https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724 Ladislav Slezak changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- AssignedTo|lslezak@novell.com |sh@novell.com -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724 User bluedzins@wp.pl added comment https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724#c2 Maciej Pilichowski changed: What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Status|RESOLVED |REOPENED Resolution|INVALID | Summary|software management: drop the "update" action |software management: fix the problems with | |update vs. update unconditionally --- Comment #2 from Maciej Pilichowski 2008-06-13 10:57:26 MDT --- I rephrase: a) update and update uncod. perform two _different_ actions, yet, they share the same icon, so user cannot tell at all what will happen -- serious UI flaw b) update uncond. is missing from single actions, you can apply this only to the list: so please make it available also to single item Comment: 1) update action is redundant and serves absolutely no purpose, if you see at least one -- name it, I will be glad to hear about it 2) to force yast to reinstall package to specific version is a struggle (currently), it would be much easier without update/update-uncond. division 3) Stefan, we meet and meet at bugzilla constantly, it would be great to set the common ground, my aim is to point out all the problems with yast, to make it superior tool, what is your aim? By pretending there are no problems, you won't solve them. Status: I) since there is no point is reopening twin report of this, I am reopening this one with changed summary, but anyway, dropping update would be a real solution -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724 User sh@novell.com added comment https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724#c4 --- Comment #4 from Stefan Hundhammer 2008-06-17 03:47:33 MDT --- (In reply to comment #2 from Maciej Pilichowski)

I rephrase:

I rephrase: Read the documentation. It is all explained there in great detail.

a) update and update uncod. perform two _different_ actions, yet, they share the same icon,

They use the same icon because that status is what the affected packages will end up with. Is that so difficult to understand?

so user cannot tell at all what will happen

Huh? So you only look at icons and don't read the text beside that icon?

-- serious UI flaw

Nonsense.

b) update uncond. is missing from single actions, you can apply this only to the list: so please make it available also to single item

This is NOT a separate action. Why would it be? Do you really fail to see the difference between "All in this list -> update if newer version available" and "All in this list -> update unconditionally"? How much more verbose can a menu action become?

Comment: 1) update action is redundant and serves absolutely no purpose

Huh? That does not make any sense whatsoever to me. So you don't want to be able to update packages? You will find yourself very alone with that opinion.

, if you see at least one -- name it, I will be glad to hear about it

If you really need that explained, please ask on one of the mailing lists. I bet you will get several dozen answers in no time at all.

2) to force yast to reinstall package to specific version is a struggle (currently)

All it takes is one single mouse click. Please explain how this is a struggle. You just need to click on the version you want in the "Versions" tab. That click will even set the status of the package to "update" automatically.

it would be much easier without update/update-uncond. division

I repeat: Please read the documentation. Or please at least try both options to figure out what each one is.

3) Stefan, we meet and meet at bugzilla constantly

Right. There are very few users who seem to have so many problems with package management.

it would be great to set the common ground, my aim is to point out all the problems with yast

The problems YOU see. But you are not the only user. There are hundreds of thousands others (this is not exaggerating - just look at the sheer numbers of openSUSE users). You will have to face the fact that this tool is not cutom-made for you alone.

to make it superior tool, what is your aim?

My goal is to prevent insane changes caused by people who have a strange understanding of how things work, and how they should work according to their strange view of the world. Do you really think everybody else is just stupid, in particular the people who designed, implemented and keep maintaining this software? Don't you think in years upon years communicating with many, many users (and of course using the software ourselves all the time, too) we might have gathered quite some experience what works and what does not? What people can understand and what not? What kind of change makes sense and what kind does not?

By pretending there are no problems, you won't solve them.

Really, you should try to read the documentation before you post strange bug reports.

I) since there is no point is reopening twin report of this, I am reopening this one with changed summary, but anyway, dropping update would be a real solution

Dropping update? Do you have any idea what it is you are demanding here? -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724 User sh@novell.com added comment https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724#c6 --- Comment #6 from Stefan Hundhammer 2008-06-17 04:59:14 MDT --- (In reply to comment #5 from Maciej Pilichowski)

...

...

so user cannot tell at all what will happen Huh? So you only look at icons and don't read the text beside that icon?

Icon should be not used as dead-decoration. Icon should bring information, if it is only eye candy then it could be dropped.

It does. You just don't seem to realize that. [snip - you don't really want to read the reply I have in mind to that next section]

Oh, and one minor thing:

...

I repeat: Please read the documentation.

There is none. Check it for yourself.

There is none? Are you kidding? Hint: Google is your friend. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.

https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724 User sh@novell.com added comment https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=398724#c8 --- Comment #8 from Stefan Hundhammer 2008-06-17 08:07:02 MDT --- Ah, so you think we copy the whole PDF manual to the inst-sys just for users who flatly refuse to read any documentation? Interesting approach. Would you also be prepared for that additional half Gigabyte of RAM that would require? But sure, we are all just stupid. We are doing that just out of sheer spite. Wake up. Check the reality around you. -- Configure bugmail: https://bugzilla.novell.com/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug.