[opensuse-factory] should Office pattern NOT install openoffice?

Andrea Florio

28 Mar 2010 28 Mar '10

16:13

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi people, as you know, i'm working on LXDE into 11.3 i noticed a strange thing with Office pattern. if you install office pattern, it will install OO.o this is imho wrong... in particular for xfce and lxde, that may want to use a lighter solution (check lxde-office pattern). i think, that Office pattern sould install "nothing" and call as "dependencie" $DE_office pattern something like "imaging" pattern.. what do you think about it? - -- - ------------------------------------------ Andrea Florio QSI International School of Brindisi Sys Admin CISCO CCNA Certified openSUSE-Education Administrator openSUSE Official Member (anubisg1) Email: andrea@opensuse.org Packman Packaging Team Email: andrea@links2linux.de Web: http://packman.links2linux.org/ Cell: +39-328-7365667 - ------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkuvgBcACgkQyCZT87TFPuiZoQCgh4WBimf0GUhqAfgOSrB84FU3 bSgAnRcOPeoq34uUH8qECxblf8pdvzKC =Wmcf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

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Stephan Kulow

29 Mar 29 Mar

08:49

Am Sonntag 28 März 2010 schrieb Andrea Florio:

...

Hi people,

as you know, i'm working on LXDE into 11.3

i noticed a strange thing with Office pattern.

if you install office pattern, it will install OO.o this is imho wrong... in particular for xfce and lxde, that may want to use a lighter solution (check lxde-office pattern). i think, that Office pattern sould install "nothing" and call as "dependencie" $DE_office pattern something like "imaging" pattern..

what do you think about it?

I think "office" is defined as OpenOffice for typical users. You can of course still change it to be not that - lxde is not installed by typical users, so I don't see a clash there. Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Karsten König

17:09

I think coolo meant LXDE as a fresh project (inside of openSUSE that is) with a different userbase from the majority of openSUSE users, so Office is what most users expect installing "Office", it's the one with most feature parity to MS Office. And as a fresh project LXDE can see fit what they think people expect most from their "spin", and I agree OpenOffice.org really is fat beast, this wouldn't be proper for a lightweight desktop, but changing the "officepointer" for everybody would go a bit too far. Why not make an lxde_office pattern? Karsten Am Montag, 29. März 2010 19:34:19 schrieb James Mason:

...

Well, I suppose this is an argument about whether we are (a) integrating LXDE into openSUSE, or (b) integrating openSUSE into LXDE. I'd have to argue the first. And since openSUSE uses OpenOffice.org as the default office suite regardless of DE (we install by default OO.o on KDE despite KOffice), I don't see why that would be different for LXDE.

- James Mason 'bear454'

On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 1:49 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...
Am Sonntag 28 März 2010 schrieb Andrea Florio:

...
Hi people,

as you know, i'm working on LXDE into 11.3

i noticed a strange thing with Office pattern.

if you install office pattern, it will install OO.o this is imho wrong... in particular for xfce and lxde, that may want to use a lighter solution (check lxde-office pattern). i think, that Office pattern sould install "nothing" and call as "dependencie" $DE_office pattern something like "imaging" pattern..

what do you think about it?

I think "office" is defined as OpenOffice for typical users. You can of course still change it to be not that - lxde is not installed by typical users, so I don't see a clash there.

Greetings, Stephan

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Karsten König

17:24

Am Montag, 29. März 2010 20:09:28 schrieb Andrea Florio:

...

let me try to explain it better... a user, open yast and select "office pattern" it expect to install office applications that fit his DE. actually that pattern always install OO.o

imho, it should work as following

the user select "office pattern", if DE = kde --> patterns-openSUSE-kde_office if DE = gnome --> patterns-openSUSE-gnome_office if DE = xfce --> patterns-openSUSE-xfce_office if DE = lxde --> patterns-openSUSE-lxde_office

where of course, gnome and kde install OO.o and lxde (and maybe even xfce) will install lighter solutions like abiword,gnumeric ecc

That should solve even "tipical user" problem, because they use usually kde/gnome, but also fix all the other users that if use xfce/lxde of course do not want the heavy OO.o

i hope is a little bit more clear now.

I understood it that way, but will you install that based on the current running DE? because you can always install multiple DEs, so you can't querry for that. I think this will be confusing to people, let's say I used KDE before and now install LXDE on another system I want "office" to be the same on both without surprises. You can create a lightweight office pattern and/or use it for the live cd, but adding such nonobvious behaviour to the office pattern is contraproductive. Karsten

...

Il 29/03/2010 19:34, James Mason ha scritto:

...
Well, I suppose this is an argument about whether we are (a) integrating LXDE into openSUSE, or (b) integrating openSUSE into LXDE.

I'd have to argue the first. And since openSUSE uses OpenOffice.org

as the default office suite regardless of DE (we install by default OO.o on KDE despite KOffice), I don't see why that would be different for LXDE.

- James Mason 'bear454'

of course we are integrating LXDE into openSUSE, but is still true i would like to provide a perfect integration, based to user wishes:

http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-lxde/2010-02/msg00000.html

Best Regards Andrea Florio

...
On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 1:49 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...
Am Sonntag 28 März 2010 schrieb Andrea Florio:

...
Hi people,

as you know, i'm working on LXDE into 11.3

i noticed a strange thing with Office pattern.

if you install office pattern, it will install OO.o this is imho wrong... in particular for xfce and lxde, that may want to use a lighter solution (check lxde-office pattern). i think, that Office pattern sould install "nothing" and call as "dependencie" $DE_office pattern something like "imaging" pattern..

what do you think about it?

