[opensuse-edu] What is a verticle solution for education?
In sales parlance, a vertical solution is one that covers all the components needed (application set\Hardware set) to perform a business task, i.e. HP has a vertical business solution, it sells: PC's, printers, switches, servers and software. In education a "vertical solution" could be defined as a set of software pieces that encompass all of the tasks an Educator is confronted with daily, i.e. a teacher needs an attendance module, grading module, course management, reference materials management and reporting\assessment module, etc. A school needs a desktop OS, server OS, web applications, e-mail, firewall, etc. With SLE, openSUSE and the EDU-CD we can provide all of the above and more. The EDU-CD adds to the standard business solution provided by Novell those tools necessary by compiling the various open source components like : Centre\SIS, Moodle and openbiblio and more onto one OS and makes them easy to install and configure, thus creating a "vertical solution". I would like to see programming enhancements to these offerings which make them more compatible with "No Child Left Behind" and those similar standards\requirements across the globe as we move forward. I think that we could entice the programmers involved in the different OSS projects for schools to combine their talents here and make these programs and the EDU-CD a standard for world wide educational environments. Think about the promise of an Open Source project that helps educators evaluate the progress of students and the effectiveness of their curriculum as compared to achievements and curricula of other students and schools on an international scale. With Moodle as the core curricula management tool, courses\assignments are internationalized simply by sharing them as modules in the Moodle forum, enhanced locally and returned back to the community in the epitome of open source. I believe that great teaching exists all over the world but the ability of the best teachers to effect the largest group of students is stifled by the boundaries of the physical classroom. We, the technical support group of those teachers and school administrators, can and should do everything in our power to tare down those walls as has been done by the technical support groups of the international business world. -- James Tremblay Director of Technology Newmarket School District Newmarket,NH http://en.opensuse.org/Education "let's make a difference" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
On Wed, 2007-08-08 at 08:10 -0400, James Tremblay wrote:
In sales parlance, a vertical solution is one that covers all the components needed (application set\Hardware set) to perform a business task, i.e. HP has a vertical business solution, it sells: PC's, printers, switches, servers and software. In education a "vertical solution" could be defined as a set of software pieces that encompass all of the tasks an Educator is confronted with daily,
This is the problem. You are looking at it as a technological issue when its a learning issue. An educational vertical solution results in learning, its as simple as that. What matters is the outcome not the process. If you want to narrow it a bit to a vocational education solution you also need some sort of qualification, graduation or certification at the end. The solution will involve software, support for things like social networking, peer assessment virtual learning environments and e-portfolios but also some plain old-fashioned human interaction and celebration. Over-focus on any one component is going to diminish the educational value of the proposition.
i.e. a teacher needs an attendance module, grading module, course management, reference materials management and reporting\assessment module, etc. A school needs a desktop OS, server OS, web applications, e-mail, firewall, etc. With SLE, openSUSE and the EDU-CD we can provide all of the above and more.
But you don't provide the fundamental reason why anyone would not just get those things from Microsoft and the other established suppliers all who have bigger marketing budgets than we do. You are trying to get people to change their technology before they understand why there is a need. Its rather ironic that the value of educating people about why change is needed is lost in providing "educational" solutions which are really technological solutions.
The EDU-CD adds to the standard business solution provided by Novell those tools necessary by compiling the various open source components like : Centre\SIS, Moodle and openbiblio and more onto one OS and makes them easy to install and configure, thus creating a "vertical solution".
A CD is just a dated distribution medium. We provide all those functions mostly from a web site so no need to install anything. We provide government recognised qualifications to provide the incentive to learn why its all useful and to give enhanced employment prospects to those that take it up. Its not dependent on Ubuntu or Suse - actually the fundamentals can be done with Windows because we want to educate die hard windows users not preach to the converted. I can't really see why education professionals would cast off dependency on MS to then lock themselves into a different "integrated" solution simply because it integrated technical components for them. Most educators couldn't care less about the technical components as long as they enable students to learn. When they learn about open FOSS communities and positively opt into them, we know we are making real sustainable progress.
