https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c1 Gordon Dickens changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |gordon@dickens.com --- Comment #1 from Gordon Dickens 2011-12-16 01:05:46 UTC --- The link that I intended to provide in the above post and which explaines how to install the Muzlocker fonts is: http://susestarter.blogspot.com/2011/03/get-yer-subpixel-hinted-fonts.html -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c3 kk zhang changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Status|NEW |CLOSED CC| |kkzhang@novell.com Resolution| |NORESPONSE --- Comment #3 from kk zhang 2012-03-09 03:23:35 UTC --- Long time no response.So closed.Feel free to reopen it.Thanks. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c5 Cristian Morales Vega changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |christian.morales.vega@gmai | |l.com AssignedTo|bnc-team-screening@forge.pr |pgajdos@suse.com |ovo.novell.com | --- Comment #5 from Cristian Morales Vega 2012-03-23 18:07:46 UTC --- Assigning to Petr as fontconfig maintainer. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c7 --- Comment #7 from Takashi Iwai 2012-03-26 09:02:39 UTC --- (In reply to comment #6)

(In reply to comment #0)

...

especially with GTK apps like Firefox and Thunderbird. However, the Muzlocker repo significantly improves the OpenSUSE fonts. The Muzlocker font subpixel hinting is outstanding and far superior to the font hinting that is provided by default with OpenSUSE. In the past, there may have been licensing issues that prevented the use of these fonts, however, these licensing issues are said to no longer apply.

The main part here do freetype2 package. Subpixel rendering can be turned on by defining FT_CONFIG_OPTION_SUBPIXEL_RENDERING. Nevertheless we can't turn it on by default because subpixel rendering is patented, am I right, Takashi?

Right. It _might_ be possible to work around the patent by a new algorithm (like this one), but it's still unclear whether it's really patent-free unless it's clarified by legal people. Thus for FACTORY, we can't turn it on blindly. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c9 --- Comment #9 from Cristian Morales Vega 2012-03-26 11:34:38 UTC --- Because the TrueType bytecode interpreter has nothing to do with subpixel rendering. It is explained in that same link. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c11 --- Comment #11 from Gordon Dickens 2012-03-27 10:42:17 UTC --- Hi Petr, I will be happy to give M17N/{fontconfig,fonts-config} a test drive as you suggested. However, I am not sure how to proceed with your pacakges. Could you please reply with instructions on how to try those out. I am running OpenSUSE 12.1 with KDE 4.7.2. I will uninstall the Muzlocker repo packages when I proceed with testing your packages. Thanks, Gordon -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c13 --- Comment #13 from Gordon Dickens 2012-04-03 13:32:16 UTC --- OK, I added the following repository: http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/M17N/openSUSE_12.1/ Then, I did a vendor change to switch all packages to that repo. I also confirmed that fonts-config was noarch. In doing so, I did not see a substantial improvement in the fonts. The fonts continue to be thin and are not as well anti-aliased as with the Muzlocker repo. I cannot say that any of the fonts are "wrongly rendered". They are just not rendered nearly as well as with Muzlocker. My font settings are identical as the are with Muzlocker and can be viewed with the following two images. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c15 --- Comment #15 from Gordon Dickens 2012-04-03 13:35:19 UTC --- Created an attachment (id=484622) --> (http://bugzilla.novell.com/attachment.cgi?id=484622) My antialias settings are depicted in this jpeg attachment. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c17 Petr Gajdos changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Status|REOPENED |NEEDINFO InfoProvider| |gordon@dickens.com --- Comment #17 from Petr Gajdos 2012-04-03 18:03:41 UTC --- (In reply to comment #16)

- Fonts in other Linux distributions can be configured to render identically to Microsoft Windows (Cleartype enabled) without other additional repos or add-on software. I have personally achieved this with Gnome2/Ubuntu and Gnome2/CentOS.

That's not good argument for lawyers, sorry. What do you think: why is subpixel rendering off per default in freetype? Why are not infinality patches still not accepted in freetype? I guess that's not because freetype2 authors want to render fonts with their library worse ;-). When you are able to resolve these law-issues, feel free to inform freetype2 upstream and discuss with them. For this bug and us as downstream, please leave subpixel rendering aside. (In reply to comment #15)

Created an attachment (id=484622) --> (http://bugzilla.novell.com/attachment.cgi?id=484622) [details] My antialias settings are depicted in this jpeg attachment.

Setting subpixel rendering without freetype wich supports it is pointless as far as I know. (In reply to comment #14)

Created an attachment (id=484621) --> (http://bugzilla.novell.com/attachment.cgi?id=484621) [details] My font settings are depicted in this jpeg attachment.

Ok, let's look on Verdana rendering. Could you please attach $ fc-match -v "Verdana" You can ommit charset and all entries comming after. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c19 --- Comment #19 from Petr Gajdos 2012-04-04 19:37:07 UTC ---

I understand your perspective completely, However, I don't understand how some of the other Linux distros apparently get around these legal issues. I am only

Maybe you want to ask them ;-).

trying to help you and the OpenSUSE distro since, to the average user, this

Yes, it is clear only from the fact that you created this bug report. I really appreciate it a lot, thanks. And your effort was not useless, se below.