I think "office" is defined as OpenOffice for typical users. You can of course still change it to be not that - lxde is not installed by typical users, so I don't see a clash there.

Greetings, Stephan

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

James Mason

17:34

Well, I suppose this is an argument about whether we are (a) integrating LXDE into openSUSE, or (b) integrating openSUSE into LXDE. I'd have to argue the first. And since openSUSE uses OpenOffice.org as the default office suite regardless of DE (we install by default OO.o on KDE despite KOffice), I don't see why that would be different for LXDE. - James Mason 'bear454' On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 1:49 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...

Am Sonntag 28 März 2010 schrieb Andrea Florio:

...
Hi people,

as you know, i'm working on LXDE into 11.3

i noticed a strange thing with Office pattern.

if you install office pattern, it will install OO.o this is imho wrong... in particular for xfce and lxde, that may want to use a lighter solution (check lxde-office pattern). i think, that Office pattern sould install "nothing" and call as "dependencie" $DE_office pattern something like "imaging" pattern..

what do you think about it?

I think "office" is defined as OpenOffice for typical users. You can of course still change it to be not that - lxde is not installed by typical users, so I don't see a clash there.

Greetings, Stephan

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Andrea Florio

18:09

let me try to explain it better... a user, open yast and select "office pattern" it expect to install office applications that fit his DE. actually that pattern always install OO.o imho, it should work as following the user select "office pattern", if DE = kde --> patterns-openSUSE-kde_office if DE = gnome --> patterns-openSUSE-gnome_office if DE = xfce --> patterns-openSUSE-xfce_office if DE = lxde --> patterns-openSUSE-lxde_office where of course, gnome and kde install OO.o and lxde (and maybe even xfce) will install lighter solutions like abiword,gnumeric ecc That should solve even "tipical user" problem, because they use usually kde/gnome, but also fix all the other users that if use xfce/lxde of course do not want the heavy OO.o i hope is a little bit more clear now. Il 29/03/2010 19:34, James Mason ha scritto:

...

Well, I suppose this is an argument about whether we are (a) integrating LXDE into openSUSE, or (b) integrating openSUSE into LXDE. I'd have to argue the first. And since openSUSE uses OpenOffice.org as the default office suite regardless of DE (we install by default OO.o on KDE despite KOffice), I don't see why that would be different for LXDE.

- James Mason 'bear454'

of course we are integrating LXDE into openSUSE, but is still true i would like to provide a perfect integration, based to user wishes: http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-lxde/2010-02/msg00000.html Best Regards Andrea Florio

...

On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 1:49 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:

...
Am Sonntag 28 März 2010 schrieb Andrea Florio:

...
Hi people,

as you know, i'm working on LXDE into 11.3

i noticed a strange thing with Office pattern.

if you install office pattern, it will install OO.o this is imho wrong... in particular for xfce and lxde, that may want to use a lighter solution (check lxde-office pattern). i think, that Office pattern sould install "nothing" and call as "dependencie" $DE_office pattern something like "imaging" pattern..

what do you think about it?

I think "office" is defined as OpenOffice for typical users. You can of course still change it to be not that - lxde is not installed by typical users, so I don't see a clash there.

Greetings, Stephan

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-- ------------------------------------------ Andrea Florio QSI International School of Brindisi Sys Admin CISCO CCNA Certified openSUSE-Education Administrator openSUSE Official Member (anubisg1) Email: andrea@opensuse.org Packman Packaging Team Email: andrea@links2linux.de Web: http://packman.links2linux.org/ Cell: +39-328-7365667 ------------------------------------------ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Rajko M.

30 Mar 30 Mar

00:46

On Monday 29 March 2010 12:24:54 Karsten König wrote:

...

You can create a lightweight office pattern and/or use it for the live cd, but adding such nonobvious behaviour to the office pattern is contraproductive.

I use KDE, but it was long ago that I installed Koffice as office suite and even then it was just to try it out. DE as condition to install "appropriate" software including office is not good idea from user point of view. Using lightweight desktop doesn't reveal the reasons for that. I can choose light desktop to make room in RAM, or ease CPU load, or compensate for old graphic card, but still want to run my favorite software not the one provided by desktop. Having pattern "LXDE office" that will be dependency only for pattern "All of LXDE", but not "LXDE base" is good idea. To make it universally applicable the name should be "Light office", so other desktop patterns can reuse it. -- Regards Rajko, -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Vincent Untz

10:15

Le lundi 29 mars 2010, à 10:34 -0700, James Mason a écrit :

...

Well, I suppose this is an argument about whether we are (a) integrating LXDE into openSUSE, or (b) integrating openSUSE into LXDE. I'd have to argue the first. And since openSUSE uses OpenOffice.org as the default office suite regardless of DE (we install by default OO.o on KDE despite KOffice), I don't see why that would be different for LXDE.

If the LXDE team wants to use something else than OOo on default openSUSE-LXDE installation, then why would we try to force them to not do this? I'm not aware of a rule saying "you must have OOo to be on an openSUSE system". My understanding is that the LXDE team wants to have the LXDE default install to be the most lightweight possible. Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Stefan Seyfried

10:54

On Tue, 30 Mar 2010 12:15:16 +0200 Vincent Untz wrote:

...

My understanding is that the LXDE team wants to have the LXDE default install to be the most lightweight possible.

Yes, agreed. But if I, as a user, select "LXDE" and then additionally select the "office" Pattern - I also think that adding openoffice then is the sensible thing to do. -- Stefan Seyfried "Any ideas, John?" "Well, surrounding them's out." -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

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participants (7)

Andrea Florio
James Mason
Karsten König
Rajko M.
Stefan Seyfried
Stephan Kulow
Vincent Untz