Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 05:33:56 schrieb Luca Beltrame:

Il Mon, 14 Sep 2015 22:30:29 +0200, Francesco Montesano ha scritto:

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Shouldn't plasma5-pa either obsolete kmix or somehow prevent it from starting at login?

KMix can work with non-PA setups, while plasma5-pa cannot. So it's IMO not really possible to obsolete it. If they're both present, kmix should not be autostarted. If it does, it's indeed a bug somewhere.

I can confirm the Bug , since the update I also have both icons in the Panel. -- Stefan Kunze SUSE Dispatch Engineer ________________________________________________________________ SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard, Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstr. 5, D-90409 Nürnberg

Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 09:55:08 schrieb Francesco Montesano:

Should I file a bug against tumbleweed? It has been reported already: https://bugzilla.opensuse.org/show_bug.cgi?id=944766

Btw, I don't think this can (or should) be handled in the spec file like you suggest. It would seem wrong when plasma5-pa deletes/reinstalls files from another package... The better solution would probably be that one doesn't start when the other is activated (not sure at the moment if/how this can be done though), but that should rather be done upstream I suppose. The only thing to be done on the openSUSE packaging side is probably that not both should be installed by default I think, at least until there's another solution. Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Hi Wolfgang 2015-09-15 10:22 GMT+02:00 Wolfgang Bauer :

Am Montag, 14. September 2015, 22:30:29 schrieb Francesco Montesano:

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In the meanwhile I might try to remove kmix by hand.

Just disable Autostart in KMix's settings. No need to uninstall it.

do you mean adding "AutoStart=true" to ~./kde/share/config/kmixrc? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

HI Wolfgang Thanks for the patience and the explanations 2015-09-15 11:27 GMT+02:00 Wolfgang Bauer :

Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 10:36:03 schrieb Francesco Montesano:

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Just disable Autostart in KMix's settings. No need to uninstall it.

do you mean adding "AutoStart=true" to ~./kde/share/config/kmixrc?

No, that's for the KDE3 version, and ~/.kde4/share/config/kmixrc would be for the KDE4 version.

For the KF5 based kmix, you'd have to add it to ~/.config/kmixrc.

Stupid me: that is the entry for my other kubuntu installation. For openSUSE correctly there is ~/.config/kmixrc

Or just open KMix's mixer, choose "Configure kmix..." from the Settings menu, and disable "Autostart" on the "Start" page.

If you choose to manually edit the config file, you should set "AutoStart=false" though. "AutoStart=true" will *enable* Autostart obviously (which is the default).

That was a typo. Anyway I've rechecked and rebooted and kmix is still running 1) in ~/.config/kmixrc: AutoStart is set to False (not by me) and the first lines read: [$Version] update_info=disable_kmix.upd:PlasmaVolume_DisableKMixAutostart [Global] AutoStart=false 2) In the kmix mixer menu the "autostart" entry is disabled (was already disabled before rebooting) 3) In the same menu, under "Sound menu" the entry "Dock in system tray" is enabled 4) kmix is running: ~ -> ps -e |grep kmix 3976 ? 00:00:00 kmix 5) the volume controls in the kmix icon respond correctly and are in sync with the ones from plasma5-pa 6) in systemctl status I see: /usr/bin/kmix -session 102171ef12af6000143348832000000018960010_1442310151_875410 So kmix is restored because was alive in the previous session and when restoring doesn't check the settings in kmixrc: a) is this a bug or the expected behaviour? Point 6) could be resolved if when installing plasma5-pa it's possible to kill kmix Ciao, Fra

Kind Regards, Wolfgang

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Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 12:04:50 schrieb Francesco Montesano:

6) in systemctl status I see: /usr/bin/kmix -session 102171ef12af6000143348832000000018960010_1442310151_875410 So kmix is restored because was alive in the previous session and

You're right, I just noticed the same here. And that's definitely the reason for this whole problem, because plasma5-pa does disable KMix's Autostart via a kconf_update script (that's why you had "Autologin=false" already in your kmixrc).

when restoring doesn't check the settings in kmixrc: a) is this a bug or the expected behaviour?

It's definitely not expected behaviour, this makes the whole Autostart option useless, I'd say. I'm not sure at the moment what the KDE4 kmix did to prevent this, actually I'm not even sure if it worked. I have to try...

Point 6) could be resolved if when installing plasma5-pa it's possible to kill kmix

Wouldn't help really. It would still be auto-restored for all users not being logged in at the time the plasma5-pa package is installed... Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Hi, 2015-09-15 18:03 GMT+02:00 Martin Schlander :

Tirsdag den 15. september 2015 14:39:01 skrev Wolfgang Bauer:

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[...] It's definitely not expected behaviour, this makes the whole Autostart option useless, I'd say.

Is this really a problem? I mean if the user doesn't want two mixers, won't he shut down one of them. And as soon as he does so, session management won't restore it again on next login (I assume, haven't tested in practice).

