Hi all thought this might be of interest to some of you :- <my email>
Subject: Microsoft and the British Government - Possible Anti-Competitive Behaviour Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2001 15:04:20 +0100 From: alanh@bryngwyn.carmarthen.sch.uk To: Erkki.Liikanen@cec.eu.int
Hi,
I write regarding the current negotiations between the British Government and Microsoft in which, to date, Microsoft have been awarded a contract to supply the National Health Service with some 60 Million (£)'s worth of software licenses.
I would be grateful if you could inform me of the current state of the anti-competition investigation being undertaken by the EU against Microsoft, as it appears that more such deals (like that for the NHS) are in the pipeline. As the commisioner with responsibility for the Information Society I am sure that you are well aware of the potential for damage being created by such actions.
Many Thanks
Alan
<commisioners response>
Subject: RE: Microsoft and the British Government - Possible Anti-Competit ive Behaviour Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 14:08:31 +0100 From: Erkki.Liikanen@cec.eu.int To: alanh@bryngwyn.carmarthen.sch.uk CC: Mario.Monti@cec.eu.int, Marc.Van-Hoof@cec.eu.int, Olli.Rehn@cec.eu.int, Per.Haugaard@cec.eu.int
Dear. Mr. Harris,
I pass your letter to my colleague Mario Monti and his cabinet. He is responsible for this issue. But still, during investigation I don't believe much more can be said what has been in public.
with best regards
Erkki Liikanen
******************************** Mr. Erkki Liikanen Member of the Commission tel. +32-2-295.79.57 fax +32-2-295.85.61 erkki.liikanen@cec.eu.int secretary; kirsi.larjava@cec.eu.int tel. +32-2-295.14.40 http://europa.eu.int/comm/commissioners/liikanen/index_en.htm
There may be hope for all of us then? Alan ----------------------------------------------------- Alan Harris Network Manager Bryngwyn School Tel : 01554 750661 Fax : 01554 758255 E-mail: alanh@bryngwyn.carmarthen.sch.uk ----------------------------------------------------- Notes: 1. The contents of this email may be snooped on by interested government parties for unknown purposes! Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act, 2000. 2. The opinions expressed in this email are personal and may not be shared by Bryngwyn School. -----------------------------------------------------
Dear all
thought this might be of interest to some of you :-
Reading the front page of the Financial Mail for yesterday morning reveals that the Serious Fraud Office have found many serious frauds that involve the NHS and public money. Thought you might like to know about that. Can't say whether my letter to my MP had any affect anywhere. My complaint to the EU has resulted in an investigation by the EU Commission into management practices at the NHS. As to whether this does actually have any effect anywhere ? I suppose that we will have to wait and see. Thanks -- Richard
Dear all Had a letter from the European Commission this morning concerning the message that you can see below. I wrote to <@cec.eu.int> in Brussels to ask about why it wasn't necessary for the NHS to conform to Euro Law. The letter which was a reply to my request arrived today. They explain that they wrote to "The United Kingdom authorities". The answer that came back from the UK auth suggests that I am in fact completely in the wrong about raising questions about why the NHS is spending massive amounts of money in propieratery software. I am almost being told by a civil servant or a legal adviser to the UK Government that I am not allowed to question the spending of tax payers money on procurement of unnecessary software. Almost but not quite. Since the NHS didn't bother to advertise the fact that they were purchasing the software in the appropriate EU journal then they are in breech of EU law and have in fact broken their own and EU regulations. To quote some of the latter parts of the two page letter from the EU Internal Market DG... " Award of contract by Department of Health to Microsoft Limited - The Enterprise Agreement The UK authorities have explained that when purchases are made by NHS bodies of Microsoft software governed by the Enterprise Agreement licencing arrangements, these would be made through the G-CAT 2 framework agreement. Under the G-CAT 2 framework agreement, there are five resellers offering Microsoft products, as well as those of other manufacturers, who are also authorised as resellers under the Enterprise Agreement. The United Kingdom authorities have confirmed that the G-CAT 2 framework agreement was completed in accordance with Directive 93/36/EEC on the award of public supply contracts. On the basis of information available, the procurement of Microsofts products would therefore appear to be in conformity with Community public procurement law. The UK authorities have confirmed that these was no call for competition in respect of the Enterprise Agreement. However since this agreement simply covers the manufacturer's licence to use goods in circumstances where the procurement of those goods takes place pursuant to a properly advertised and lawful framework agreement, there does not appear to be any infringement of Community public procurement law. For the above reasons, the Commission services will propose to close this file unless you are able to provide new substantive information within one month from the date of this letter - 06.09.02" So, what has happened is that a large amount of tax payers money which could have paid for the training of a large number of doctors and nurses has been rubber stamped into a private individuals back pocket. When a private individual like myself has raised a question over this I have been covered up by my own legal people and Government officers without me asking them to do it to me. The fact is - whether I am able to provide proof or not - that the NHS did not bother to advertise in the appropriate EU journal in the way that they are supposed to when a contract is put out to buy in new software. As such they have broken EU law. I am being told to shut up and go away by Whitehall. Previous correspondence on this issue shown below... On Monday 10 December 2001 09:34, Alan Harris wrote:
Hi all
thought this might be of interest to some of you :-
<my email>
Subject: Microsoft and the British Government - Possible Anti-Competitive Behaviour Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2001 15:04:20 +0100 From: alanh@bryngwyn.carmarthen.sch.uk To: Erkki.Liikanen@cec.eu.int
Hi,
I write regarding the current negotiations between the British Government and Microsoft in which, to date, Microsoft have been awarded a contract to supply the National Health Service with some 60 Million (£)'s worth of software licenses.
