On 07/08/09 21:18, Sascha 'saigkill' Manns wrote:

Hi Jakub,

Am Freitag 07 August 2009 20:05:39 wrote Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek:

...

...

do you know, if we have Pulseaudio in upcoming Distro-Versions as default?

I bet, yes. But newer ALSA and kernel may have fixed some snd_pcm_avail/snd_pcm_delay problems which made PA crash so often (Intel HDA and Intel something are most probably already fixed, my VIA82xx, apparently not). OK.But why we need Pulseaudio. In past Versions we had alsa. But now we have two Sound Manager.

It's made audio inoperable on my boxes for any application where the hardware isn't specifically addressed. Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

2009/8/8 Donn Washburn :

On 08/07/2009 05:16 PM, Sid Boyce wrote:

...

On 07/08/09 21:18, Sascha 'saigkill' Manns wrote:

...

Hi Jakub,

Am Freitag 07 August 2009 20:05:39 wrote Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek:

...

...

do you know, if we have Pulseaudio in upcoming Distro-Versions as default?

I bet, yes. But newer ALSA and kernel may have fixed some snd_pcm_avail/snd_pcm_delay problems which made PA crash so often (Intel HDA and Intel something are most probably already fixed, my VIA82xx, apparently not).

OK.But why we need Pulseaudio. In past Versions we had alsa. But now we have two Sound Manager.

It's made audio inoperable on my boxes for any application where the hardware isn't specifically addressed. Regards Sid.

Same thing here.  Nothing with sound is working including Firefox, Amarok, Xine and Skype.

With the default config if PulseAudio is going to be used for something then is must be used for everything. PulseAudio default config block the sound card, yes... if you don't use the ALSA pulse plugin then all ALSA apps will have no sound. That's why the Gnome startup script changes the ALSA config to use the pulse plugin. Enable PulseAudio using hw:0 without using the ALSA pulse plugin? Sure, it's a bad idea. Nobody proposes such a thing. But if you use the ALSA pulse plugin all those apps will have sound. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

* Sid Boyce [08-07-09 19:34]:

I just rebooted one of the Milestone 5 upgraded boxes and there is sound on youtube video - a long lost friend has returned.

BeWare, my experience has been that it can mysteriously leave and just as mysteriously, come back. I can also now play mp3's, but not wmp's as packman wants to install a slew of 586 arch and downgrade several other packages to provide the necessary aps. AND it is necessary to use 11.1 as there are no packages for 11.2/Factory :^(.... -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

* Cristian Morales Vega [08-07-09 20:06]:

2009/8/8 Patrick Shanahan :

...

* Sid Boyce [08-07-09 19:34]:

...

I just rebooted one of the Milestone 5 upgraded boxes and there is sound on youtube video - a long lost friend has returned.

BeWare, my experience has been that it can mysteriously leave and just as mysteriously, come back.  I can also now play mp3's, but not wmp's as packman wants to install a slew of 586 arch and downgrade several other packages to provide the necessary aps.  AND it is necessary to use 11.1 as there are no packages for 11.2/Factory  :^(....

That's because PA automatically kills itself when no app uses it. When is running it blocks the sound card, when doesn't it's free for other apps. You just need the ALSA pulse plugin... if PA is enabled in KDE we will make sure that if PA is used then the ALSA pulse plugin is also enabled automatically so you will not have these problems.

alsa-plugins-pulse-1.0.20-6.1 ?? -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

At Sat, 8 Aug 2009 13:30:12 +0200, Cristian Morales Vega wrote:

2009/8/8 Patrick Shanahan :

...

* Cristian Morales Vega [08-07-09 20:06]:

...

2009/8/8 Patrick Shanahan :

...

* Sid Boyce [08-07-09 19:34]:

...

I just rebooted one of the Milestone 5 upgraded boxes and there is sound on youtube video - a long lost friend has returned.

BeWare, my experience has been that it can mysteriously leave and just as mysteriously, come back.  I can also now play mp3's, but not wmp's as packman wants to install a slew of 586 arch and downgrade several other packages to provide the necessary aps.  AND it is necessary to use 11.1 as there are no packages for 11.2/Factory  :^(....

That's because PA automatically kills itself when no app uses it. When is running it blocks the sound card, when doesn't it's free for other apps. You just need the ALSA pulse plugin... if PA is enabled in KDE we will make sure that if PA is used then the ALSA pulse plugin is also enabled automatically so you will not have these problems.

alsa-plugins-pulse-1.0.20-6.1

??

