Op 08-06-10 13:59, Oddball schreef:

Op 07-06-10 23:13, Stefan Quandt schreef:

...

Hi,

after an update from 11.2 to 11.3 M7 moving the cursor with the touchpad only.works if when using more then one finger. (also tap-to-click was initially disabled and I cannot get double-click enabled at all)

While playing around I found out that the touchpad works normally in kdm and for unknown reason switches to "two-finger-mode" during KDE startup.

Then I had to learn, that when logging in as any other user moving the cursor with the touchpad works normally. So the I concluded the cause could be the user specific toucpad config file. So i moved .kde4/share/config/synaptiksrc out of the way.

But ... this did not change anything. Any idea what's going wrong here?

Thanks Stefan

I did a fresh install just now, and here tapping is disabled also. eeepc 900 Might be a bug I did not create another user yet.

Over here during installation it did not work also, when wanting to use pad, i had to use the button to activate, select or choose. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 15:00, C wrote:

On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 13:59, Oddball wrote:

...

Op 07-06-10 23:13, Stefan Quandt schreef:

...

after an update from 11.2 to 11.3 M7 moving the cursor with the touchpad only.works if when using more then one finger. (also tap-to-click was initially disabled and I cannot get double-click enabled at all)

While playing around I found out that the touchpad works normally in kdm and for unknown reason switches to "two-finger-mode" during KDE startup.

Then I had to learn, that when logging in as any other user moving the cursor with the touchpad works normally. So the I concluded the cause could be the user specific toucpad config file. So i moved .kde4/share/config/synaptiksrc out of the way.

But ... this did not change anything. Any idea what's going wrong here?

I did a fresh install just now, and here tapping is disabled also. eeepc 900 Might be a bug I did not create another user yet.

See this bug report: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=554884

Short version is, touchpad tap was disabled in X to make it consistant with Gnome defaults.  KDE does not enable/disable by default instead picking up on whatever X is configured to do.  So since touchpad tap is now disabled, KDE picks up on that "new" setting and no more touchpad tap.

You have to install Synaptiks or kcm_touchpad to be able to enable touchpad tap and other touchpad behaviors you're used to with KDE4 in 11.2.

This doesn't answer the odd two finger mode thing... just the touchpad tap issue. C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 19:04, Oddball wrote:

...

See this bug report: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=554884

Short version is, touchpad tap was disabled in X to make it consistant with Gnome defaults.  KDE does not enable/disable by default instead picking up on whatever X is configured to do.  So since touchpad tap is now disabled, KDE picks up on that "new" setting and no more touchpad tap.

You have to install Synaptiks or kcm_touchpad to be able to enable touchpad tap and other touchpad behaviors you're used to with KDE4 in 11.2.

By the way, don't install both when you're testing 11.3. I've found that they fight a bit with each other - odd error messages etc. It works fine if you install kcm_touchpad, and you've got loads of options (eg turning touchpad off when you're typing which is almost a must for most people). I dont' see much difference between Synaptiks and kcm_touchpad.. minor stuff.. but nothing that stands out to make one more desirable over the other. C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Il 21/06/2010 13:55, Oddball ha scritto:

C schreef:

...

On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 19:04, Oddball wrote:

...

...

See this bug report: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=554884

Short version is, touchpad tap was disabled in X to make it consistant with Gnome defaults. KDE does not enable/disable by default instead picking up on whatever X is configured to do. So since touchpad tap is now disabled, KDE picks up on that "new" setting and no more touchpad tap.

You have to install Synaptiks or kcm_touchpad to be able to enable touchpad tap and other touchpad behaviors you're used to with KDE4 in 11.2.

By the way, don't install both when you're testing 11.3. I've found that they fight a bit with each other - odd error messages etc. It works fine if you install kcm_touchpad, and you've got loads of options (eg turning touchpad off when you're typing which is almost a must for most people). I dont' see much difference between Synaptiks and kcm_touchpad.. minor stuff.. but nothing that stands out to make one more desirable over the other.

C.

Well, this morning i found myself time to test some 11.3 on eee-pc again, try to solve issues like: OSD on blue-tooth/on/off > Wifi/on/off, both on/off, the wifi issue about configuering and connecting, and ofcourse: the touchpad..... pffff.

searching for kcm_touchpad in the automatic added repo's showed: zilch! (n-r) Trying synaptiks, showed it was already installed.. Ok, but now how to find it to configure? Terminal? no! Yast hardware? No!, Mouse? No!, Systemsettings? No!

I would like essential settings config found more easily......