I would like to see programming enhancements to these offerings which make them more compatible with "No Child Left Behind" and those similar standards\requirements across the globe as we move forward.
Well, the world is bigger than the USA so don't get too hooked up on the US education system. The fact is that there are no world standards for most school based learning but it is a good time to start establishing some. They won't be based on ownership of a particular software distro though.
I think that we could entice the programmers involved in the different OSS projects for schools to combine their talents here and make these programs and the EDU-CD a standard for world wide educational environments.
Along with Skolelinux, OpenCD, Extremadura's distro and many others? What you are all doing is producing collections of software that might or might not be useful to schools. This approach has had very limited success in the Microsoft world simply because the great majority of teachers aren't interested in technology, they are interested in motivating kids and getting them graduated and qualified. A lot of that is a human rather than technological challenge.
Think about the promise of an Open Source project that helps educators evaluate the progress of students and the effectiveness of their curriculum as compared to achievements and curricula of other students and schools on an international scale.
Assuming we all place the same cultural values on what effective education means. I think you will find a lot of disagreement on that. We already have a school inspection service and BECTA that serve these functions in the UK. Computers are not at all good at this type of evaluation except in some very narrow fields. What really matters is getting teachers and students learning by contributing to community projects using the principles of free software development to improve education methods. To achieve that we have to embed FOSS principles in the curriculum not try and force new technologies onto people not ready for them.
With Moodle as the core curricula management tool, courses\assignments are internationalized simply by sharing them as modules in the Moodle forum, enhanced locally and returned back to the community in the epitome of open source.
That is closer to what is needed but Moodle is not dependent on Ubuntu or Suse - in fact you can use if from Windows quite happily. How do you incentivise the middle and late adopters to participate? That is a key to getting mass take up. Moodle is popular in schools by comparison to other VLPs but its still only in use in a minority and then often only in specific departments with specific champion teachers.
I believe that great teaching exists all over the world but the ability of the best teachers to effect the largest group of students is stifled by the boundaries of the physical classroom. We, the technical support group of those teachers and school administrators, can and should do everything in our power to tare down those walls as has been done by the technical support groups of the international business world.
Your biggest challenge is to persuade teachers who are mostly not IT specialists why they should spend their time on this when many competing initiatives are being thrown at them from many sides. I'm not trying to discredit your efforts here, I'm just saying the entire FOSS movement has been far too focussed on technological solutions to problems that are inherently about people. Ian -- New QCA Accredited IT Qualifications www.theINGOTs.org You have received this email from the following company: The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and Wales. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
Ian I beg to differ on this vertical solution of yours. Hardware and certain software will not only improve learning, it will affect the schools bottom line. Simply by not having to pay Microsoft royalties for the use of their operating system and office software, a savings in incurred. This savings can be used to purchase smart boards, projectors, computers etc. The very nature of using Linux and OpenOffice is in effect a positive influence on the institution. We are also making our kids free thinkers instead of Microsoft slaves. Sure, there is already student record keeping software, internet class software such as moodle, and other educational software that can be used. As the list grows, there are also great Internet sites that can be used such as Kidport.com which has work for grades kinder through 8th grade. The use of the Internet in learning can really be usefull as many resources are found there that can be accessed using a free operating system, old machines in a thin client setup, and is continously being improved. You could say that open source vertical integration is a low cost vehicle an educator can use for getting students learned. It is the teachers responsibility to teach. Open source software simply provides tools. -- Rod Donovan Systems Support Specialist II Texas A&M University Corpus Christi College of Education Early Childhood Development Center 361-825-3080 rodney.donovan@tamucc.edu -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
On Wed, 2007-08-08 at 10:44 -0500, Rodney Donovan wrote:
Ian I beg to differ on this vertical solution of yours. Hardware and certain software will not only improve learning, it will affect the schools bottom line. Simply by not having to pay Microsoft royalties for the use of their operating system and office software, a savings in incurred. This savings can be used to purchase smart boards, projectors, computers etc.