Yes. But installing it is not enough, you must configure ALSA to use it. Not tested, but a "ln -s /etc/asound-pulse.conf /etc/asound.conf" should do the trick.

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio. Takashi -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]:

...

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio.

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue? Takashi -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

...

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On 8/11/2009 at 11:21, Sid Boyce wrote: On 11/08/09 07:20, Takashi Iwai wrote: At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]:

...

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio.

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue?

Takashi

I have done some testing with and without pulseaudio enabled. Results are the same, no audio. Some apps complain that they can't connect to socket if pulseaudio is disabled. Regards Sid.

I think the problem is that the 'user' logging into the desktop get's the ACL set a bit to late on the audio devices and as such is not (yet) allowed to play music. I sometimes happen to have the sound, sometimes no sound.. did not really invest time to find what's the difference between the two states. Dominique -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 11/08/09 10:31, Takashi Iwai wrote:

At Tue, 11 Aug 2009 11:27:32 +0200, Dominique Leuenberger wrote:

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...

...

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On 8/11/2009 at 11:21, Sid Boyce wrote: On 11/08/09 07:20, Takashi Iwai wrote: At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]:

...

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio.

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue?

Takashi

I have done some testing with and without pulseaudio enabled. Results are the same, no audio. Some apps complain that they can't connect to socket if pulseaudio is disabled. Regards Sid.

I think the problem is that the 'user' logging into the desktop get's the ACL set a bit to late on the audio devices and as such is not (yet) allowed to play music. I sometimes happen to have the sound, sometimes no sound.. did not really invest time to find what's the difference between the two states.

That appears feasible. If so, adding the user to group "audio" is a workaround. If the problem still occurs, the culprit is something else.

thanks,

Takashi

both root and user added to group audio, still the same. Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 12/08/09 04:52, Rajko M. wrote:

On Tuesday 11 August 2009 08:17:55 pm Sid Boyce wrote:

...

both root and user added to group audio, still the same. Regards Sid.

Silly question, did you log out and back in.

Actually rebooted to load a new kernel. As gnome is perfectly fine, I wonder how I can discover which backend it's using. Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 11/08/09 10:28, Takashi Iwai wrote:

At Tue, 11 Aug 2009 10:21:17 +0100, Sid Boyce wrote:

...

On 11/08/09 07:20, Takashi Iwai wrote:

...

At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]:

...

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio.

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue?

Takashi

I have done some testing with and without pulseaudio enabled. Results are the same, no audio. Some apps complain that they can't connect to socket if pulseaudio is disabled.

Are you referring to the KDE system sound or the whole sound system? The former is rather a Phonon / KDE issue while the latter is more about PA and sound driver. Patrick's question looks like the former one, and that's why I asked it.

The whole system except where specific devices are configured. e.g with Softrock Software Defined Radio config - No problem:- sample_rate = 48000 # ADC hardware sample rate in Hertz name_of_sound_capt = "hw:1" # Name of soundcard capture hardware device. name_of_sound_play = "hw:0" # Use the same device for play back channel_i = 1 # Soundcard index of in-phase channel: 0, 1, 2, ... channel_q = 0 # Soundcard index of quadrature channel: 0, 1, 2, ... microphone_name = 'hw:0' mic_sample_rate = 48000 # Microphone sample rate in Hertz Skype works. Trying under KDE3, kaffeine, aplay /jet.wav or video in firefox, no audio. Kaffeine used to be OK, perhaps under KDE4, so I shall give that a try later. On one box with KDE4, no problem. On another using KDE4, no sound. Looking at config files, loaded modules and processes, I see no difference between the working and non-working box.

IOW, do you get any sound on 11.2? Since we have many layers, the old good principle, divide and conquer, is required...

Takashi

Sound problems appeared just before Milestone 1 and persist up to Milestone 5. Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

* Takashi Iwai [08-11-09 02:22]:

At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]:

...

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio.

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue?