Does anyone know how to 'open/invoke' synaptiks to get this touchpad going?

i found my final solution editing /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/20-synaptics.conf Andrea - -- - ------------------------------------------ Andrea Florio QSI International School of Brindisi Sys Admin CISCO CCNA Certified openSUSE-Education Administrator openSUSE Official Member (anubisg1) Email: andrea@opensuse.org Packman Packaging Team Email: andrea@links2linux.de Web: http://packman.links2linux.org/ Cell: +39-328-7365667 - ------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.15 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkwfVloACgkQyCZT87TFPugzRgCfUiu+eCbWP2/LKanC80MNin2C tgUAoJrKnek6GRZPpceybYwavStrt2Xz =34aV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 13:55, Oddball wrote:

Well, this morning i found myself time to test some 11.3 on eee-pc again, try to solve issues like: OSD on blue-tooth/on/off > Wifi/on/off, both on/off, the wifi issue about configuering and connecting, and ofcourse: the touchpad..... pffff.

searching for kcm_touchpad in the automatic added repo's showed: zilch! (n-r) Trying synaptiks, showed it was already installed.. Ok, but now how to find it to configure? Terminal? no! Yast hardware? No!, Mouse? No!, Systemsettings? No!

I would like essential settings config found more easily......

Does anyone know how to 'open/invoke' synaptiks to get this touchpad going?

All this because someone thought that gnome users would be confused if touchpad tap worked in the installer and no longer worked once Gnome was up and running (it's off by default in Gnome, and Gnome provides easy GUI to turn it on/off.. .KDE4 does not). :-( Sigh. Guessing... kcm_touchpad should be included in the default repositories and it should be included in the default install. Without it (or the alternative Synaptiks) KDE4 users are left without a way to enable touchpad tap - basically enabling a behavior which is standard on all other modern OSes. Synaptiks works, but as you discovered getting the daemon started can be a pain.... although... last I tested it, I just launched it once from the KMenu after installing and it worked. Once it's running you should have a new entry in Configure Desktop > Keyboard & Mouse. On any system I've tested on, Synaptiks added its own entry at the top level of this settings page, and kcm_touchpad added the touchpad optiosn to the Mouse sub-page (a more logical place). I've swapped over to using kcm_touchpad which is currently in the KDE4:Community repository. C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Le lundi 21 juin 2010, à 14:43 +0200, Vincent Untz a écrit :

Le lundi 21 juin 2010, à 14:39 +0200, C a écrit :

...

All this because someone thought that gnome users would be confused if touchpad tap worked in the installer and no longer worked once Gnome was up and running (it's off by default in Gnome, and Gnome provides easy GUI to turn it on/off.. .KDE4 does not). :-(

Sigh.

Yes, that's what we call consistency in user experience.

Just to clarify: I'm not being ironic here. The tap-to-click setting should be the same everywhere by default. It might seem like a little detail, but that matters a lot in the impression people get. I happen to agree that disabled by default makes more sense for many users, btw. (sorry for not being more explicit in my first mail) Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

* C [2010-06-21 14:59]:

But.. isn't that backwards? You're saying it's a consistent user experience for a user to come from another OS (be it WIndows, OSX etc) where touchpad tap is enabled by default...

It's disabled per default on Mac OS, at least on newer ones. You have to press down explicitely (people who know the Mac mousepad know what I mean) which confused me when I first used a Mac, BTW. Regards, Bernhard -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Le lundi 21 juin 2010, à 14:59 +0200, C a écrit :

But.. isn't that backwards? You're saying it's a consistent user experience for a user to come from another OS (be it WIndows, OSX etc) where touchpad tap is enabled by default... to one where it's now disabled?. That's not a consistent user experience at all.

I'm not saying we should be consistent with Windows or OS X. I don't know what the default settings are there. I'm saying that we should be consistent in our user experience. And my personal opinion (disabled by default) is based on seeing people getting confused when something clicks on the screen while they didn't press a button: it harms more the people who don't expect this behavior when it is enabled by default than the people who expect it when it is disabled by default. Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Monday 21 June 2010 15:16:32 C wrote:

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 15:06, Vincent Untz wrote:

...

Le lundi 21 juin 2010, à 14:59 +0200, C a écrit :

...

But.. isn't that backwards? You're saying it's a consistent user experience for a user to come from another OS (be it WIndows, OSX etc) where touchpad tap is enabled by default... to one where it's now disabled?. That's not a consistent user experience at all.

I'm not saying we should be consistent with Windows or OS X. I don't know what the default settings are there. I'm saying that we should be consistent in our user experience.

And my personal opinion (disabled by default) is based on seeing people getting confused when something clicks on the screen while they didn't press a button: it harms more the people who don't expect this behavior when it is enabled by default than the people who expect it when it is disabled by default.

Good point... that is actually the reason I went hunting for some way to control the touchpad tap in 11.2... adding a 1 or 2 second delay after typing stops to enable the touchpad really helps with this.

Like I said.. I'm on the fence with the default... and as long as there's a way to re-enable it in the major DEs, we're covered... sadly the KDE4 solution is rather... poor... unless kcm_touchpad (preferred) or Synaptiks (second choice) is installed by default with KDE4.

C.

For KDE synaptiks _is_ installed by default on 11.3. To configure your touchpad: Systemsettings -> Keyboard & Mouse -> Touchpad Christian -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 16:04, Oddball wrote:

...

For KDE synaptiks _is_ installed by default on 11.3. To configure your touchpad: Systemsettings -> Keyboard & Mouse -> Touchpad

Christian

Offcourse you are right....

