Online-Update in YaST on a regular basis to check if there are updates you really need. But notice: you have to delete /etc/zmd and then reinstall all the removed packages when you got a new activation key after prolonging your subscription. After that: goto "For SLES"
For openSUSE:
In the end, this is great news ACK
Hans-Peter --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
* Eberhard Moenkeberg <emoenke@gwdg.de> [Apr 19. 2007 00:05]:
Hi,
On Wed, 18 Apr 2007, Samuel Partida wrote:
As Spock said: "It's a logical decision".
But unfortunately not for SLES - there the hassle has to go on (by order), and that may affect the business part of SUSE/Novell. Dark clouds at the moment. Let's hope this shit will turn into gold without help from the community. Not the best chance...
Local management requirements still differ from remote, 1:many management needs. We have a much greater flexibility in addressing openSUSE requirements, and thats what this announcement is all about. Having a good software management stack on openSUSE will hopefully influence other products as well ... Klaus --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Hi! Since we now have also GNOME applet, should not we adjust the package names? Currently we have opensuse-updater and opensuse-updater-gnome. The first one does not reflect the desktop it is intended for. In order to keep the package names reasonably short, what about updater-kde updater-gnome ? Or any other idea? Jiri Dne středa 18 duben 2007 15:17 Andreas Jaeger napsal(a):
openSUSE is focusing on native software management by using YaST and libzypp, the package management library.
ZENworks Linux Management is Novell's solution for enterprise-class resource management for desktops and servers. ZENworks components are fully available and supported for SUSE Linux Enterprise based products and not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
Product development for both ZENworks and SUSE Linux Enterprise concentrates on continued interoperability solutions for remote and local software management.
Andreas
-- Regards, Jiri Srain YaST Team Leader --------------------------------------------------------------------- SUSE LINUX, s.r.o. e-mail: jsrain@suse.cz Lihovarska 1060/12 tel: +420 284 028 959 190 00 Praha 9 fax: +420 284 028 951 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz
Den Thursday 19 April 2007 11:25:21 skrev Jiri Srain:
In order to keep the package names reasonably short, what about
updater-kde updater-gnome
? Or any other idea?
I like the current naming. opensuseupdater was the name Narayan gave it. But since we're at it, how about changing gnome-xgl-switch to xgl-switch. It doesn't seem to depend heavily on GNOME, and it works surprisingly well under KDE. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Hello, on Donnerstag, 19. April 2007, Jiri Srain wrote:
Since we now have also GNOME applet, should not we adjust the package names? Currently we have opensuse-updater and opensuse-updater-gnome. The first one does not reflect the desktop it is intended for. In order to keep the package names reasonably short, what about
updater-kde updater-gnome
? Or any other idea?
If the application is named opensuseupdater, you should also name the package this way IMHO. Short package names might be nice, but long (and understandable) package names are better. And the package name opensuseupdater-kde isn't really long (19 chars) compared to the top 3 packages installed on my system: OpenOffice_org-templates-presentation-layouts (45 chars) OpenOffice_org-templates-labels-letter (38 chars) OpenOffice_org-templates-labels-a4 (34 chars) Oh, yast2-online-update-frontend (28 chars) isn't really short either ;-) Sidenote: Currently, the (KDE) binary is called opensuseupdater, but the package is named opensuse-updater. Please fix this also if/while renaming the package.
Dne středa 18 duben 2007 15:17 Andreas Jaeger napsal(a):
openSUSE is focusing on native software management by using YaST and libzypp, the package management library.
ZENworks components [...] not longer part of the openSUSE distribution.
I really like this decision - and would have liked it even more if it was done before the 10.1 release *g,d&r* Regards, Christian Boltz -- looks like you have some special code in yast for password "x", maybe I should use the even more secure new password "y" in the future ?! ;-) [Harald Koenig in https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=148464] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
Jiri Srain escribió:
Hi!
Since we now have also GNOME applet, should not we adjust the package names? Currently we have opensuse-updater and opensuse-updater-gnome. The first one does not reflect the desktop it is intended for. In order to keep the package names reasonably short, what about
updater-kde updater-gnome
? Or any other idea?
my $2 chilean pesos here... whatever naming you choose, make it consistent, that's all we need. opensuse-updater-kde opensuse-updater-gnome are my suggestions.
On Sunday 22 April 2007 11:19:19 Cristian Rodriguez R. wrote:
Jiri Srain escribió: opensuse-updater-kde opensuse-updater-gnome
I thought the same names too. My 2 chilean pesos too ( in € ) -- Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett Novell :: SUSE R&D, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nürnberg GF: Markus Rex, HRB 16746 (AG Nürnberg) --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org
participants (18)
-
Andreas Jaeger -
Christian Boltz -
Cristian Rodriguez R. -
Druid -
Duncan Mac-Vicar -
Eberhard Moenkeberg -
Hans-Peter Holler -
jdd -
Jiri Srain -
Kenneth Schneider -
Klaus Kaempf -
Magnus Boman -
Manfred Tremmel -
Marcus Meissner -
Martin Schlander -
Samuel Partida -
Ted Bullock -
Vincenzo Barranco