I am only sure that I do not have sound for system events, except startup and shutdown. I have streaming audio, can play mp3's and wav's but not wmp's, packman does not have 11.2 available and 11.1 requires toooo many changes (many to earlier version) to my bleeding-edge version of M5 :^). Flash video and sound work. 15: PCI 04.0: 0401 Multimedia audio controller UDI: /org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/pci_10de_59 Unique ID: 8otl.gwFUdVJGIiF SysFS ID: /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:04.0 SysFS BusID: 0000:00:04.0 Hardware Class: sound Model: "nVidia CK804 AC'97 Audio Controller" Vendor: pci 0x10de "nVidia Corporation" Device: pci 0x0059 "CK804 AC'97 Audio Controller" SubVendor: pci 0x1462 "Micro-Star International Co., Ltd." SubDevice: pci 0x7585 Revision: 0xa2 Driver: "Intel ICH" Driver Modules: "snd_intel8x0" Module Alias: "pci:v000010DEd00000059sv00001462sd00007585bc04sc01i00" Driver Info #0: Driver Status: snd_intel8x0 is active Driver Activation Cmd: "modprobe snd_intel8x0" Config Status: cfg=no, avail=yes, need=no, active=unknown What processes/config files do I need to consult? -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 11/08/09 16:03, Takashi Iwai wrote:

At Tue, 11 Aug 2009 10:38:57 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Takashi Iwai [08-11-09 02:22]:

...

At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]:

...

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio.

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue?

I am only sure that I do not have sound for system events, except startup and shutdown. I have streaming audio, can play mp3's and wav's but not wmp's, packman does not have 11.2 available and 11.1 requires toooo many changes (many to earlier version) to my bleeding-edge version of M5 :^). Flash video and sound work.

15: PCI 04.0: 0401 Multimedia audio controller UDI: /org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/pci_10de_59 Unique ID: 8otl.gwFUdVJGIiF SysFS ID: /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:04.0 SysFS BusID: 0000:00:04.0 Hardware Class: sound Model: "nVidia CK804 AC'97 Audio Controller" Vendor: pci 0x10de "nVidia Corporation" Device: pci 0x0059 "CK804 AC'97 Audio Controller" SubVendor: pci 0x1462 "Micro-Star International Co., Ltd." SubDevice: pci 0x7585 Revision: 0xa2 Driver: "Intel ICH" Driver Modules: "snd_intel8x0" Module Alias: "pci:v000010DEd00000059sv00001462sd00007585bc04sc01i00" Driver Info #0: Driver Status: snd_intel8x0 is active Driver Activation Cmd: "modprobe snd_intel8x0" Config Status: cfg=no, avail=yes, need=no, active=unknown

What processes/config files do I need to consult?

Well, KDE system sound isn't my area... Maybe KDE guys know better about the problem.

Takashi

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm........ I haven't tried Gnome to see if I have the same problems. Regards Sid. -- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 12/08/09 03:01, Sid Boyce wrote:

On 12/08/09 02:19, Sid Boyce wrote:

...

On 11/08/09 16:03, Takashi Iwai wrote:

...

At Tue, 11 Aug 2009 10:38:57 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Takashi Iwai [08-11-09 02:22]:

...

At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]: > > Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio. >

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue?

I am only sure that I do not have sound for system events, except startup and shutdown. I have streaming audio, can play mp3's and wav's but not wmp's, packman does not have 11.2 available and 11.1 requires toooo many changes (many to earlier version) to my bleeding-edge version of M5 :^). Flash video and sound work.

15: PCI 04.0: 0401 Multimedia audio controller UDI: /org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/pci_10de_59 Unique ID: 8otl.gwFUdVJGIiF SysFS ID: /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:04.0 SysFS BusID: 0000:00:04.0 Hardware Class: sound Model: "nVidia CK804 AC'97 Audio Controller" Vendor: pci 0x10de "nVidia Corporation" Device: pci 0x0059 "CK804 AC'97 Audio Controller" SubVendor: pci 0x1462 "Micro-Star International Co., Ltd." SubDevice: pci 0x7585 Revision: 0xa2 Driver: "Intel ICH" Driver Modules: "snd_intel8x0" Module Alias: "pci:v000010DEd00000059sv00001462sd00007585bc04sc01i00" Driver Info #0: Driver Status: snd_intel8x0 is active Driver Activation Cmd: "modprobe snd_intel8x0" Config Status: cfg=no, avail=yes, need=no, active=unknown

What processes/config files do I need to consult?

Well, KDE system sound isn't my area... Maybe KDE guys know better about the problem.

