[opensuse-factory] removal of obsolete packages (here: gstreamer-0_10)
Hi, this is about gstreamer-0_10 but may also relate to other packages, especially libraries. The current version in factory is 1.4 and the 0.10 series is no longer maintained upstream since 2013 (source: homepage). There are still lots of packages which directly or indirectly depend on the old version. I like to discuss how to proceed to get factory free of the 0.10 version. I started to file some bug reports against packages which directly depend on the old library - wine was the most obvious and easily fixable. Other packages are harder to fix because newer versions break ABI and for some reasons upstream wasn't ported. There are several possibilities: (1) package can easily build against new ABI (2) package can be build against new ABI, but patch is only in upstream (3) upstream does not have a patch but porting is easy (4) upstream does not have a patch because it is unmaintained or not willing to port (5) package/pattern suggests/recommends (does not depends on it) gstreamer-0_10 for no good reason (6) other reasons To solve (1), every maintainer of a package/pattern in question should check if a rebuild is possible. For (2), a new package version would be required. I don't have experience in porting to the new ABI, so (3) is up to the maintainer (port yourself or remove the package). The latter is the only option for (4). (5) can be subtle because you also have to check suggests/recommands. I ran the following command to get a primarily list: zypper if --recommends --suggests "*?" | grep -B20 "gstreamer-0_10" There are likely better methods the generate such a list.
From there I can see that e.g. patterns-openSUSE-gnome_multimedia recommends gstreamer-0_10-plugins-base but it does not depend on it. Still zypper will install it during "zypper up" so you'll get a bunch of packages which you don't need.
Before I start another mass bug filing attempt, I thought it was a good idea to first bring this topic to this list. Marc -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2015-04-20 at 09:58 +0200, Marc Dietrich wrote:
Hi,
this is about gstreamer-0_10 but may also relate to other packages, especially libraries. The current version in factory is 1.4 and the 0.10 series is no longer maintained upstream since 2013 (source: homepage). There are still lots of packages which directly or indirectly depend on the old version. I like to discuss how to proceed to get factory free of the 0.10 version.
I started to file some bug reports against packages which directly depend on the old library - wine was the most obvious and easily fixable. Other packages are harder to fix because newer versions break ABI and for some reasons upstream wasn't ported.
There are several possibilities: (1) package can easily build against new ABI (2) package can be build against new ABI, but patch is only in upstream (3) upstream does not have a patch but porting is easy (4) upstream does not have a patch because it is unmaintained or not willing to port (5) package/pattern suggests/recommends (does not depends on it) gstreamer-0_10 for no good reason (6) other reasons
To solve (1), every maintainer of a package/pattern in question should check if a rebuild is possible. For (2), a new package version would be required. I don't have experience in porting to the new ABI, so (3) is up to the maintainer (port yourself or remove the package). The latter is the only option for (4). (5) can be subtle because you also have to check suggests/recommands. I ran the following command to get a primarily list:
zypper if --recommends --suggests "*?" | grep -B20 "gstreamer-0_10"
There are likely better methods the generate such a list.
From there I can see that e.g. patterns-openSUSE-gnome_multimedia recommends gstreamer-0_10-plugins-base but it does not depend on it. Still zypper will install it during "zypper up" so you'll get a bunch of packages which you don't need.
Before I start another mass bug filing attempt, I thought it was a good idea to first bring this topic to this list.
Marc, Thanks for bringing this up again - it is appreciated that I am not alone with this wish. It's actually been a long standing issue, as far back as in 13.1 we declared it as a goal: https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Goals_13.1/Port_to_GStreamer_1.0 There were way too many at the time still depending on Gst 0.10 Luckily, the situation changed by now and it got better. Would it be possible to get an overview just as the one above with respective links wherever upstream has patches (if you find them that is). Once we know exactly what packages we really have to care for, we can take the decision much easier, instead of a meta-discussion that it would be good to get rid of it (off my head I know that pidgin's patch set is in a terrible state - we had that for a while, but reverted, and xfce still has an applet that depends on it - there were plans to get a PA frontend, not sure what the situation is there by now). Dominique -- Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger <dimstar@opensuse.org>
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger schrieb:
Thanks for bringing this up again - it is appreciated that I am not alone with this wish.
