On 10/16/07, Sunny wrote:

Reply to list - Ctrl-R or "Message->Reply to List"

Cheers

I haven't used Evolution for awhile, but that's how it was. -- Svetoslav Milenov (Sunny) Even the most advanced equipment in the hands of the ignorant is just a pile of scrap. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Bryen wrote:

I wouldn't exactly call it trimming. More like cut and replace. I have to delete the contents of the To: field, then copy the contents of the CC: field into the To: field.

the second step is not usefull (the copy) - at least not in seamonkey jdd -- http://www.dodin.net -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, 2007-10-16 at 13:50 -0500, Bryen wrote:

This makes it a real pain to follow the rules of the road here. And apparently from a recent post I observed, others are having this problem too. I'm not criticizing the rules here, just asking for assistance in how to follow the rules here while still using Evolution, which I happen to like and use as my preferred client.

No big discussion wanted here. This is a can of worms. But I have to ask: If the list Netiquette for this list is to reply to the List, why is the Reply-To field set to the original author? Other lists I am on have this same preference that replies go to the list for all to see. They set the Reply-To accordingly. And never have these endless discussions which I expect will start right about now. I too use Evolution and find it curious that for this list a reply does not result in the list's preferred action. What brain-dead mail client does not use the Reply-To field when the user wants to, um, reply? -- Roger Oberholtzer OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST Ramböll Sverige AB Kapellgränd 7 P.O. Box 4205 SE-102 65 Stockholm, Sweden Tel: Int +46 8-615 60 20 Fax: Int +46 8-31 42 23 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, 2007-10-16 at 16:41 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

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* Roger Oberholtzer [10-16-07 15:55]:

...

If the list Netiquette for this list is to reply to the List, why is the Reply-To field set to the original author?

a search of the archives will give you a thousand explanations and much debate. Reading the help and, iirc, the welcome message will also give some explanation. Address is in the trailer on list posts.

Neither the Welcome message nor the auto-email from HELP give any explanations of any kind. Only a list of commands to use for subscription services. I, nor most people here, am not disputing the "Reply-to" issue, but rather the confusing state of our efforts to comply with the rules here. Evolution does not make Ctrl+L (or "reply to list") very intuitive and for some of us, it was confusing and cumbersome. I found it an agonizing chore over the past week to manually switch addresses around every time I wanted to reply. This affects the ease of community participation. It was only today, thanks to Sunny, that I found out about Ctrl+L. Actually, I've been using Evolution almost exclusively for 3 years and only now found out about this function. Another poster also mentioned that right-clicking a message in Evolution used to offer the Reply to list option, and that has now been eliminated, making that function even less intuitive. So here's my suggestion. The Welcome or HELP message should include some brief explanation for the top 3 most common email clients. Evolution, KMail, and Thunderbird. Evolution is the default email client on Suse and its perfectly natural that they would select that as their preferred client. I would also suggest that the trailer also include a link to the Netiquette page. (Although, even there, there is no mention of proper reply-to method/rules.) I've seen a few posts where people have been yelled at for doing the Reply-All button. And I don't think its fair that they should be yelled at. They weren't blatantly flouting the rules, they weren't being careless, they weren't being blase about it. They were simply using the default client on the very operating system this list is about. And that client (Evolution) does not make "Reply to list" intuitive. Is this fair? Is this a way to make us feel welcome? We can go on and on with a discussion, but all of this would be nipped in the bud if I had information right at the very start about Ctrl-L. Let's remember that I started this email thread in an effort to comply with the rules of this great house. And let's keep the focus of this thread on making sure people learn about "Reply to List" and not get sidetracked on the merits of the Reply list. That's been debated long enough in this list and we don't need to bring it back up again.

- -- ---Bryen---

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Tuesday 2007-10-16 at 21:46 +0200, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

No big discussion wanted here. This is a can of worms. But I have to ask:

If the list Netiquette for this list is to reply to the List, why is the Reply-To field set to the original author?

