Hello, On 02/10/2011 01:20 PM, Detlef Steuer wrote:

For me a lot of this cdrecord/wodim yes/no discussion looked a lot like pure noise and children crying in their sandbox.

This list for opensuse-factory became nearly useless for its intended audience in the last weeks because of that willfully prolonged discussion.

+1 If somebody needs to be moderated, it's not Dave, who makes lots of hard work on openSUSE. Bye, CzP -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2011-02-10 13:20, Detlef Steuer wrote:

Wow. Enough is enough.

Indeed.

This list for opensuse-factory became nearly useless for its intended audience in the last weeks because of that willfully prolonged discussion.

You are correct. The factory related issue is simply that the image is too big - the rest is not related to this list. I'm sorry that I got dragged into it.

But if I had to nominate one person to be "moderated" I would of all those involved definitely not choose Dave Plater, but someone else.

Agreed. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk1T6r8ACgkQtTMYHG2NR9VRDwCgllbOHFIytCSOghXUgMofMH90 JaYAoIaN1t6Xb1bizb4uYqKaM4Jl8jsE =nnQS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

I know exactly how you feel. This list has not been the only one to be so polluted by recurring flare-ups on this topic. It will die down until someone again in future mentions wodim/cdrecord, then all hell breaks loose. It all started as an argument over cdrecord and widened to encompass wodim which resulted from the disagreement. The argument never changes and I have not come across another topic that has generated so much heat and NO LIGHT for so many years. I just get on using whatever openSUSE or other distros provide and apart from many failing drives, built to fail, I have many working boxes and now I have a USB DVD drive I move around when one fails. The reliability of drives impacts me more than the software. Regards Sid. On 10/02/11 12:20, Detlef Steuer wrote:

Wow. Enough is enough.

I`m just a packager, no lawyer, no master of license infight. I`m subscribed for gathering information how to maintain my package in an efficient way to be part of opensuse 11.x and later.

For me a lot of this cdrecord/wodim yes/no discussion looked a lot like pure noise and children crying in their sandbox.

This list for opensuse-factory became nearly useless for its intended audience in the last weeks because of that willfully prolonged discussion.

But if I had to nominate one person to be "moderated" I would of all those involved definitely not choose Dave Plater, but someone else.

I`m getting old and am reading mailing lists about Linux since more than 15 years. It`s astonishing how a single person keeps crawling back on lists I read over all this time ... And all discussions end the same, as was said on this list a few day ago: All of linux here, and that single person there.

No progress to be expected in the next fifteen years.

Lets just work on a better release.

And one note to all of us to consider from time to time: Even if you are right, if noone listens to you anymore, what have you won?

Detlef

-------- Original-Nachricht --------

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Datum: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 12:38:09 +0100 Von: Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de An: opensuse-factory@opensuse.org Betreff: [opensuse-factory] To the administrators of this list

...

Hi,

please set people like Dave Plater and similar on the list of moderated people and make sure that this list is no longer abused for personal attacks/insults.

Jörg

-- EMail:joerg@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin js@cs.tu-berlin.de (uni) joerg.schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

I like people like Dave Plater and I like their emails. They work hard for openSUSE.

Regardless who is `right' or not, Dave's tone is absolutely intolerable! But he's not alone, sadly. It's really ashaming that so many people apparently have no other possibilities than to write insults. Werner -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

jdd wrote:

Le 10/02/2011 13:28, Werner LEMBERG a écrit :

...

It's really ashaming that so many people apparently have no other possibilities than to write insults.

true. We should all try to make discussion cooler. Dave have good arguments, Joerg does also. I have even the feeling that the present discussion makes us go a bit in the good direction.

I have no problems if people use arguments, I only have problems with insults. Jörg -- EMail:joerg@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin js@cs.tu-berlin.de (uni) joerg.schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Deal with it or just go away!

Interesting... -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org