I agree, but that isn't the point, we sell into this market and unless things are very different where you are brute common sense doesn't work. We could save customers a fortune and we have migrated quite a few to Linux. Its this practical experience that leads me to believe its not the best strategy. We have changed the entire company direction as a result and I don't do that lightly.
The very nature of using Linux and OpenOffice is in effect a positive influence on the institution.
It is from your perspective. Just watch 95% of school Principals glaze over when you start talking about technology. They really don't want to know about what are to them technical details. A word processor is a word processor - do they worry about the brand name on their pen or whether its a free pen or a Microsoft pen? That is the level they are thinking at. Only difference is its a lot easier to change pens.
We are also making our kids free thinkers instead of Microsoft slaves.
Very praiseworthy and I don't think you read what I posted. The best way to make kids free thinkers is to educate them about the issues. If a prerequisite for that is to get the school to change its technology you are raising a barrier to entry. Fine, find the 5 or 10% of early adopters who might be prepared to do this and go for it. Be prepared for whenever anything goes wrong, reversion to what they know. I'd prefer to get to the other 95%, prepare them so they make the decision and get them to sustain that decision because they really understand the issues. Its the difference between teaching and learning ;-)
Sure, there is already student record keeping software, internet class software such as moodle, and other educational software that can be used. As the list grows, there are also great Internet sites that can be used such as Kidport.com which has work for grades kinder through 8th grade. The use of the Internet in learning can really be usefull as many resources are found there that can be accessed using a free operating system, old machines in a thin client setup, and is continously being improved.
I don't disagree, all this is fine but it doesn't close sales and it doesn't guarantee mass take up or sustaining those who do try it out. Even with the entrenched systems there are many schools and teachers not using IT regularly in their teaching, probably more than those that are.
You could say that open source vertical integration is a low cost vehicle an educator can use for getting students learned. It is the teachers responsibility to teach. Open source software simpGI1 (Romanian) Introduction to Open Syst...ly provides tools.
But without a compelling professional reason to adopt those tools - and MS software is heavily discounted to schools as well as having things like schools agreement to lock them in - you will get marginilised by mainstream professionals who see the technology as just another layer of hassle. To them there are far more important priorities. I notice you are a systems support specialist so its not surprising that you think like a systems support specialist and not a teacher. Try and think like your customer thinks, not how you would like them to think or what is logical to you. Ian -- New QCA Accredited IT Qualifications www.theINGOTs.org You have received this email from the following company: The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and Wales. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
Hello James. I think ole Ian needs a pint of brew! If it wasn't for OSS, we would all be Microsoft slaves. Yes! It is about hardware, and yes it is about software. The issue is how much can you save on software by replacing commercial with open source software. This is what makes IT a black hole in regards to resources. You can throw the whole kit and kaboodle into IT and still not have what is needed to succeed. With proper use of OSS, there can be savings had and many things learned. As for "No Child Left Behind," believe me when I say that this has caused more problems for schools than any other law I know of. I don't believe that our federal government should be getting involved in state matters. But then again, have you seen some of these kids? That is right, they should not be left behind, they should be shipped out! Rod Donovan Systems Support Specialist II Texas A&M University Corpus Christi College of Education Early Childhood Development Center 361-825-3080 rodney.donovan@tamucc.edu -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
On Wed, 2007-08-08 at 10:55 -0500, Rodney Donovan wrote:
Hello James. I think ole Ian needs a pint of brew!
Just going to the gym :-)
If it wasn't for OSS, we would all be Microsoft slaves. Yes! It is about hardware, and yes it is about software.
I'm completely in agreement that at some point we need to get everyone using OSS, I'm disagreeing with the approach to achieving that.
The issue is how much can you save on software by replacing commercial with open source software.
Free beer or freedom? I think Freedom is more important and more in tune with educational culture.