It's actually been a long standing issue, as far back as in 13.1 we declared it as a goal: https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Goals_13.1/Port_to_GStreamer_1.0
To track changes in several packages related to one topic it worked quite well for me to open individual bugs in bugzilla. I also always created a tracker bug assigned to me that is blocked by all the others. That way you can get a nice overview by looking at the dependencies of the tracker bug. The combination with a wiki article like the one you have looks really compelling. Maybe something like this would be useful to have in our wiki: https://github.com/mozilla/mediawiki-bugzilla cu Ludwig -- (o_ Ludwig Nussel //\ V_/_ http://www.suse.de/ SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard, Jennifer Guild, Dilip Upmanyu, Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstraße 5; 90409 Nürnberg; Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
Would it be possible to get an overview just as the one above with respective links wherever upstream has patches (if you find them that is). Once we know exactly what packages we really have to care for, we can take the decision much easier, instead of a meta-discussion that it would be good to get rid of it (off my head I know that pidgin's patch set is in a terrible state - we had that for a while, but reverted, and xfce still has an applet that depends on it - there were plans to get a PA frontend, not sure what the situation is there by now).
There is a quick way to check all packages for possible source-level compatibility with gstreamer-1.0: - Create a new OBS project. - Create a special prjconf: Substitute: gstreamer-0_10-devel gstreamer-1_0-devel .. and the same for all other sub-packages. - Link there all packages that have gstreamer-0_10* in BuildRequires. If such experiment makes sense, I could create it. I did something similar for wxWidgets in past. -- Best Regards / S pozdravem, Stanislav Brabec software developer --------------------------------------------------------------------- SUSE LINUX, s. r. o. e-mail: sbrabec@suse.cz Lihovarská 1060/12 tel: +49 911 7405384547 190 00 Praha 9 fax: +420 284 084 001 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz/ PGP: 830B 40D5 9E05 35D8 5E27 6FA3 717C 209F A04F CD76 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Fri, 2015-04-24 at 14:29 +0200, Stanislav Brabec wrote:
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
Would it be possible to get an overview just as the one above with respective links wherever upstream has patches (if you find them that is). Once we know exactly what packages we really have to care for, we can take the decision much easier, instead of a meta-discussion that it would be good to get rid of it (off my head I know that pidgin's patch set is in a terrible state - we had that for a while, but reverted, and xfce still has an applet that depends on it - there were plans to get a PA frontend, not sure what the situation is there by now).
There is a quick way to check all packages for possible source-level compatibility with gstreamer-1.0:
- Create a new OBS project. - Create a special prjconf: Substitute: gstreamer-0_10-devel gstreamer-1_0-devel .. and the same for all other sub-packages. - Link there all packages that have gstreamer-0_10* in BuildRequires.
If such experiment makes sense, I could create it. I did something similar for wxWidgets in past.
Hi Stanislav, Can be worthy to do, just to get an overview again... generally, there should not be that much eft:
zypper se -t srcpackage --requires gstreamer-0 | grep -v gstreamer- 0_10 Loading repository data... Reading installed packages...
S | Name | Summary | Type --+-------------------------------+------------------------------------ -------------------------+----------- | fillmore-lombard | Audio and Video Editors for GNOME | srcpackage | florence | Extensible scalable on-screen virtual keyboard | srcpackage | gnac | Audio converter for GNOME | srcpackage | gtkpod | A platform independent GUI for the Apple® iPod® | srcpackage | istanbul | Istanbul desktop session recorder | srcpackage | openfetion | IM Client for the Fetion protocol | srcpackage | pidgin | Multiprotocol Instant Messaging Client | srcpackage | pidgin-sipe | Pidgin protocol plugin to connect to MS Office Communicator | srcpackage | bundle-lang-common | Translations for a Group of Programs | srcpackage | bundle-lang-gnome | Translations for many GNOME programs | srcpackage | libnice | Interactive Connectivity Establishment implementation | srcpackage | ARToolKit_gst | Augmented Reality Tracking Library | srcpackage That's of course only the ones directly requiting it.. but that's already a good starting point. Out of those I know: * pidgin: version 3.0 should resolve this. Patches landed in the tree, but backporting seems a bit a mess. * fillmore-lombard: that can probably be dropped anyway - there is no real activity upstream and this is just bitrotting The others I don't know their status by heart. Dominique -- Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger <dimstar@opensuse.org>
Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
Hi Stanislav,
Can be worthy to do, just to get an overview again... generally, there should not be that much eft:
https://build.opensuse.org/project/monitor/home:sbrabec:branches:migrate-fro... There can be both false matches (succeeds but disables gstreamer support at all, succeeds because experimental substitution did not catch everything) and false failure (requirement mapping is more complicated). In general, the failure ratio shows, that dropping gstreamer-0_10 is not possible without porting or dropping of ancient packages. -- Best Regards / S pozdravem, Stanislav Brabec software developer --------------------------------------------------------------------- SUSE LINUX, s. r. o. e-mail: sbrabec@suse.cz Lihovarská 1060/12 tel: +49 911 7405384547 190 00 Praha 9 fax: +420 284 084 001 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz/ PGP: 830B 40D5 9E05 35D8 5E27 6FA3 717C 209F A04F CD76 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Le vendredi 24 avril 2015 à 14:29 +0200, Stanislav Brabec a écrit :
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
Would it be possible to get an overview just as the one above with respective links wherever upstream has patches (if you find them that is). Once we know exactly what packages we really have to care for, we can take the decision much easier, instead of a meta-discussion that it would be good to get rid of it (off my head I know that pidgin's patch set is in a terrible state - we had that for a while, but reverted, and xfce still has an applet that depends on it - there were plans to get a PA frontend, not sure what the situation is there by now).