I am deeply ashamed! I did look there, but i had to scroll down (with left button down while dragging) to get to that section.. All that fuss about nothing, i had simply could have resized that window, to see all options at once... Options enough, np at all.. I am glad this works now ;-) My thanx are crushing..

Ha, or you could be like me spouting off about it not working.. although... I swear it wasn't working for me in the last milestone (which is why this was bugging me)... haven't installed the RC successfully yet. Plan on trying it all again tonight. Some days I shouldn't chew through the restraints.... C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

C schreef:

All this because someone thought that gnome users would be confused if touchpad tap worked in the installer and no longer worked once Gnome was up and running (it's off by default in Gnome, and Gnome provides easy GUI to turn it on/off.. .KDE4 does not). :-(

Sigh.

Guessing... kcm_touchpad should be included in the default repositories and it should be included in the default install. Without it (or the alternative Synaptiks) KDE4 users are left without a way to enable touchpad tap - basically enabling a behavior which is standard on all other modern OSes.

In 11.2 it just works, but causes during installation a lot of pain, especialy when wanting to edit partitions etc.. It caused me to start over the installation 5 times because of the unjust actions taken by mouseover/selecting/choosing > wrong action: an error has occured > ncurses > start installation etc.. I learned only to use alt+underlinedsymbol in 11.2, but in 11.3 it did not work anymore, i just found the button configured too sensetive in 11.2....

Synaptiks works, but as you discovered getting the daemon started can be a pain.... although... last I tested it, I just launched it once from the KMenu after installing and it worked.

No entrance in Kmenu here...

Once it's running you should have a new entry in Configure Desktop > Keyboard & Mouse. On any system I've tested on, Synaptiks added its own entry at the top level of this settings page, and kcm_touchpad added the touchpad optiosn to the Mouse sub-page (a more logical place). I've swapped over to using kcm_touchpad which is currently in the KDE4:Community repository.

C.

I'll try to install kcm_touchpad from community than.. The plasma desktop in KDE4 inn 11.3M7 has only: Configure desktop activity. A mouse can be configured there, but no touchpad... -- Enjoy your time around, Oddball, aka M9. OS: Linux 2.6.27.19-3.2-default x86_64 Huidige gebruiker: oddball@AMD64x2-sfn1 Systeem: openSUSE 11.1 (x86_64) KDE: 4.2.1 (KDE 4.2.1) "release 103" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

C schreef:

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 15:06, Oddball wrote:

...

In 11.2 it just works, but causes during installation a lot of pain,

Yes, because it was enabled in X. KDE4 picks up on whatever X is set to. If it's enabled in X, then KDE4 has it enabled. This was explained a little in the bug report https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=554884

I understand that perfectly.. With the old synaptics driver, included with W2K on my old Compaq E500, the sensitivity of the pad to use the buttons (tapping) could be set, but the W2K original driver was ok. If the sensitivity is too high, it is nearly impossible to 'dose' the pressure needed for a click. It clicks unintended that way. It is not nessesarly 'default' to have 'too sensitive' tapping enebled? Sensibility or impossible to use seem not opposite to me ...: Sensative - Least sensitive, On - Off.

...

especialy when wanting to edit partitions etc.. It caused me to start over the installation 5 times because of the unjust actions taken by mouseover/selecting/choosing > wrong action: an error has occured > ncurses > start installation etc.. I learned only to use alt+underlinedsymbol in 11.2, but in 11.3 it did not work anymore, i just found the button configured too sensitive in 11.2....

Or you're like me and have lazy thumbs that drift close to the touchpad while you're typing. :-)

The keyboard of 900 eee-pc's are inferior (too small) to fi psion, which have excellent keyboards.

...

I'll try to install kcm_touchpad from community than..

It should work... I'm not running openSUSE 11.3 on my EEE right now... got another Linux distro installed on it this week. It worked when I was running 11.3M7 on it last week.

C.

Over here 11.2 is freshly installed and 11.3M7. Both wifi donot work as should (bit strange for an ultra-light-moveble laptop/netbook (psion still owns that name as far as i know..) -- Enjoy your time around, Oddball, aka M9. OS: Linux 2.6.27.19-3.2-default x86_64 Huidige gebruiker: oddball@AMD64x2-sfn1 Systeem: openSUSE 11.1 (x86_64) KDE: 4.2.1 (KDE 4.2.1) "release 103" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 15:37, Martin Schlander wrote:

Synaptiks is included by default in 11.3 KDE installations, and it is located in systemsettings -> Keyboard & Mouse -> Touchpad

I stand corrected then :-) Although... hmmmm it wasn't working in M7... I'll have to reinstall the latest RC tonight and see if I can duplicate it.

kcm_touchpad is dead afaik. Don't know why anyone would prefer it over synaptiks anyway.

It integrated into the KDE config better... it didn't put a big grey ugly icon in my system tray... it didn't pop up random errors.. then again... the probs I was having could have been entirely related to having both Synaptiks and kcm_touchpad installed at the same time. Getting the Synaptiks backend to start is a pain - several times I had Synaptiks installed and available in the KDE config menu, but greyed out and a message that said something to the effect of the daemon could not be started. I'll test again. C. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org