29 Feb
2020
29 Feb
'20
19:24
On 2020-02-29 19:51, Hans-Peter Jansen wrote: > Am Samstag, 29. Februar 2020, 16:22:01 CET schrieb Frans de Boer: >> On 2020-02-29 16:01, Marcus Meissner wrote: >>> On Sat, Feb 29, 2020 at 02:00:37PM +0100, Frans de Boer wrote: >>>> LS, >>>> >>>> Just installed the beta version of leap15.2, just to see if there is >>>> anything too upgrade for. >>>> Nope, just a new kernel and may some other new or updated packages, but >>>> even glibc stays ancient, just as many other packages. Thus keeping >>>> leap15.2 as slow as leap15.1 which is 4 times slower then TW for >>>> mathematics due to the ancient glibc library and possible the very >>>> ancient gcc tool set. >>>> >>>> But, maybe I am pessimistic and can someone correct me? >>> It sounds like you would be more happy with Tumbleweeds bleeding edge? >>> >>> Ciao, Marcus >> Very much more happy. I just don't understand why so much effort is made >> - or in my view energy wasted - to make a "new" distribution, based on >> years of old/ancient (core) packages. I, however, can understand that >> one would take a snapshot of TW and iron out some bugs and let that live >> for some time. That sounds more productive then reverting to 3-4 years >> old packages. >> >> The thing is, I do like to have a stable distribution in case TW >> sometimes misfired. But using a distro which uses 3-4- years old >> packages - and after 8 months being even 4-5 years or more - can only be >> used as a last resort. > I beg to differ, Frans, efforts in openSUSE are relatively good managed, with > a low waste factor. > > I'm a TW lover, and push it even to some of my customer's desktops/notebooks > (those, who can deal with strong moving targets, and want to use Linux in the > first place). > > OTOH, Leap is *perfect* for servers, and that other part of users, that still > wants to use a sane OS. > > Nobody wants to deal with the upgrade fallout in complex setups (file, mail, > dns, dhcp, ldap, smb, databases, vpn, telephony, obs, just to name a few) on a > *regular* base, but use a stable *and* supported base system. And that's, > where Leap excels. Even release upgrades are mostly smooth, and just a little > sed'ing and one zyp away. > > Leap offers stability and minimum fuzz with upgrades and the like, thanks to > the shared base with SLE (keeping essential elements stable and supported), > while TW offers the latest and greatest, while putting *a lot of* effort into > testing. And thanks to OBS, we have a release collaboration tool with a pretty > low friction level. > > You can roll your own distribution, and (re-)package everything, that you > don't like. glibc is a little exception of course, since adapting Leap to a > new glibc, while possible, is not sensible. It will result in a new > distribution, where you're on your own, and raging bitrot is no fun (been > there, done that..). > > If you need a new glibc, fine, use TW. And get everything else for free > (current kernel, other libs, MESA, DEs just to name a few). Any hiccups are > usually a matter of days to get fixed, but the base is stable and sound. > > Hence, from my point of view, this distribution is targeted on real use cases, > and does that very well. There are areas, that deserve improvements, but > overall, the offerings from this project are on a very high quality level.. > While the openSUSE project wasn't always positioned luckily in the past, it is > in a very good shape as of now, with a firm standing, and sane prospects over > all (and compared to others). > > Cheers, > Pete > > I understand fully what you mean. Yes, it is a challenge to create a new distribution, it requires a lot of work. And creation is just one thing, next is the maintenance. The latter is the reason I do not build my own distro anymore. All said and understood, does someone knows a stable distro which is somewhere between TW as bleeding edge and leap15.x? I did not followed the changing distro landscape lately. -- Frans -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org