Thanks for the suggestion about the java-1.7 plugin. I'll try it. The flash issue is documented on bugzilla (Bug 350752, link below) However my point is more general, and is the request for a solution (valid, out of the box, not left to the user) for 11.0. I also add that the current solution proved to be the cause of various issues, mainly related to nspluginwrapper: * Bug 350752 - flash-player 9.0.115.0 does not work with Firefox and nspluginwrapper 0.9.91.4: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=350752 * Bug 334592 - Flash plugins, possibly other do not register on 64-bit openSUSE 10.3 -- nspluginwrapper segfaults: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=334592 * Bug 343908 - Epiphany/Firefox: no sound for video clips in webpages: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=343908 * Bug 363381 - acroread 8.x hangs if used as plugin: https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=363381 That's why I proposed to go back to the 32 bit firefox also on 64 bit systems. In the current situation you get no java, a partly working flash, and an unstable adobe reader plugin. It doesn't look a good situation. With kind regards, Alberto --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

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On 2/26/2008 at 06:16, Alberto Passalacqua wrote: That's why I proposed to go back to the 32 bit firefox also on 64 bit systems. In the current situation you get no java, a partly working flash, and an unstable adobe reader plugin. It doesn't look a good situation.

I actually think it's better to fix nspluginwrapper should there be a problem. I have in plus also a VLC media player installed with a 64bit plugin for firefox. Downgrading firefox to 32bit means, I need VLC in 32bit as well... then I can as well just install the 32bit version of openSUSE...

and according flash: I actually never had a problem with it on the factory installation... I'm frequent user of youtube and of some flash game sites.. and this seems to work fine.

My Flash works also pretty well with latest nspluginwrapper. nspluginwrapper gets crazy very rarely. The left issue for me is the not-really-quite-well-working Acrobat. The Java issue should be fixed with Java 1.7 (icedtea or later on Sun). What probably doesn't help in the short term is the new "Plugin 2" from Sun's newest Java 1.6. It's not using the OJI interface anymore and will work through NPAPI and NPRuntime with Firefox 3 so it would be a candidate to be able to work with nspluginwrapper but I'm not sure since they had to make some changes to Firefox 3 to support it. Wolfgang --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Alberto Passalacqua wrote:

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My Flash works also pretty well with latest nspluginwrapper.

As said, it seems to depend on the site. Look (again) at the bugreport.

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nspluginwrapper gets crazy very rarely. The left issue for me is the not-really-quite-well-working Acrobat.

If rarely means everytime you open a pdf in firefox, you're right :-)

Yes, Reader it is used less frequently than Flash, but there are important services using online PDF forms. I simply failed to find any nspluginwrapper version, which passes the focus test for both Flash and Reader. And I also failed to find a fix. Debugging of translation of native plugin calls to 32-bit x86 calls, sending them over socket, decoding XEmbed events, simulating X focus events needs really deep insight. nspluginwrapper is very sophisticated piece of code. -- Best Regards / S pozdravem, Stanislav Brabec software developer --------------------------------------------------------------------- SUSE LINUX, s. r. o. e-mail: sbrabec@suse.cz Lihovarská 1060/12 tel: +420 284 028 966, +49 911 740538747 190 00 Praha 9 fax: +420 284 028 951 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Il giorno mar, 26/02/2008 alle 08.37 +0100, Dominique Leuenberger ha scritto:

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On 2/26/2008 at 06:16, Alberto Passalacqua wrote: That's why I proposed to go back to the 32 bit firefox also on 64 bit systems. In the current situation you get no java, a partly working flash, and an unstable adobe reader plugin. It doesn't look a good situation.

I actually think it's better to fix nspluginwrapper should there be a problem. I have in plus also a VLC media player installed with a 64bit plugin for firefox. Downgrading firefox to 32bit means, I need VLC in 32bit as well... then I can as well just install the 32bit version of openSUSE...

That's ok, but it's always an unofficial workaround, and I would like to avoid it in a default installation. It caused issues, and it will probably cause again with the switch to new firefox releases As reported by Sbrabec in the first bug report, the developer is not that fast to answer too...

and according flash: I actually never had a problem with it on the factory installation... I'm frequent user of youtube and of some flash game sites.. and this seems to work fine.

Try google finance for example. I can't see plots of stocks for example. Regards, Alberto --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

well: having firefox 32 bit, you'll just get all the multimedia users on you, complaining that the 64bit vlc plugin, or mplayer plugin, or XYZ

I think the way with nspluginwrapper is the way to go, and for Java

Hi, plugin is not working anymore... I don't think that's a good tradeoff... There are valid alternatives, like totem-browser-plugin, which offers a better integration than mplayer. Moreover all these users didn't tell a word about that when the discussion was opened months ago. push the 1.7 inside, which is rumored to work in 64bit installations... and have never get tired of asking the proprietary providers if they would finally like to provide 64bit applications too... I know this seems to be incredible impossible for some companies (from patching some source I also know why) That's good news. But I would like to be certain of that :-)

I used that site quiet regular myself for a while... can't remember any problems with it (but I'm also not sure if I ever tried it on the 64bit system)... I'll give it a try this evening.. just to be sure...

Thanks. It stopped working recently for me. I don't know if it's related to the latest firefox patch or something like that. The result however is that on certain sites (google finance, some newspaper, ...) I see a white rectangle instead of the movie :( With kind regards, Alberto --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

I had the same on a 10.3: Sometimes it worked for 5 seconds and then the white rectangle showed up.

I'm referring to 10.3 too. Regards, Alberto --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Wed, 27 Feb 2008, Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

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On 2/26/2008 at 19:06, Alberto Passalacqua wrote: I had the same on a 10.3: Sometimes it worked for 5 seconds and then the white rectangle showed up.

I'm referring to 10.3 too.

Oh.. I was sure everybody on THIS list would be discussing about FACTORY... my fault.

with alpha2 flash does not work at all on my 64bit machine. -- Regards, Andreas Vetter --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Tirsdag den 26. Februar 2008 17:17:22 skrev Alberto Passalacqua:

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well: having firefox 32 bit, you'll just get all the multimedia users

on you, complaining that the 64bit vlc plugin, or mplayer plugin, or XYZ plugin is not working anymore... I don't think that's a good tradeoff...

There are valid alternatives, like totem-browser-plugin, which offers a better integration than mplayer. Moreover all these users didn't tell a word about that when the discussion was opened months ago.

Does 64-bit totem plugin work with 32-bit firefox? Another alternative might be the Firefox extension MediaPlayerConnectivity which allows you to select different players per format, regardless of architechture.. However my preferred solution to the problem is simply to steer people towards using 32-bit openSUSE altogether. By communicating that 64-bit is for: - powerusers who like to look for a little trouble - free software zealots (as almost all the problems are related to non-free software) - servers All users of the "it should just work"-kind should just use 32-bit. I even think the dual arch DVD9 should default to 32-bit installation on 64-bit hardware - so we don't have n00bs running 64-bit without even knowing it, and wondering why they can't get their homebank to work with Firefox. There's a reason why people don't get 64-bit MS Windows with their boxes. Dunno why they must insist on running 64-bit openSUSE, when running 32-bit MS Windows doesn't seem to bother them any. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

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There's a reason why people don't get 64-bit MS Windows with their boxes.

Well, you get 64 bit Vista with Lenovo Laptops. And yes, you can't get a Cisco VPN client.

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Dunno why they must insist on running 64-bit openSUSE, when running 32-bit MS Windows doesn't seem to bother them any.

That's completely different. Windows on 64 bit has issues with office too, while Linux is known to work better on those systems. Moreover many 64 bit users have workstations (not all of them are home users), and they still need java, flash and such because their workstation is also their PC.

That's the situation for most users here. They need 64 bit for their self written programs, but need a fully working browser on the exactly same machine. -- Best regards, Andreas Vetter Fakultaet fuer Physik und Astronomie Universitaet Wuerzburg --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Martin Schlander wrote:

Tirsdag den 26. Februar 2008 17:17:22 skrev Alberto Passalacqua:

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well: having firefox 32 bit, you'll just get all the multimedia users on you, complaining that the 64bit vlc plugin, or mplayer plugin, or XYZ plugin is not working anymore... I don't think that's a good tradeoff...

There are valid alternatives, like totem-browser-plugin, which offers a better integration than mplayer. Moreover all these users didn't tell a word about that when the discussion was opened months ago.

Does 64-bit totem plugin work with 32-bit firefox?

32-bit plugins as are incompatible with 64-bit apps like totem, firefox, etc. 32-bit modules are incompatible with 64-bit kernels just the same.

Another alternative might be the Firefox extension MediaPlayerConnectivity which allows you to select different players per format, regardless of architechture..

However my preferred solution to the problem is simply to steer people towards using 32-bit openSUSE altogether. By communicating that 64-bit is for: - powerusers who like to look for a little trouble - free software zealots (as almost all the problems are related to non-free software) - servers

What problem? Some developers have been slow in making their apps 64-bit. If AMD had gone the way of Intel back then, it wouldn't have been possible to run 32-bit apps on 64-bit machines.

All users of the "it should just work"-kind should just use 32-bit. I even think the dual arch DVD9 should default to 32-bit installation on 64-bit hardware - so we don't have n00bs running 64-bit without even knowing it, and wondering why they can't get their homebank to work with Firefox.

openSUSE 64-bit caters for both 32-bit and 64-bit apps once you select 32-bit compatibility. Longer term most 32-bit apps will disappear.

There's a reason why people don't get 64-bit MS Windows with their boxes. Dunno why they must insist on running 64-bit openSUSE, when running 32-bit MS Windows doesn't seem to bother them any. ---------------------------------------------------------------------

Some statement that is, comparison of the sloth with the hare, we could add viruses, malware, spyware and crashes just to be on the same level. That's MS's problem, they have had a hard time producing a robust 32-bit OS in around 20 years of trying, so why not get that sorta OK first before trying something new. People have to take whatever MS gives them, warts and all, so they have to be happy with what they are given. Windows is MS's business, it's not the business of openSUSE to ape what they do. So, if you are happy using 32-bit openSUSE on a 64-bit box, you are free to do so - it crawled on a 64-bit 10.0 box that only had a CD-RW drive, so 64-bit couldn't be installed. I've just upgraded that box to 64-bit 10.3 for use by a complete novice. Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Martin Schlander schreef: | Tirsdag den 26. Februar 2008 17:17:22 skrev Alberto Passalacqua: |>> well: having firefox 32 bit, you'll just get all the multimedia users |> on you, complaining that the 64bit vlc plugin, or mplayer plugin, or XYZ |> plugin is not working anymore... I don't think that's a good |> tradeoff... We are coming along, bit by 64bit, java was the last missing piece.. Who is trying to turn the clock back here? |> |> There are valid alternatives, like totem-browser-plugin, which offers a |> better integration than mplayer. Moreover all these users didn't tell a |> word about that when the discussion was opened months ago. | | Does 64-bit totem plugin work with 32-bit firefox? | | Another alternative might be the Firefox extension MediaPlayerConnectivity | which allows you to select different players per format, regardless of | architechture.. | | However my preferred solution to the problem is simply to steer people towards | using 32-bit openSUSE altogether. By communicating that 64-bit is for: | - powerusers who like to look for a little trouble | - free software zealots (as almost all the problems are related to non-free | software) | - servers Have you read your post yourself? | All users of the "it should just work"-kind should just use 32-bit. I even | think the dual arch DVD9 should default to 32-bit installation on 64-bit | hardware - so we don't have n00bs running 64-bit without even knowing it, and | wondering why they can't get their homebank to work with Firefox. This is the most stupid reason i ever heard... | | There's a reason why people don't get 64-bit MS Windows with their boxes. | Dunno why they must insist on running 64-bit openSUSE, when running 32-bit MS | Windows doesn't seem to bother them any. I realy cannot see what on earth this has got to do with it.... Windows never succeeded to create a wellworking 64bit version.. Linux has, besides the nonsens you write there is the ice tea java 1.7, which works allright enough.. - -- Have a nice day, M9. Now, is the only time that exists. ~ Besturingssysteem: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Current user: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ System: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 4.0.1 (KDE 4.0.1) "release 9.1" ~ OS: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Huidige gebruiker: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ Systeem: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 3.5.7 "release 72.6" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHxw5dX5/X5X6LpDgRAmUJAKCHEwOK3rzfpODTQ/u2U0INhsF/TQCgkVuf Jm2gUs2w2bYWk45KRl25+h4= =ZV9s -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Alberto Passalacqua schreef: |> We are coming along, bit by 64bit, java was the last missing piece.. |> Who is trying to turn the clock back here? | | That's not the point. It would perfect to have everything for 64 bit. We | have not, and we need those tools. | Living without them, or with them affected by serious issues (flash not | working properly, adobe hanging, java not working yet) is just a | nonsense for me. | Plus, having them working out of the box was a big added value of SuSE, | partly lost in 10.3 and probably not back in 11.0, for what I read (not | an official comment on this!). Despite the fact that some apps, which are 'third party', but well integrated in all-day use, are not working allright 'yet', is no, and may *not* ever be a reason to 'Dump' the 64bit os. In 10.3 Flash 9 works OK, PDF Reader works OK, and since last week, Ice-tea. 11.0 has issues because of qt versions? changing towards the future very fast, and: we notice the negative side-effects from the M$/Novell deal, many people that were important for development went another way.. So we have to live with that. Look what has been accomplished in the last few years, amazing! Hardware becoming better and better, and affordable to allmost everybody... Kde4 begins to look and feel realy 'cool', works almost OK, apart from some nasty desktopsettings bugs, but as it seems to me now, with the speed the bugs get killed: We might get ready at the deadline.. The pressure is up, sure, that has to be... Al of this together: No reason to dump 64Bit OS. Wait and see, the performance of a fi 64x2 CPU is magnificent. Would we throw away all the work that has been done to be able to manifacture the cpu's and the software, for a few plugins? I don't think so.. Wait and see, they are going to be ready when realy needed. Just think that we walk a very big step ahead of the masses, we create, and they will follow....and we do not ever quit, until the job is done.. | |> | All users of the "it should just work"-kind should just use 32-bit. I |> even |> | think the dual arch DVD9 should default to 32-bit installation on 64-bit |> | hardware - so we don't have n00bs running 64-bit without even knowing |> it, and |> | wondering why they can't get their homebank to work with Firefox. |> |> This is the most stupid reason i ever heard... | | No, it's not. Many users just don't know/notice the difference between a | 64 bit and a 32 bit system, especially among desktop users. They just | use what the system installs or put the 64 bit version because it's so | cool to use a 64 bit version. Then they complain about lack ofEnigmail | functionalities, and the responsibility is attributed to suse, not | certainly to sun, adobe or whatever else. If, users are turned away from M$ fi, they will learn very quickly, and they will be glad they did... And why wouldn't they use what the system installs? When one chooses the hardware, one chooses the os... At least with linux there is a choice, *and* there is progress! Offcourse they complain, and if we show them the way to the '3th-parties', they will complain there. The more complains, the better the chance, something gets done about it. About Adobe Acrobat we all know that the issues are not only Linux, but M$ as well, 7 did not work at all. A beta version was shipped to the public. Many problems with companies dependable on PDF, but that also got solved. | |> I realy cannot see what on earth this has got to do with it.... |> Windows never succeeded to create a wellworking 64bit version.. |> Linux has, besides the nonsens you write there is the ice tea java 1.7, |> which works allright enough.. | | Java is _part_ of the problem. There are knows issues with flash and | adobe reader as well (see bugzilla). On that side the problem is far | from being solved. There is only one solution: Find, Report and *Kill* the bugs, one by one.. ;) | | With kind regards, | Alberto. Also, Robby. - -- Have a nice day, M9. Now, is the only time that exists. ~ Besturingssysteem: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Current user: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ System: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 4.0.1 (KDE 4.0.1) "release 9.1" ~ OS: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Huidige gebruiker: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ Systeem: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 3.5.7 "release 72.6" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHxyleX5/X5X6LpDgRAv1LAJ9u66a0t+uz14S7e1vVyEn+c6OeSgCgyLu8 xCFi6ZZKLJ39D/ZndFVNj6k= =bnx4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Alberto Passalacqua schreef: | Martin was suggesting that SOME users WITHOUT specific need of 64 bit os | would encounter a lot less difficulties with the 32 bit version, and | he's absolutely right. OK this is true.. | |> In 10.3 Flash 9 works OK, PDF Reader works OK, and since last week, Ice-tea. |> 11.0 has issues because of qt versions? | | No. Flash 9 doesn't work well (bug in bugzilla) and acroread doesn't | work well (bug in bugzilla). Both bugs were reported in my first email. I will take a closer look at them.. | |> changing towards the future very |> fast, and: we notice the negative side-effects from the M$/Novell deal, |> many people that were important for development went another way.. | | What has the deal to do with a practical discussion to find a practical | solution is out of my comprehension. Well that is very simple: More work has to be done with fewer people.. | |> So we have to live with that. | | No. We want to live with that. It's a choice. There is no choice, what will happen, will happen.... | |> Al of this together: No reason to dump 64Bit OS. | | Noone wants to dump the OS. It's just a temporary and working solution, | waiting for things are ready. That is the spirit, working at getting things the right way.. | |> Wait and see, the performance of a fi 64x2 CPU is magnificent. |> Would we throw away all the work that has been done to be able to |> manifacture the cpu's and the software, for a few plugins? | | Those "few plugins" are necessary to 95% of the users. That performance | probably to half of the rest. And suse should target, at least namely, | the first part. I know that, i myself notice these things, but i am not someone who wants it all, and who wants it immediately this second.. ;) | |> I don't think so.. Wait and see, they are going to be ready when realy |> needed. | | Why should we believe to that? SuSE last three releases were, with some | exception for 10.3, disappointing (read reviews, I'm not the only one to | think that). Tell me why should I believe that 11 will be ready, well | tested, with everything in place. Yes, all a result of the dael with M$, you can stick your head in the sand, and not believe that, but that is your own concern. That is because of the expectations set from 9.3, which was 'OK'. If you are not believing in it, it will not be possible, because you shut the door at it. You *have* to believe it, to make it happen ;) 11.0-3 is where we are talking about, not only 11.0, you know that yourself? Everybody can see that the os will not be *totaly* ready at the first chapter? If it would be, there would not be progression, would there? We just do not want to make it *worse*. | |> Just think that we walk a very big step ahead of the masses, we create, |> and they will follow....and we do not ever quit, until the job is done.. | |>From my point of view, we need a reality check. The "masses", as you | call them, are using other distributions (read ubuntu), and they're not | all idiots. They look for simplicity, they found it there. openSUSE | sometimes looks too much for perfection, and instead of finding it, it | messes things up. Ubunto is a rising star, i saw that years ago, i tried it, but it does not work for me, and is nothing compared with SuSE, but that is my opinion. Ubuntu florishes upon the deal with M$.. Many people see SuSE as part of 'ze enemy' now... I totaly agree that things get messed up more than less.. imo this is caused by wanting too many, at too little time. To solve this, there has to be a division 'above