This is correct. (I've tested it)

Sounds to me like session management is working as it should. If the user doesn't want stuff to be started on login, he shouldn't leave it running on logout. If session management followed autostart settings it wouldn't work as users expected.

The session management correctly restores what was running before logout. But if one program offers the option, via configuration file or some menu, to not autostart, I think that the code should respect the decision and exit if autostart==false and the code has been restored by the session manager.

And of course fresh installations won't be affected.

True. But it might affect user upgrading from kde4 to plasma 5. And if this happens, you will notice when Leap is released. Ciao, Fra

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Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 19:54:57 schrieb Andrei Borzenkov:

Restoring saved session has absolutely nothing to do with autostart. And how session manager should know whether application was autostarted or not in the first place?

True. But KMix could turn off session management for itself, or it could refuse to start if Autostart=false (if that's possible to detect it should only do so if it is started by the session manager of course). Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 18:21:18 schrieb Francesco Montesano:

True. But it might affect user upgrading from kde4 to plasma 5. And if this happens, you will notice when Leap is released.

I don't think upgrading from KDE4 makes a difference in this case. Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 07:31:24 PM Wolfgang Bauer wrote:

Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 18:03:20 schrieb Martin Schlander:

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And of course fresh installations won't be affected.

According to the bug report, they are. KMix seems to be autostarted before its Autostart is disabled, and then gets restored by session management on each subsequent login.

The bug report is right, you can see it in openQA too: https://openqa.opensuse.org/tests/82575/modules/first_boot/steps/2 -- SUSE Linux GmbH, GF: Felix Imendörffer, Jane Smithard, Graham Norton, HRB 21284 (AG Nürnberg) Maxfeldstraße 5, 90409 Nürnberg, Germany -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

Am Mittwoch, 16. September 2015, 07:47:20 schrieb Luca Beltrame:

FYI, upstream is considering making session restore disabled by default (before people grab their pitchforks, it's a change of default, not the removal of the option) on new configurations

Right, it's also been changed in master (i.e.the upcoming 5.5) already. But the current plan AFAIK is to add a checkbox to the logout screen to easily enable/disable it. See https://mail.kde.org/pipermail/plasma-devel/2015-September/044310.html

which would help in this case.

Not really. There are two independent problems here: - kmix is autostarted on first login - kmix is started by the session management, if it is running on logout The second one would be "fixed" by disabling session management (either globally or only for kmix), the first one not. A possible fix for the first problem (i.e. for new installations or fresh user accounts) would be to ship a default kmixrc (/etc/xdg/kmixrc) with "AutoStart=false" though. Btw, there's also this upstream bug report, filed by an Ubuntu user: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=352331 Kind Regards, Wolfgang -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

On Tuesday 15 Sep 2015 18:03:20 Martin Schlander wrote:

Tirsdag den 15. september 2015 14:39:01 skrev Wolfgang Bauer:

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Am Dienstag, 15. September 2015, 12:04:50 schrieb Francesco Montesano:

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6) in systemctl status I see: /usr/bin/kmix -session

102171ef12af6000143348832000000018960010_1442310151_875410

So kmix is restored because was alive in the previous session and

You're right, I just noticed the same here.

And that's definitely the reason for this whole problem, because plasma5-pa does disable KMix's Autostart via a kconf_update script (that's why you had "Autologin=false" already in your kmixrc).

...

when restoring doesn't check the settings in kmixrc: a) is this a bug or the expected behaviour?

It's definitely not expected behaviour, this makes the whole Autostart option useless, I'd say.

Is this really a problem? I mean if the user doesn't want two mixers, won't he shut down one of them. And as soon as he does so, session management won't restore it again on next login (I assume, haven't tested in practice).

I would have thought that the system shouldn't really install a widget automatically as you should add via the "Add Widgets"

Sounds to me like session management is working as it should. If the user doesn't want stuff to be started on login, he shouldn't leave it running on logout. If session management followed autostart settings it wouldn't work as users expected.

And of course fresh installations won't be affected.

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On Wednesday 16 Sep 2015 09:47:52 Francesco Montesano wrote:

Hi Jan

2015-09-15 21:01 GMT+02:00 ianseeks :

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On Tuesday 15 Sep 2015 18:03:20 Martin Schlander wrote: [...] I would have thought that the system shouldn't really install a widget automatically as you should add via the "Add Widgets"

It is the volume widget: I think that it makes sense to have it installed by default on a desktop computer.

And if i prefer to keep using kmix ? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org

On Wednesday 16 Sep 2015 08:49:01 Luca Beltrame wrote:

Il Wed, 16 Sep 2015 09:32:34 +0100, ianseeks ha scritto:

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And if i prefer to keep using kmix ?

Remove the applet (it won't get re-added) and enable kmix autostarting. Problem solved.

of course, it not a problem to do that. i personally think that, in general, applets should be auto-installed, i may not have a use for a particular applet. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org