Takashi

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm........ I haven't tried Gnome to see if I have the same problems. Regards Sid.

No problem with gnome. Tried KDE4 on this box that was running KDE3, that too works, so I have 1 KDE4 Milestone 5 box that still has the problem, /etc/group on that one only has "user" added. Judging by my results, audio works in Milestone 5 with KDE4 and gnome. Regards Sid. Further testing, under KDE4 kaffeine - no sound. Looks like KDE problems as everything works in Gnome. In KDE4 audio works but my quisk application complains of python double free and glibc error, qjackctl hangs on a "FUTEX_WAIT_PRIVATE" when run as root. Regards Sid.

-- Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support Specialist, Cricket Coach Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

* Martin Schlander [08-11-09 12:10]:

Tirsdag den 11. august 2009 16:38:57 skrev Patrick Shanahan:

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* Takashi Iwai [08-11-09 02:22]:

...

At Mon, 10 Aug 2009 17:11:13 -0400,

Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

* Takashi Iwai [08-10-09 04:28]:

...

Actually we have a system setup script, setup-pulseaudio.

Does this enable system sounds on 11.2/Factory M5 ??

Are you sure that it's a PA issue?

I am only sure that I do not have sound for system events, except startup and shutdown.

if you're using phonon-backend-gstreamer, try if switching to phonon-backend- xine helps.

If both are installed you can switch between backends in systemsettings -> multimedia.

If phonon-backend-gstreamer is causing these problems maybe you should report your experience on the opensuse-kde list, where default phonon backend is currently under discussion.

I *am* using the xine backend. -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 4:18 PM, Sascha 'saigkill'

OK.But why we need Pulseaudio. In past Versions we had alsa. But now we have two Sound Manager.

Evidently Pulseaudio is designed to replace alsa and oss, but it has features to emulate both of them. Personally, I don't see the need for it for the majority of users, but it's evidently the wave of the future. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PulseAudio -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 9:58 PM, Dean Hilkewich wrote:

Pulse audio does not replace Alsa or OSS.  Either Alsa or oss is needed for their hardware drivers.  No Alsa or oss = no sound at all.

Thats what I thought, but the wikipedia article as a little unclear on it. Thanx -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Samstag 08 August 2009 03:27:00 schrieb Larry Stotler:

On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 4:18 PM, Sascha 'saigkill'

...

OK.But why we need Pulseaudio. In past Versions we had alsa. But now we have two Sound Manager.

Evidently Pulseaudio is designed to replace alsa and oss, but it has features to emulate both of them. Personally, I don't see the need for it for the majority of users, but it's evidently the wave of the future.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PulseAudio

Replace hardware drivers with software, which depends upon them. My god, stop... Rubbish. -- Best regards, Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek http://jakubrusinek.pl/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek wrote:

Am Freitag 07 August 2009 22:18:34 schrieb Sascha 'saigkill' Manns:

...

OK.But why we need Pulseaudio. In past Versions we had alsa. But now we have two Sound Manager.

We didn't use naked ALSA. We used ESD for GNOME and aRts for KDE, so stop with this dummy repeating of things you heard and read on the Internet...

-- Best regards, Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek http://blog.jakubrusinek.pl/

Arts hasn't been needed for quite a few years now. I've been using KDE without it for a long time. What you are saying is simply not true. Dean -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Samstag 08 August 2009 16:46:00 wrote Philipp Thomas:

On Fri, 7 Aug 2009 22:18:34 +0200, you wrote:

...

OK.But why we need Pulseaudio. In past Versions we had alsa.

No we don't. All desktop environments have needed a sound manager, most of all because most sound hardware doesn't do sound mixing in hardware and only ALSA offers its own mixer plugin. Aaah. Thanks for clarifying.

So environments like enlightenment (ed), GNOME (esd) and KDE (aRts) all had their The we could say, that pulseaudio is the replacement for aRTs in KDE4?

-- Sincerely yours Sascha Manns openSUSE Ambassador openSUSE Marketing Team openSUSE Build Service Web: http://saschamanns.gulli.to Project-Blog: http://lizards.opensuse.org/author/saigkill Private-Blog: http://saschasbacktrace.blogspot.com

Le vendredi 07 août 2009, à 20:05 +0200, Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek a écrit :

Oh, yeah, and PA 0.9.16 has been released.