No, you got it wrong somehow: the list server doesn't set the "Reply-To" field to anything, it is left alone. If you see a reply-to it was set by the original sender of the email (like Bryen does). There is a header in list mail like this: List-Post: mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org that is used by some programs to activate the "reply to list" command. Unfortunately, not all programs do so. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD4DBQFHFTv4tTMYHG2NR9URAra0AJdv8QM0sCiqTMVsIjTKQaytxTVeAJ9Dqdmv rENMoXrwfqa9FaMqzGisXA== =d/w6 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Wednesday 2007-10-17 at 08:10 +0200, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

...

...

If the list Netiquette for this list is to reply to the List, why is the Reply-To field set to the original author?

No, you got it wrong somehow: the list server doesn't set the "Reply-To" field to anything, it is left alone. If you see a reply-to it was set by the original sender of the email (like Bryen does).

Exactly my point. Most all other lists I am on set the reply-to to the list. After all, the original sender did not sent the message to me, the list did.

- From the previous list FAQ: FAQ - Frequently asked questions of the suse-linux-e@suse.com list. ... Q2. Why do my replies go to the original poster and not the list? A2. We do not "munge" the mail headers by inserting a "Reply-To: suse-linux-e@suse.com" because it makes it more difficult subscribers to handle the mail the way they want to. Your mail client probably has a "reply" function as well as a "reply to all" or "reply to list" one; Please use the latter if you want you message to go to the list and not just to the original poster. Also, please don't complain about this on the list, it has been discussed many, many, many times in the past already. For background information see http://www.unicom.com/pw/reply-to-harmful.html New! Even Sourceforge has turned to the dark side: http://sourceforge.net/docman/display_doc.php?docid=6693&group_id=1

...

There is a header in list mail like this:

List-Post: mailto:opensuse@opensuse.org

that is used by some programs to activate the "reply to list" command. Unfortunately, not all programs do so.

Totally non-standard. Informative, but I bet almost never used in any e-mail program.

Not so: RFC 2369 and 4021. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Made with pgp4pine 1.76 iD8DBQFHFhiStTMYHG2NR9URArDOAJ45zBzRy+9nNvOOwQiqqKSjkVVngwCdGd96 gaz1L/CObFUlvIBC8VR0nIE= =oaC6 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 * Bryen [10-17-07 10:49]:

Carlos... Great posting, and I appreciate it. Sure wish I was able to get this FAQ when I joined in last week. Wonder why it is no longer available. Hmm.. Anyway, if there's a link to the full-blown FAQ, could you post it?

2nd hit on google "suse-linux-e" FAQ http://susefaq.sourceforge.net/faq/maillist.html - -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn4472 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHFn0fClSjbQz1U5oRAvGTAJ9B4Aaw/lZ0+EXIylwX3H05rnGjigCeIt/m yrs6WCVbgF4vh82SphMqN6o= =N4uG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Tue, 2007-10-16 at 21:46 +0200, Roger Oberholtzer wrote:

On Tue, 2007-10-16 at 13:50 -0500, Bryen wrote:

...

This makes it a real pain to follow the rules of the road here. And apparently from a recent post I observed, others are having this problem too. I'm not criticizing the rules here, just asking for assistance in how to follow the rules here while still using Evolution, which I happen to like and use as my preferred client.

No big discussion wanted here. This is a can of worms. But I have to ask:

If the list Netiquette for this list is to reply to the List, why is the Reply-To field set to the original author?

Perhaps he, like me, got tired of all the duplicate emails (and set it that way in the client program) because some people simply use reply-to-all instead of reply-to-list. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wed, 2007-10-17 at 00:55 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

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The Tuesday 2007-10-16 at 18:36 -0400, Kenneth Schneider wrote:

...

...

If the list Netiquette for this list is to reply to the List, why is the Reply-To field set to the original author?

Perhaps he, like me, got tired of all the duplicate emails (and set it that way in the client program) because some people simply use reply-to-all instead of reply-to-list.