This is what makes IT a black hole in regards to resources. You can throw the whole kit and kaboodle into IT and still not have what is needed to succeed. With proper use of OSS, there can be savings had and many things learned.
As for "No Child Left Behind," believe me when I say that this has caused more problems for schools than any other law I know of. I don't believe that our federal government should be getting involved in state matters. But then again, have you seen some of these kids? That is right, they should not be left behind, they should be shipped out!
Hm, not one for inclusive education then ;-) Ian -- New QCA Accredited IT Qualifications www.theINGOTs.org You have received this email from the following company: The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and Wales. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
Gentlemen, Not to set myself up as an expert on this subject, but as a person who formerly performed pre-sales support and Service Management over several thousand schools in New England, I have to agree with both arguments. This at least for the grade school level. Colleges and Universities change everything. I think the truth is that you SHOULD sell hardware to the Director of Technology for a School District and the software to teachers. In actual fact, you might be doing some of both providing the teachers get involved with the process. It is correct that for the most part, teachers do not concern themselves with either hardware or networking, and frequently learn whatever tool is given them to do the grade book or assessment thing. The focus point might be best described as making the tools transparent to hardware or OS. My son is in 6th grade will a school full of computers running Windoze save two. His computer teacher is running Linux on two systems. One web server and the other her client that she uses for everything else. Maybe the web is the way to transparency as Browsers work a lot alike. So, working the back end apps like grade book etc. might be the foot in the door. Open Source software can save significant monies on both hardware and software. Staving off a "hardware refresh" can save big dough. Downloading applications from a web or local repository that are free is more money for other things, like training. Color me squarely in the middle on this. I guess I'll go find a gym that serves beer :>) Regards, Ralph Ian Lynch wrote:
On Wed, 2007-08-08 at 10:55 -0500, Rodney Donovan wrote:
Hello James. I think ole Ian needs a pint of brew!
Just going to the gym :-)
If it wasn't for OSS, we would all be Microsoft slaves. Yes! It is about hardware, and yes it is about software.
I'm completely in agreement that at some point we need to get everyone using OSS, I'm disagreeing with the approach to achieving that.
The issue is how much can you save on software by replacing commercial with open source software.
Free beer or freedom? I think Freedom is more important and more in tune with educational culture.
This is what makes IT a black hole in regards to resources. You can throw the whole kit and kaboodle into IT and still not have what is needed to succeed. With proper use of OSS, there can be savings had and many things learned.
As for "No Child Left Behind," believe me when I say that this has caused more problems for schools than any other law I know of. I don't believe that our federal government should be getting involved in state matters. But then again, have you seen some of these kids? That is right, they should not be left behind, they should be shipped out!
Hm, not one for inclusive education then ;-)
Ian
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On Wed, 2007-08-08 at 13:09 -0400, Ralph H. Stoos Jr. wrote:
Maybe the web is the way to transparency as Browsers work a lot alike. So, working the back end apps like grade book etc. might be the foot in the door.
The global trend is towards the web as the platform rather than the local desktop. That is certainly part of our strategy. Make all the learning resources web compliant so it doesn't matter what desktop is run. Once there is sufficient support for web based apps there is no reason to choose more expensive infrastructure so there will be a natural drift to GNU/Linux in any case as the least expensive option although I'd expect MS prices to fall to try and put that off. On the other hand we need resources to put into developing web applications so we might as well take revenue from the Windows users to do this since it will accelerate the process. I don't see the development resource going into education apps for desktop Linux fast enough. The compelling reason for developing for the web is that you have a much bigger market.
Open Source software can save significant monies on both hardware and software. Staving off a "hardware refresh" can save big dough. Downloading applications from a web or local repository that are free is more money for other things, like training.
Accessing Web pages from thin clients is even less expensive. Mostly schools could have a thin client per child (Or a OLPC type device) if there are sufficient applications to support the curriculum. Moving development to the web seems the most likely way that will happen.
Color me squarely in the middle on this.
