RE: [suse-linux-uk-schools] SIMS. SCOMIS AND ALICE
On Wed, 2002-12-04 at 21:24, Grainge, Derek wrote:
Regarding killer school apps, what are the following SIMS
SIMS is a school database management system, about to be replaced by a new version which is based on .NET and MS SQL server. It will have a client interface which is mostly NOT web based.
I wouldn't call it a Killer app in the sense you imply. Au contraire. But no schools database is that good really.
Supposedly it's based around an agreed data format allowing modules to be mixed and matched by purchasing from different companies. Therefore in theory there is an open structure and a way for home-grown apps to access data. I doubt that Capita would be at all happy for that to happen - for data integrity reasons, not just money.
Cheers, Derek
CMIS is probably SIMS biggest up and coming competitor. The DfES common data format should enable data to be transferred between competing systems more easily. There is an Open Source SIMS replacement in development but I haven't seen it so I don't know how it stands up. All admin should be on standard SQL databases with web front ends and independent of the hardware OS or even web browser. This would be perfectly possible but the government would be best placed to encourage such open standards and don't seem very keen to do it at them moment. SIMS is a monopoly and we all know how long they take to shift. However, like Windows, there is sufficient antipathy toward SIMS to give some encouragement to would be competitors. Support contracts would make an OS product commercially viable. Regards, -- IanL
SIMS is a monopoly and we all know how long they take to shift. However, like Windows, there is sufficient antipathy toward SIMS to give some encouragement to would be competitors. Support contracts would make an OS product commercially viable.
Support contracts? We have one for CMIS. We asked them if they could re-do the data import, they said fine, only eight hundred pounds. So we've worked out how to do it ourselves, and it does take half an hour or so, longer if you spill the coffee (in passing, it seems odd that a data import system written in Dublin should filter out all apostrophes in names). -- Christopher Dawkins, Felsted School, Dunmow, Essex CM6 3JG 01371-822698, mobile 07816 821659 cchd@felsted.essex.sch.uk
On Wed, 2002-12-04 at 22:54, Christopher Dawkins wrote:
SIMS is a monopoly and we all know how long they take to shift. However, like Windows, there is sufficient antipathy toward SIMS to give some encouragement to would be competitors. Support contracts would make an OS product commercially viable.
Support contracts? We have one for CMIS. We asked them if they could re-do the data import, they said fine, only eight hundred pounds. So we've worked out how to do it ourselves, and it does take half an hour or so, longer if you spill the coffee (in passing, it seems odd that a data import system written in Dublin should filter out all apostrophes in names).
If you are running a business you need a source of income, and if someone is going to develop a SIMS clone or whatever with open source they would need a reason to do it. One reason would be that it would help pay their mortgage. SIMS et al make money from licensing *and* support contracts. Some support contracts are a rip off, others aren't. Most have ambiguity that makes expectations variable and therefore are a potential source of conflict. In this arena I would have said its far better to rely on buying services which you have the choice to do yourself than to pay licenses for software where you have no choice in a monopoly. I suspect CMIS have to charge high support rate in order to have a viable income when competing with the SIMS monopoly and if a site visit was required it would be a day out of someone's time even for a 30 minute job. 800 a day is expensive - double what I charge - but maybe they just didn't really want to do this job or on the rates Capita charge its seen as competitive. Think how much it costs for you, your on-costs and to keep running the school infrastructure around you. It will be several hundred pounds a day when you take everything into account and schools in general have relatively stable workforce than business so its easier to plan without needing contingency. At least you had a choice to do it yourself. Regards, -- Ian
have a viable income when competing with the SIMS monopoly and if a site visit was required it would be a day out of someone's time even for a 30 minute job.
In this case there was no suggestion of a site visit - we haven't had one since we were sold the package. It was email them a spreadsheet, they'll email back a database. It seems one such operation is all that's covered in the inital purchase price. -- Christopher Dawkins, Felsted School, Dunmow, Essex CM6 3JG 01371-822698, mobile 07816 821659 cchd@felsted.essex.sch.uk
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