Er... if you set the Reply-To to the original author, you will still get double mails. It might make sense if they set it to the list.

Also, many people use reply to all simply because their client programs do not have the reply to list function (mine doesn't).

- -- Cheers, Carlos E. R.

Seems to me that some people don't realize that a Reply-to-list function is not obvious to all. And those who aren't aware of the semi-"hidden" feature suffer the wrath of others. In any case, obviously this has been an issue before I came along. I figure the best way to solve this is to submit an enhancement request for Evolution which I just did. https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=334428 -- ---Bryen--- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wed, 2007-10-17 at 02:09 +0200, Igor Jagec wrote:

On Tue, 2007-10-16 at 18:49 -0500, Bryen wrote:

...

Seems to me that some people don't realize that a Reply-to-list function is not obvious to all. And those who aren't aware of the semi-"hidden" feature suffer the wrath of others.

Yep. There's a nice FAQ about Evolution: http://www.go-evolution.org/FAQ

...

In any case, obviously this has been an issue before I came along. I figure the best way to solve this is to submit an enhancement request for Evolution which I just did. https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=334428

The problem of Evolution is that it is not very much configurable. For instance, we can't edit Reply headers, toolbars, and so on.

This is because it is gnome based and gnome is slowly being "dumbed down". I have noticed quite a few packages that have a lot of the configurable options removed. One of the reasons I don't use gnome. linux is supposed to be about choice and many of those choices are being removed from the gnome apps. I may end up switching to another email client soon if evolution loses many more user options. Just my $.02. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

On Wed, 2007-10-17 at 00:55 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

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The Tuesday 2007-10-16 at 18:36 -0400, Kenneth Schneider wrote:

...

...

If the list Netiquette for this list is to reply to the List, why is the Reply-To field set to the original author?

Perhaps he, like me, got tired of all the duplicate emails (and set it that way in the client program) because some people simply use reply-to-all instead of reply-to-list.

Er... if you set the Reply-To to the original author, you will still get double mails. It might make sense if they set it to the list.

Also, many people use reply to all simply because their client programs do not have the reply to list function (mine doesn't).

Well, we all know there are still some lame client programs out there. In my case, if you looked, the reply-to is set to the list because _I_ got fed up receiving two emails when people replied to my posts. -- Ken Schneider UNIX since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE since 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Randall R Schulz wrote:

...

I just "cut" from the CC line and "paste" into the TO line

Widespread observation suggests that this would be considered a Sisyphean task by 99.95 percent of all users of email.

RRS lol, good one...I had to look up "sisyphean" never heard of it before.... wikipedia says "Today, whenever someone finds an assignment extremely hard, they may refer to it as herculean or Sisyphean." guess we all learn something new every day.

does just "cc"ing break the thread? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHFVzpCF89bP00wLgRAr0PAJ9VM2+h+s3+rJLVEcGWITvBCcPJOgCfVK0d RX8K6ITf4SF5b8jpfYuORWE= =tfWG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 * steve reilly [10-16-07 20:14]:

Bryen wrote:

...

I'm using Evolution/iMAP into this list. Is there anything I can do in Evolution to make it switch things around so that a reply doesn't get double-sent?

I just "cut" from the CC line and "paste" into the TO line

Why not just cut the To: line and leave the Cc:, or does that break evolution? - -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn4472 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHFVdmClSjbQz1U5oRAgeVAJ4gxusqAmAoVoJcIeD1Bw4LyxEezQCcCjZ0 estEDZI/XNFrtAZcQkgI9/8= =Vopz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Igor Jagec wrote:

Steve, There's no need about that on Thunderbird: http://tinyurl.com/2geaxo

Cheers!

Thanks! -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHFWccCF89bP00wLgRAkRpAJ997tExjU50Q82byMsTvAFr9MQrGwCeOtbJ TyP2wozS2lmlNcrCBLwIggY= =0Esm -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org