I guess I'll go find a gym that serves beer :>)
Drank to much of it last night so I need to work it off ;-) Ian -- New QCA Accredited IT Qualifications www.theINGOTs.org You have received this email from the following company: The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and Wales. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
My desire to create the EDU-CD is and has been to build a tool set that an emerging school or a school in the beginning stages of modernizing their infrastructure or a school that needs to shed it's licensing costs could in fact choose to either employ all of the "vertical solution" from openSUSE\Novell or pick and choose components, If you've read the http://en.opensuse.org/Education page and the pages linked to from it, the idea I propose is to include the core tools to build and manage a school or school district in as easy a form to install and manage as possible considering the multitude of science\math teachers forced to do my job. I never say anything about imposing any form of curricula restriction on that school, the offering is merely meant to eliminate the raping most school budgets suffer from companies like Pearson digital (which owns SASI XP , Powerschool and Chancery SMS) who license software to schools on a per student model that frequently have double digit costs. In my state those products average 28.00$ US per student and Microsoft only cuts deals with the savviest of technology directors, otherwise an MS server is 1000.00 $ US on average and each product still contains a need for its own CAL, again usually a two digit price tag and have repetitive "maintenance costs" . THIS IS OFFENSIVE! My school District saved over 20,000.00$ US by saying no to Pearson and using Centre\SIS. Having a formidable low cost infrastructure that can produce the necessary assessment and management tools gives that district a lot of freedom to pursue and finance a huge array of pedagogical avenues. My son goes to a "charter school" his school is outside the confines of my states Department of Education it is also outside its funding stream, however as a sophomore in high school he already has college credits in math and mechanical engineering all possible because the school uses OSS and redirects it's funding towards more modern methods of teaching as well as holding teachers accountable for there students progress and paying them appropriately for those achievements. I think giving the teachers the tools and incentives to succeed is even more important than creating a pedagogical guideline. Student scores and class achievements speak for the effectiveness of that teachers\schools skills and style. Forcing any guidelines on curricula or pedagogy only creates an atmosphere of a stagnant classroom that meets those goals and nothing more. The state of Massachusetts has a test it imposes on it's sophomores and has only produced an atmosphere were it's marginal students get taught just enough to pass this test and the other groups of students are forced to waste valuable classroom time reviewing information covered on this test rather than moving forward. A better assessment method in my opinion is a classroom level assessment of grade level expectations (i.e. can a second grader read and comprehend polysyllabic words or are they still reading "see spot run") Back to the point , the EDU-CD and the efforts of the community here are geared toward providing the tools teachers request in a format that is easy to install. -- James Tremblay Director of Technology Newmarket School District Newmarket,NH http://en.opensuse.org/Education "let's make a difference" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
Hi. I'm the Deputy Headteacher at a UK Junior school (ages 7-11). I am intentionally asking these questions from a school management and teaching perspective. These comments apply as my experience of the Primary education system in the UK (5-11 year olds). On 8 Aug 2007, at 13:10, James Tremblay wrote:
In education a "vertical solution" could be defined as a set of software pieces that encompass all of the tasks an Educator is confronted with daily, i.e. a teacher needs an attendance module,
We use SIMS (Capita) for attendance. We have no reason to change. The cost (yes financial, but more importantly the cost in time of the teachers learning to take a register) of retraining outweighs the cost of 8 classroom computer clients and an office SIMS server.
grading module,
What does this actually do? For senior management? For teacher? For pupil? It's just a place to store and analyse progress data, right? We are provided with tools for this that have little or no cost to the school.
course management,
What does this do for me as a Primary teacher?
reference materials management
A what? A shared library of resources across teachers across a school? Accessible from anywhere?
and reporting\assessment module, etc.
What's the difference between this and a "grading module"? My experience of a report module is a report writing assistant tool. At a Primary level these can be as much of a bind as a help.
A school needs a desktop OS, server OS, web applications, e-mail, firewall, etc.
