Andreas Jaeger wrote:
On 09/26/2012 07:09 PM, Per Jessen wrote:
Just in case no one else has noticed - there is absolutely no (0, zero) benefit to anyone (user/admin/developer/packager/whoever) in omitting syslog from the default pattern/install. Yet it was suggested and we have been discussing it for quite some time now. I submit it should never have been suggested and certainly not discussed without someone arguing _why_ it is of benefit to the end user and hence worthwhile doing.
I think the suggestion was completely pointless and in the end only caused unnecessary consternation among those openSUSE users that have a use for syslog. The majority of the default openSUSE users (90% according to the thread) don't care anyway, so why waste effort on upsetting the 10%?
Per, let's not continue bike shedding here. Let's collect the facts first and then decide.
Andreas, please, this is not "bikeshedding". There are no technical details here. This is about whether there is any point at all in the proposed change (and if so, why no one has argued it so far).
Here's a quick intro about the journal: [snip] Per, is anything I state in the above wrong?
No, it isn't wrong, but it is also not relevant in this context. If you want to continue the discussion, please start by informing everyone exactly which benefits 90% percent of our users will reap from not having syslog installed by default. (Personally speaking, I am not convinced that "the stand-alone desktop is the primary target of openSUSE", but that is a very different topic)
If not, then let's discuss to your initial point: Removal of syslog.
Actually, that is not my point. I don't really care if syslog is removed from the default pattern(s), although it does mean a little more work for me. However, I want to know _why_ it should be removed, in particular how the removal would benefit the majority of our users. To those who have never worked in a commercial setting, this is what is usually known as the business case. So far, I haven't seen anything remotely resembling a business case. -- Per Jessen, Zürich (12.6°C) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org