factory', but you need the right people for that. There must be an agreement, at what is *most* important, and these things must be achieved first, before going any further. This does not mean there has to be waited. Because the Roadmap, does not only contain one version, but every version should have at least one BIG goal, that *has* to reached. These goals have to be tuned upon the wishes of the 95%, because we are all part of both: the 5, and the 95%. In the end we are all endusers. My wishes, as enduser: Simplicity, Easy understandable way of installing apps, stability, and fast in use. Highly configuerable to personal settings, and *FULL*, and i mean full- Media-support, and here come the plugins you fight for. This last point comes first, because if i look at myself, 1) i want to be in contact with the rest of me (LAN),and the world (WAN) 2) i want to have my music while working, and 3) i want to have my desktop the way it suits me best, and after that 4) i am going to look for the things that need improving. USB devices have to work, floppy for me also, as there are older devices still, that sometimes have to be cleaned or updated the *old* way... So this means that all *this* has to work. System installed, and working with network configuered and up, and all nessesary patches downloaded. The office suite has to work ofcourse, printer(s) and scanners configuered, and working without fuss. In sync with PDA or Psion, and able to watch my Pics and Movies from Cam. Everything there is more, is a present to me ;) | |> If, users are turned away from M$ fi, they will learn very quickly, and |> they will be glad they did... |> And why wouldn't they use what the system installs? |> When one chooses the hardware, one chooses the os... |> At least with linux there is a choice, *and* there is progress! |> Offcourse they complain, and if we show them the way to the |> '3th-parties', they will complain there. |> The more complains, the better the chance, something gets done about it. |> |> About Adobe Acrobat we all know that the issues are not only Linux, but |> M$ as well, 7 did not work at all. A beta version was shipped to the |> public. Many problems with companies dependable on PDF, but that also |> got solved. | | It's not a question of comparing Windows and Linux. I think we should do | OUR part, and MS will do its part to make users life easier. But the | question is, are we doing our part? Some choices tell me we aren't. That is what i am telling: We must do our part. And we should have to make choices about what we think is important: Stability, or new ways, because they can hardly go together... The 95%, you're talking about, want stability first, and might enjoy a little adventure. They want that Multimedia 'works' *DOT* They are not interested in politics to turn down the compettetor/rival... They want to be able to watch 'you tube', create distribute and read their PDF files, and want to vieuw java-applets and play java games, and why not? They are small and cool. | |> There is only one solution: Find, Report and *Kill* the bugs, one by |> one.. ;) | | Please, read the bug about the plugin wrapper, for example. It's not so | easy to fix it seems, and it requires time also according to N, and it's | recognised it doesn't work properly with flash and acroread. OK, i understand your point. These bugs need to have absolute priority, because that is what you are asking. What about combining efforts, and beat these problems? Hey you nice Testers and Devs out there!? Join us and let us beat these nasty, irritating bugs together? | | Regards, | Alberto | Nice talking to you ;) - -- Have a nice day, M9. Now, is the only time that exists. ~ Besturingssysteem: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Current user: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ System: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 4.0.1 (KDE 4.0.1) "release 9.1" ~ OS: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Huidige gebruiker: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ Systeem: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 3.5.7 "release 72.6" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHx/V8X5/X5X6LpDgRAjRvAKCZT1caaBfGlYEIk/QkPhgPC+1DkgCeIZrU roEg0ASIdXGlSCUq3wa3+sQ= =q29R -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Martin Schlander schreef: | Torsdag den 28. Februar 2008 20:41:17 skrev M9.: |> We are coming along, bit by 64bit, java was the last missing piece.. |> Who is trying to turn the clock back here? | | There are tons of issues.. | | Latest I came across was 64-bit mplayer and vlc not supporting rtsp-protocol, | because of some live555 library not working. Danish national television is | moving to streaming using this protocol.. even using h.264 format. | | Ironically the old mms://+WMV solution works pretty well on my x86_64-box. | When, in progress there will not be tons of issues? There have to be, else there would be no progression at all.. Just lets do it, solve the issues, one by one, and be glad we do something that matters.. ;) Let us be glad that we know not to be out of order/work the coming years :) - -- Have a nice day, M9. Now, is the only time that exists. ~ Besturingssysteem: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Current user: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ System: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 4.0.1 (KDE 4.0.1) "release 9.1" ~ OS: Linux 2.6.22.17-0.1-default x86_64 ~ Huidige gebruiker: monkey9@AMD64x2-sfn1 ~ Systeem: openSUSE 10.3 (x86_64) ~ KDE: 3.5.7 "release 72.6" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4-svn0 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHxyqBX5/X5X6LpDgRAiquAKCwKIMKzISZyF8RyZKpa87vC/LjdgCgsVnQ cwjX15B01UF5rG/o5x8dA78= =vv/p -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org