Our email services and firewalling is provided at a County level at no additional cost to the school if we use it or not. Every child and teacher receives a free email account (web-based and pop) and support is at no cost to the school. County have also bought into a "Learning Platform", which if we take it up, is at no cost to the school. The "LP" is a term that is being used here to define a web-based interface to shared school calendaring, file storage, a news portal, resource/room management, attendance etc. ---- I am a very enthusiastic advocate of OSS. I have installed linux servers and desktops, and installed OpenOffice, Firefox etc, migrated schools websites to Plone etc, in schools for 10 years. But at a UK Primary school level (5-11) a lot of the service decisions are taken at a County level, and purchased at a County level. I can't abide SIMS, but it's functional for the limited use we put its way, and it's supported remotely at a very reasonable rate by the County. I don't like the company that provide our email service (negotiated at a County level), but the service is fine, free at the point of use, and well supported. I don't like the company that provide our connectivity or webhosting (negotiated at a County level) - but the service and support are very good. The problem for us is that schools have very little financial or functional reason to implement change on the services/products outlined above. Perhaps this is vastly different across the globe... perhaps we could hear some examples. Certainly for me, the work must be done above school level in order to affect change on the vast majority of the services outlined. Kind regards. -- Matt Johnson -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
On Thu, 2007-08-09 at 02:22 +0100, Matt Johnson wrote:
The problem for us is that schools have very little financial or functional reason to implement change on the services/products outlined above. Perhaps this is vastly different across the globe... perhaps we could hear some examples. Certainly for me, the work must be done above school level in order to affect change on the vast majority of the services outlined.
Its very variable in different parts of the world. The vast majority of schools world wide are well below the level of provision we take for granted in the UK. Even in the UK there is massive variation in who controls procurement. An independent school will be entirely free to choose any equipment from any supplier. A City Academy will have more freedom in this respect than a comprehensive school in a local authority with centralised provision. Some LA centralise more than others. Then you get into micropolitics between head, IT manager, systems manager. If anyone of these wants to sabotage change they are well placed to do so. My main point is that if you want change you have to lower the barriers to change, superman might be able to leap tall buildings in one bound but most humans have to take the stairs. If I offer a school a valued qualification that is supported entirely through web applications and teaches about FOSS but also satisfies statutory requirements with minimal additional work for the teacher, its a step in the right direction and far easier in terms of adoption than trying to get people to install GNU/Linux servers and desktops everywhere with no training budget. Furthermore, if you do persuade people to change and it causes them hassle you do more harm than good because they will say we tried that Linux thing and it didn't work. In the long run its better for them to make the decision as to what they need than for us to force the issue. If of course the target is Linux savvy anyway and wants support in changing, its a different issue. Ian -- New QCA Accredited IT Qualifications www.theINGOTs.org You have received this email from the following company: The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and Wales. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
Ian, are your offerings in the openSUSE build service, are they included in the openSUSE education repository? If not your part of the problem I'm trying to eliminate, that is, educational offerings of OSS are dispersed over the net with no cohesive location to find and choose the pieces that meet "your" schools need. An individual repository for software can hold a goldmine of offerings but if it's address is unknown to the masses, What potential does it have? If the school looking for tools has limited Internet access then providing a CD can be a Godsend and if the versions on that CD are well tested, then the fear of downloading a "beta" version can be reduced if not eliminated. As you have pointed out most educators glaze over at the sound of tech speak and those that don't still want the implementation of their choices to be as painless as possible, which provides fuel to my fire. Provide a Add-ON CD\repository to openSUSE that does exactly that, make it painless. I ask you to include your software in our repositories and if time permits help catalog the pieces already there by writing description pages with "How to's" that include installation, and usage tips. You can easily get a build service account and I will gladly add you as a maintainer of packages. I offer this same invitation to anyone who can provide evidence of being capable of building RPM's. -- James Tremblay Director of Technology Newmarket School District Newmarket,NH http://en.opensuse.org/Education "let's make a difference" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
Hi.
I'm the Deputy Headteacher at a UK Junior school (ages 7-11).
I am intentionally asking these questions from a school management and teaching perspective. These comments apply as my experience of the Primary education system in the UK (5-11 year olds).
On 8 Aug 2007, at 13:10, James Tremblay wrote:
In education a "vertical solution" could be defined as a set of software pieces that encompass all of the tasks an Educator is confronted with daily, i.e. a teacher needs an attendance module,
We use SIMS (Capita) for attendance. We have no reason to change. The cost (yes financial, but more importantly the cost in time of the teachers learning to take a register) of retraining outweighs the cost of 8 classroom computer clients and an office SIMS server.
grading module, The electronic gradebook in Centre is tied to attendance, scheduling,
On Thu, 2007-08-09 at 02:22 +0100, Matt Johnson wrote: the Nursing module, and more.... It offers those who have to make a choice (all US schools and more I'm sure) the ability to choose a fulling integrated administrative suite
What does this actually do? For senior management? For teacher? For pupil? It's just a place to store and analyse progress data, right? We are provided with tools for this that have little or no cost to the school.
course management,
What does this do for me as a Primary teacher?
as the "Headmaster" for the school if you only have one course like "homeroom" it is the foundation for your other records management and if you employ a broader schedule of courses or Moodle each of your subject areas can have online assignments and record the "achievements" of the participating students.
reference materials management
A what? A shared library of resources across teachers across a school? Accessible from anywhere?
Yes, openbiblio is a web based library automation system it can be customized to catalog anything, it could even be employed to manage a conference room.
and reporting\assessment module, etc.
with "open reports" configured to access the data stored in Centre\SIS any assessment or achievement data that you store can be extracted on a classroom or grade or school or district level. i.e. how many girls take advance science and what is the average "grade" they get and does that differ from teacher to teacher.
What's the difference between this and a "grading module"? My experience of a report module is a report writing assistant tool. At a Primary level these can be as much of a bind as a help.
A school needs a desktop OS, server OS, web applications, e-mail, firewall, etc.
Our email services and firewalling is provided at a County level at no additional cost to the school if we use it or not. Every child and teacher receives a free email account (web-based and pop) and support is at no cost to the school. County have also bought into a "Learning Platform", which if we take it up, is at no cost to the school. The "LP" is a term that is being used here to define a web-based interface to shared school calendaring, file storage, a news portal, resource/room management, attendance etc.
From what I'm reading from you and Ian, it sounds like the UK has decided to build an education infrastructure at the "state" level, this is not the case in the rest of the world. Here in the US we regard education as a local (town\city) responsibility. It is only partially funded at the state and federal level and the choices about how to support the school are made by the community that school supports. This makes cost a very important factor in any decision. Having the ability to circumvent the added "Tax" of dealing with Microsoft and it's minions is highly coveted.
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I am a very enthusiastic advocate of OSS. I have installed linux servers and desktops, and installed OpenOffice, Firefox etc, migrated schools websites to Plone etc, in schools for 10 years. But at a UK Primary school level (5-11) a lot of the service decisions are taken at a County level, and purchased at a County level. I can't abide SIMS, but it's functional for the limited use we put its way, and it's supported remotely at a very reasonable rate by the County. I don't like the company that provide our email service (negotiated at a County level), but the service is fine, free at the point of use, and well supported. I don't like the company that provide our connectivity or webhosting (negotiated at a County level) - but the service and support are very good.
The problem for us is that schools have very little financial or functional reason to implement change on the services/products outlined above. Perhaps this is vastly different across the globe... perhaps we could hear some examples. Certainly for me, the work must be done above school level in order to affect change on the vast majority of the services outlined.
Kind regards.
-- Matt Johnson
-- James Tremblay Director of Technology Newmarket School District Newmarket,NH http://en.opensuse.org/Education "let's make a difference" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-edu+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-edu+help@opensuse.org
participants (5)
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Ian Lynch -
James Tremblay -
Matt Johnson -
Ralph H. Stoos Jr. -
Rodney Donovan