There is a quick way to check all packages for possible source-level compatibility with gstreamer-1.0:
There is no point in testing that: gstreamer 1.0 is NOT API compatible with 0.10,(that was there was a version bump).. -- Frederic Crozat Project Manager Enterprise Desktop SUSE -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Fri, 2015-04-24 at 14:42 +0200, Frederic Crozat wrote:
Le vendredi 24 avril 2015 à 14:29 +0200, Stanislav Brabec a écrit :
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
Would it be possible to get an overview just as the one above with respective links wherever upstream has patches (if you find them that is). Once we know exactly what packages we really have to care for, we can take the decision much easier, instead of a meta-discussion that it would be good to get rid of it (off my head I know that pidgin's patch set is in a terrible state - we had that for a while, but reverted, and xfce still has an applet that depends on it - there were plans to get a PA frontend, not sure what the situation is there by now).
There is a quick way to check all packages for possible source- level compatibility with gstreamer-1.0:
There is no point in testing that: gstreamer 1.0 is NOT API compatible with 0.10,(that was there was a version bump)..
It *might* show us packages that could be switched, because upstream already supports both, but we never did the switch... that's about the only thing of course it would work for. Dominique -- Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger <dimstar@opensuse.org>
Am 24.04.2015 um 14:47 schrieb Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger:
It *might* show us packages that could be switched, because upstream already supports both, but we never did the switch... that's about the only thing of course it would work for.
I did, for example, switch handbrake (on packman) to use gstreamer-1.0 for openSUSE > 11.4 It supports both (just by checking in configure), but since gstreamer-0_10 was buildrequired, it was always built against and using the old API And that's another thing to consider: We also need to make sure that packman also no longer depends on gstreamer-0_10 :-) Best regards, Stefan -- Stefan Seyfried "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." -- Richard Feynman -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
On Friday 2015-04-24 14:42, Frederic Crozat wrote:
There is a quick way to check all packages for possible source-level compatibility with gstreamer-1.0:
There is no point in testing that: gstreamer 1.0 is NOT API compatible with 0.10,(that was there was a version bump)..
But perhaps some affected code just so happens to only use those parts of the API that really did not change wxWidgets 3 is also incompatible to its 2.8 predecessor, but only in so many ways. :) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
Am Freitag, 24. April 2015, 14:29:22 schrieb Stanislav Brabec:
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger wrote:
Would it be possible to get an overview just as the one above with respective links wherever upstream has patches (if you find them that is). Once we know exactly what packages we really have to care for, we can take the decision much easier, instead of a meta-discussion that it would be good to get rid of it (off my head I know that pidgin's patch set is in a terrible state - we had that for a while, but reverted, and xfce still has an applet that depends on it - there were plans to get a PA frontend, not sure what the situation is there by now).
There is a quick way to check all packages for possible source-level compatibility with gstreamer-1.0:
- Create a new OBS project. - Create a special prjconf: Substitute: gstreamer-0_10-devel gstreamer-1_0-devel .. and the same for all other sub-packages. - Link there all packages that have gstreamer-0_10* in BuildRequires.
If such experiment makes sense, I could create it. I did something similar for wxWidgets in past.
Why not just remove gstreamer-0_10 alltogether and fix the fallouts? Of course, this is only recommended after a new stable series has branched (e.g. not now). Marc -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org
participants (7)
-
Dimstar / Dominique Leuenberger -
Frederic Crozat -
Jan Engelhardt -
Ludwig Nussel -
Marc Dietrich -
Stanislav Brabec -
Stefan Seyfried