Dee McKinney wrote:
> 
> Anyone with 7.2 up & running here that could send answers
> to Joshua here ? Send him at isd@as.uaf.edu
Please include the receipient into the CC: next time. Asking to send
mails to third parties on mailing-lists is not necessarily the
politically correct way (It could mean asking to spam somebody).

> >>>>> Forwarded message from "Joshua J. Kugler" 
> 
> I've heard quite a bit about the merits of SuSE and was wondering what kind
> of learning curve would be required for someone moving from Mandrake.
> 
> 1. What is the layout for startup files (/etc/rc.d on Mdk)
/etc/sbin.d, containing LSB-conforming startup-scripts.

RH or MDK startup-scripts typically do not conform to the LSB, i.e.
they will not run without further adapations.

> 2. What is the default layout for files that are installed? Do they prefer
> /opt, or /usr/local, etc?
SuSE claims to follow the LSB and FHS, which in an ideal world would
mean:
/usr for OS-Vendor supplied packages
/usr/local for local (non-Vendor supplied) packages
/opt for add-on packages

In reality, SuSE actually basically follows this installation
scheme, but there are exceptions.

Major difference to RH/MDK: SuSE considers KDE, GNOME etc. to be
add-on packages, i.e. they install them to /opt.

> 3. How are the included GUI configuration utilities? I don't mind messing
> with text files, but on a new system, GUI config is nice. Mdk's control
> panel, HardDrake, etc., are REALLY nice.

Well, I liked YaST1 and I like parts of YaST2, but ...
* YaST2 requires a lot of system resources. (Using YaST2 on low
memory systems is a pain.)
* YaST2's alternative ASCII-GUI is un-ergonomic and close to being
unusable, IMHO.
* YaST2 probably suites the demands of beginners and assists
"advanced users", but there are parts in YaST2 which I find leaving
many things to be desired (esp. package-management).
* Some internals of YaST2 are arguable (esp. its relation to rpm's
database)

I have no personal experience with MDK, but according to what I have
read and heard, MDK's GUI configuration utilities probably are
superior to YaST2.

> 4. What is the preferred package? How good is the package compatability with
> Mdk/Redhat, etc?  i.e., could I install Redhat RPMs and be OK?
It depends. 
* SuSE uses the RPM-3.0.6 format, while RH uses RPM-4. I.e. RH
(SRC-) RPMS exploiting RPM-4-features will not work under SuSE.
* SuSE's current libc is glibc2-2.2.2, ie. many binary RH-RPMS are
binary compatible to SuSE-7.2
* SuSE's claim to follow the LSB in some cases means imcompatibility
to RH/MDK.
* SuSE's own RPMs in most cases are imcompatile to other
distributions (Different package names, different paths).

> 5. Where are config files usually stored? /etc?
Yes, to a wide extend they are installed to /etc and directories
below, but there are exceptions.

> 6. How well goes the install?  Mandrake's install has gotten PRETTY smooth.
Let me put it this way: If it works, it in most cases works smooth.
If not, things are going to become pretty nasty.

SuSE's installation procedure is demanding to HW resources (From my
experience: >64MB RAM + Swap), is not very fail-safe (If something
fails, it often starts from the beginning) and time consuming
(Installing the files while upgrading SuSE-7.1->7.2 on my notebook
(PI/166MMX, 64MBRAM, 4xCDROM, 2GB HD) took > 8 hours).

> With a little hand holding, I was able to install Mdk 8.0 on an P133 Compaq
> Armada the other day.  With 16MB of RAM. :)
This probably would be pretty tough with SuSE-7.2 :)

> Any other pertinant information you feel necessary.
SuSE is completely fixated on KDE, integration of all other GUIs
need to be called "immature" (Their GNOME integration sucks, IMO).
I.e. if you want KDE, SuSE is the right choice, if you want or need
to use another desktop, you might consider using another
distribution.
 