I would be grateful if you could inform me of the current state of the anti-competition investigation being undertaken by the EU against Microsoft, as it appears that more such deals (like that for the NHS) are in the pipeline. As the commissioner with responsibility for the Information Society I am sure that you are well aware of the potential for damage being created by such actions.
Many Thanks
Alan
<commisioners response>
Subject: RE: Microsoft and the British Government - Possible Anti-Competit ive Behaviour Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 14:08:31 +0100 From: Erkki.Liikanen@cec.eu.int To: alanh@bryngwyn.carmarthen.sch.uk CC: Mario.Monti@cec.eu.int, Marc.Van-Hoof@cec.eu.int, Olli.Rehn@cec.eu.int, Per.Haugaard@cec.eu.int
Dear. Mr. Harris,
I pass your letter to my colleague Mario Monti and his cabinet. He is responsible for this issue. But still, during investigation I don't believe much more can be said what has been in public.
with best regards
Erkki Liikanen
******************************** Mr. Erkki Liikanen Member of the Commission tel. +32-2-295.79.57 fax +32-2-295.85.61 erkki.liikanen@cec.eu.int secretary; kirsi.larjava@cec.eu.int tel. +32-2-295.14.40 http://europa.eu.int/comm/commissioners/liikanen/index_en.htm
There may be hope for all of us then?
Alan
----------------------------------------------------- Alan Harris Network Manager Bryngwyn School
Tel : 01554 750661 Fax : 01554 758255 E-mail: alanh@bryngwyn.carmarthen.sch.uk
-----------------------------------------------------
Notes:
1. The contents of this email may be snooped on by interested government parties for unknown purposes! Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act, 2000.
2. The opinions expressed in this email are personal and may not be shared by Bryngwyn School.
-----------------------------------------------------
Richard www.sheflug.co.uk
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 17 Sep 2002 11:06 am, Richard Ibbotson wrote: <snip very interesting eu stuff> Is this information worth making more widely available, along with the fax your MP website details? I made use of a free legal helpline a while back. I was questioning the legality of the government 'gateway' site for blocking non-ms browsers in conjunction with tax rebates for using the service. Apparently that was probably illegal under EU competition law, but was going to cost me money to investigate any further. C. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE9hwbg+prcXMebSWQRAtYAAJ0fFuYUiCg1f3PV9ZpEdC8E9MbJkQCgnaiv acY1dFXyKJxBVyu9ytOB2p0= =7nM3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Clive
Is this information worth making more widely available, along with the fax your MP website details?
Don't know. Might be but you have to consider EU law to do with private communications to individuals like myself ? Under UK law you are not allowed to even begin to mention a private coomunication on paper on a public list under some circumstances. You might have to think about that ? My reason for sending it to this list was for the purposes of public info and some hoped for informed comment. Not to break any Euro or UK laws.
I made use of a free legal helpline a while back. I was questioning the legality of the government 'gateway' site for blocking non-ms browsers in conjunction with tax rebates for using the service. Apparently that was probably illegal under EU competition law, but was going to cost me money to investigate any further.
Since this is an NHS issue it might well be that the same route doesn't help with this particular problem ? -- Thanks Richard www.sheflug.co.uk
On Tuesday 17 September 2002 11:06, Richard Ibbotson wrote:
Dear all
Had a letter from the European Commission this morning concerning the message that you can see below.
I have just received the same letter. Personally I can't see how having 5 or 500 resellers of M$ products under G-CAT 2 makes any difference to the fact that only one product is being considered and hence it should be tendered against other similar products, it there are none, its a monopoly and should therefore be treated as such. The bit in the letter that says However since this agreement simply covers the manufacturer's licence to use goods in circumstances where the procurement of those goods takes place pursuant to a properly advertised and lawful framework agreement, there does not appear to be any infringement of Community public procurement law. seems to simply mean that if the company is a big software company with a monopoly product, no account needs to be taken of value for money procedures. Not sure anything can be done about it but it wouln't take much effort for everyone to E-mail nicholas.kaye@cec.eu.int to say that as a European taxpayer you are appaulled that in the case of Microsoft and the NHS the EU is happy to allow a foreign monopoly to thrive unchecked at the expense of the European software industry - or words to that effect. Remember the squeaky hinge gets the grease so just keep squeaking :-) Regards, -- IanL
Ian
Had a letter from the European Commission this morning concerning the message that you can see below.
I have just received the same letter.
Ah.. that's one of the things I was wondering about ? I was thinking something like ... have the EU civil servants now joined in with our own in order to effectively round robin all of us so that we can't make a complaint or comment of any sort. Does seem to the case :) -- Thanks Richard British Smugness Consultancy at www.sheflug.co.uk
On Tuesday 17 September 2002 22:24, Richard Ibbotson wrote:
Ian
Had a letter from the European Commission this morning concerning the message that you can see below.
I have just received the same letter.
Ah.. that's one of the things I was wondering about ? I was thinking something like ... have the EU civil servants now joined in with our own in order to effectively round robin all of us so that we can't make a complaint or comment of any sort.
I just think they probably had many similar complaints. My letter has the date and 5295 stamped on it. Could I be the 5295th letter? If they get a lot of correspondence on these issues, it will get back to the politicians so its worth making the effort. At least they will be very careful about such dealings in future. There is already talk of promoting Open Source in some government circles so the more these things come to light and show significant protest the more likely action will be taken. Like voting, an indivdual doesn't seem to have much clout but its still worth doing it! Regards, -- IanL
participants (4)
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Alan Harris -
Clive Jones -
Ian Lynch -
Richard Ibbotson