FT_CONFIG_OPTION_SUBPIXEL_RENDERING something that is defined at compile time

Exactly, if I understand correctly. Look at freetype2-subpixel.patch and freetype2.spec when it is applied. You can build own freetype2 with subpixel rendering compiled in of course.

gordon@rhino:~> fc-match -v "Verdana" Pattern has 31 elts (size 32) family: "Verdana"(s) familylang: "en"(s) style: "Normal"(s) stylelang: "ca"(s) fullname: "Verdana"(s) fullnamelang: "en"(s) slant: 0(i)(s) weight: 80(i)(s) width: 100(i)(s) size: 12(f)(s) pixelsize: 12.5(f)(s) foundry: "microsoft"(s) antialias: FcTrue(w) hintstyle: 3(i)(w) hinting: FcTrue(w) verticallayout: FcFalse(s) autohint: FcFalse(w) globaladvance: FcTrue(s) file: "/usr/share/fonts/truetype/verdana.ttf"(s) index: 0(i)(s) outline: FcTrue(s) scalable: FcTrue(s) dpi: 75(f)(s) rgba: 1(i)(w) scale: 1(f)(s)

And here you are: important part for as is: family, antialias, hinting, autohint and hintstyle. family: you are sure now that Verdana is really used when requested antialias: turn antialiasing on (true) or off (false) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Font_rasterization) hinting: turn hinting on (true) or off (false) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hinting) autohint: use byte code interpreter, BCI which operates over font mathematical instructions (false) or freetype's autohinter (true) hintstyle: define level of hinting impact -- hintnone (0), hintslight (1), hintmedium (2), hintfull(3) As far as I have gathered good informations, for majority of fonts good defaults should be: antialias=true, hinting=true, autohint=false, hintstyle=hintfull (used by Verdana now) or antialias=true, hinting=true, autohint=true, hintstyle=hintslight. You can experiment and tell freetype how to render fonts via fontconfig: ~/.fonts.conf <?xml version="1.0"?> <!DOCTYPE fontconfig SYSTEM "fonts.dtd"> <fontconfig> <match target="font"> <test name="family"> <string>Verdana</string> </test> <edit name="antialias" mode="assign"> <bool>true</bool> </edit> <edit name="hinting" mode="assign"> <bool>true</bool> </edit> <edit name="autohint" mode="assign"> <bool>false</bool> </edit> <edit name="hintstyle" mode="assign"> <const>hintfull</const> </edit> </match> </fontconfig> That's should do nothing for you, that's like your (system default) configuration looks now. But, try to change autohint to true and hintstyle to hintslight and _rerun_ program which uses Verdana to see the difference. Do you see any? You can of course try another combinations, if you would like to. Feel free to report me best combination ;-). -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c Petr Gajdos changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Priority|P5 - None |P3 - Medium CC| |tiwai@suse.com AssignedTo|tiwai@suse.com |pgajdos@suse.com -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c22 --- Comment #22 from Petr Gajdos 2012-04-05 07:25:30 UTC --- (In reply to comment #21)

Hi Petr,

Thanks for all your replies and suggestions which I will be testing. You have provided me with several ideas that I look forward to trying out.

Thanks. If we do any conclusion, I will amend default configuration for openSUSE. Thanks for cooperation! -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c24 --- Comment #24 from Petr Gajdos 2012-04-16 19:25:34 UTC --- Gordon, have you any findings yet? -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c26 --- Comment #26 from Petr Gajdos 2012-04-18 12:25:50 UTC --- Gordon, no hurry, I wanted only know if you plan to work on it ;-). -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c28 --- Comment #28 from Jan Matejek 2012-09-01 12:09:44 UTC --- Created an attachment (id=504266) --> (http://bugzilla.novell.com/attachment.cgi?id=504266) BCI vs autohinter 4x magnified (In reply to comment #27)

Gordon,

I will choose autohint=true, hintstyle=hintslight, if you find better combination, please let me know (by private email, by reopening bug or so).

Thanks a lot for cooperation!

FWIW, i don't see how you could pick that over the default autohint=false, hintstyle=hintfull. the fonts with BCI/hintfull are thinner, which is probably a matter of personal preference; what does bother me, however, is that with autohinter Verdana is very visibly fuzzy. if that's all the same to you, i'd like to see this setting reverted ;e) see attachment for comparison at 4x magnification. i'm trying to figure out how to easily screencap various fonts at various hinter/hintstyle settings, is there perhaps a utility for that? -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c30 Wolfgang Rosenauer changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CC| |wolfgang@rosenauer.org --- Comment #30 from Wolfgang Rosenauer 2012-09-15 12:46:05 UTC --- Just upgraded to 12.2 and found some fonts extremely ugly. Eventually it came down being Verdana mainly and I found this bug which seems to deal with Verdana config specifically. Especially on webpages which are using Verdana very often the font looks very ugly and wide now. One example is this bugzilla. I basically agree that it's a personal taste as well but for example here in bugzilla it is using Verdana and Arial. Both render completely different now Verdana being extremely bold and thick while Arial still looks pretty slim. Do I need to open a new bug about it? -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=737215#c32 --- Comment #32 from Bernhard Wiedemann 2012-09-27 14:00:06 CEST --- This is an autogenerated message for OBS integration: This bug (737215) was mentioned in https://build.opensuse.org/request/show/136212 Factory / fontconfig -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.