SuSE's ISupport (I don't know if they sell it outside of Germany)
is, .. 
..., last time I called them, it took them 18 days to respond with
"No clue,  never heared of this before..".

Though SuSE's persuit to conform to the LSB might pay-off in longer
terms, it nowadays actually means incompatibility to all other
distributions. So, whether LSB-compliance actually is an advantage,
still has to be proven.

SuSE officially only provides essential bug-fixes to a release of
their distribution. They do not officially provide feature-updates
for a release. SuSE also does not provide beta-packages in a
comparable way RH does provide on rawhide.


Don't get me wrong, I would not be using SuSE since SuSE's earily
days, if I was deeply dissatisfied with SuSE - The SuSE distro also
is far from being perfect. For me personally, YaST2 and SuSE's way
of focusing on KDE (neglecting other desktops) are close to being
inacceptable, while most other parts of the SuSE distro are in
pretty good shape.

Ralf

-- 
Ralf Corsepius 

Registered Linux User #26	http://counter.li.org

Hi Joshua: On Thursday 21 June 2001 22:10, you wrote:

Anyone with 7.2 up & running here that could send answers to Joshua here ? Send him at isd@as.uaf.edu

...

...

...

...

...

Forwarded message from "Joshua J. Kugler"

Any other pertinent information you feel necessary.

One of the curious things I have found is that SuSE runs scientific software like Octave and Scilab significantly faster than does Mandrake 8.0. For instance, I had Octave do a calculation that involved 32,000,000 floating point numbers and it was completed in about 12 minutes with SuSE 7.1. With Mandrake 8.0, I finally killed Octave when the run time exceeded an hour, for an almost identical computation. I would love to know why, in particular, Octave runs quite fast on SuSe but is excessively slow when run on Mandrake 8.0? Is there a special priority given to desktop apps in SuSE? -- Cheers, Jonathan

I moved form Man 7.1 to SuSe. I learned alot on Mandrake, but I kept running into issues that revolve around the *.mdk extensions that were used. I had some compatibility problems. Though I found that Mandrake to user friendly it IMHO doesn't compare to SuSE. SuSE is very very stable. I have not run into any compatibility issues to date. I'm a newbie of about a year. I honestly think that, as a Mandrake user, you'll find SuSE to be a notch or two above. And the users are great. If you have questions, come to the list. If a post doesn't get answered right away repost and/or change the header a bit and you'll get a response. IMHO this is the best users group I've been able to find. They polite, knowledgable, and friendly. I have gone from curious with mandrake to enthusiastic with SuSE and I can safely say I'm a fanatic and SuSE advocate. Try it - I think you'll be very satisfied, and 7.2 should absolutely rock. Cheers, Curtis Rey On Thursday 21 June 2001 10:10 pm, Dee McKinney wrote:

Anyone with 7.2 up & running here that could send answers to Joshua here ? Send him at isd@as.uaf.edu

...

...

...

...

...

Forwarded message from "Joshua J. Kugler"

I've heard quite a bit about the merits of SuSE and was wondering what kind of learning curve would be required for someone moving from Mandrake.

1. What is the layout for startup files (/etc/rc.d on Mdk) 2. What is the default layout for files that are installed? Do they prefer /opt, or /usr/local, etc? 3. How are the included GUI configuration utilities? I don't mind messing with text files, but on a new system, GUI config is nice. Mdk's control panel, HardDrake, etc., are REALLY nice. 4. What is the preferred package? How good is the package compatability with Mdk/Redhat, etc? i.e., could I install Redhat RPMs and be OK? 5. Where are config files usually stored? /etc? 6. How well goes the install? Mandrake's install has gotten PRETTY smooth. With a little hand holding, I was able to install Mdk 8.0 on an P133 Compaq Armada the other day. With 16MB of RAM. :)

Any other pertinant information you feel necessary.

Thanks!

j----- k----- A very happy Mandrake user. But open to change. :)