On 8/4/19 9:16 PM, L A Walsh wrote:
On 2019/08/04 02:46, Simon Lees wrote:
Further to that no one has put in any effort to making it possible to use an init system other then systemd in openSUSE (Several years back a small group started some work on this and quickly decided it would take more effort then they had time to put in so they stopped).
so as a result of that it is safe for developers / packagers / anyone else to assume that systemd is the only init system available on openSUSE and relevant to this discussion that by the time PID 1 is started /usr will be part of the filesystem.
I find that mounting /usr/{bin,lib,lib64,sbin} on /{...}, is relatively trivial** on my setup.
FWIW, I mount /usr in the 1st boot script to maximize compatibility after that.
**--just because it is trival doesn't mean I would want to do it as it brings a cost. Rather than having a lightweight "miniboot"/rescue in root, I'd have a 65G partition at over 70% usage. Given how often I need to restore a file due to some self-inflicted shot in the foot, a restore would take significantly longer, if I had the disk space for it.
Whether I'm doing development or not, it's still true that I'm an engineer and scientist that experiments and sometimes needs to clean up a mess. AFAIK, systemd doesn't allow you to bring up your system to full running, for example, from an emergency boot.
To Be clear -- there are several good features in systemd that I like. I've said so for years, but I didn't like the way it was designed to be monolithic such that you have to accept it being pid 1 and its process control to get anything else.
I work on scripts to support undoing port-damage and my system. Most things are in the 'need to write code' phase, though I haven't fully thought through my 'init' replacement, as I need to provide a way to capture dead pids so I can provide them to a subscriber that might need them.
Just like linux allows multiple schedulers, and multiple security models, I can't see how resource control might not also be a place for multiple models.
It also seems a bit myopic to not provide a way for different monitors to have access to the list of dead pids caught by pid 1.
As for merging things. Have you thought of using a base of binaries in /bin that supports a miniroot, and then mounting /usr/bin via the overlay-fs, though you could mount /bin on /usr/bin and then mount the rest of usr/bin from another dir as an overlay over the original /usr/bin that contained boot+repair binaries).
I'm not saying that many of these things aren't possible or easy but openSUSE is a place where nothing will happen unless someone decides to do it, and currently no one is deciding to put the effort into maintaining and supporting anything other then systemd on openSUSE. Honestly whatever your doing in your personal setup is irrelevant here unless you wish to start packaging and supporting it for openSUSE. This is the openSUSE development list where the people working on openSUSE discuss the future development of openSUSE. So far I can't see where any of the points you raise are relevant to this discussion. -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org