Oh, and I'm wondering: can we get it in for 11.2? Or is too late? Scott, are you working on the update? Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Le vendredi 07 août 2009, à 21:49 +0200, Lubos Lunak a écrit :

As far as I understood it, GNOME now has a hard dependency on Pulse Audio - could somebody please confirm or deny this?

Yes, upstream has moved to PA. Vincent -- Les gens heureux ne sont pas pressés. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, Aug 07, 2009 at 03:51:00PM -0600, Stephen Shaw wrote:

On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 3:14 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:

...

Le vendredi 07 août 2009, à 21:49 +0200, Lubos Lunak a écrit :

...

 As far as I understood it, GNOME now has a hard dependency on Pulse Audio - could somebody please confirm or deny this?

Yes, upstream has moved to PA.

Vincent

--

Also with the new desktop kernel they are changing the HZ to 1000 which should also help things out.

Heh, that's funny. HZ should have no affect on any userspace application or usage model. No one has yet to prove otherwise... thanks, greg k-h -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Fri, Aug 07, 2009 at 05:15:34PM -0600, Stephen Shaw wrote:

On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 5:00 PM, Greg KH wrote:

...

On Fri, Aug 07, 2009 at 03:51:00PM -0600, Stephen Shaw wrote:

...

On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 3:14 PM, Vincent Untz wrote:

...

Le vendredi 07 août 2009, à 21:49 +0200, Lubos Lunak a écrit :

...

 As far as I understood it, GNOME now has a hard dependency on Pulse Audio - could somebody please confirm or deny this?

Yes, upstream has moved to PA.

Vincent

--

Also with the new desktop kernel they are changing the HZ to 1000 which should also help things out.

Heh, that's funny.  HZ should have no affect on any userspace application or usage model.  No one has yet to prove otherwise...

thanks,

greg k-h

My understanding was that it checked the hardware more frequently as a result. Also, I thought pulse involved stuff from kernel to userspace?

Yes, PA uses high-resolution timers, which have nothing to do with the HZ value of the kernel. thanks, greg k-h -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

2009/8/8 Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek :

Am Samstag 08 August 2009 02:09:27 schrieb Greg KH:

...

Yes, PA uses high-resolution timers, which have nothing to do with the HZ value of the kernel.

Lennart Poettering tells otherwise... Tells that each distro but Fedora sucks (because he doesn't even know why PA works best on Fedora, which is awfully funny).

If you are talking about https://tango.0pointer.de/pipermail/pulseaudio-discuss/2009-February/003150....... note that changing HZ from 250 to 1000 is a change from 4ms to 1ms. He is talking about 5ms (Fedora) vs 210ms (openSUSE). He says he obtained the results from alsa-time-test (http://pulseaudio.org/wiki/BrokenSoundDrivers). I suppose these 5ms/210ms values come from clock_gettime(CLOCK_MONOTONIC), the first column. Well, in openSUSE 11.1 I indeed get asserts from that test if I write the output to my main HD. And these asserts come after a sometimes ~200ms clock_gettime(CLOCK_MONOTONIC) jump. But once I use my second HD, that no other process uses, I don't get asserts anymore. So those ~200ms values seems to come from underruns after a *momentary* high CPU/HD load. The normal latency is of ~8ms. If someone runs the alsa-time-test in openSUSE and sees a problem then open a bug report at https://bugzilla.novell.com/, but on my machine I don't see any problem. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

Am Samstag 08 August 2009 schrieb Greg KH:

Yes, PA uses high-resolution timers, which have nothing to do with the HZ value of the kernel.

I think it can only do that if it's setuid root. Greetings, Stephan -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On 10.08.2009 10:41, Takashi Iwai wrote:

It works. But, this is also irrelevant with the latency issue, which is one of the main reasons why PA is unstable. (Note that there are other reasons, so please don't take this as the single culprit and the absolute solution.)

Recently many snd_pcm_avail and snd_pcm_delay fixed are applied to ALSA. -- Best regards, Jakub 'Livio' Rusinek http://jakubrusinek.pl/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-factory+help@opensuse.org

On Mon, 10 Aug 2009 10:35:34 +0200, Takashi Iwai wrote:

At Fri, 7 Aug 2009 16:00:26 -0700, Greg KH wrote:

...

On Fri, Aug 07, 2009 at 03:51:00PM -0600, Stephen Shaw wrote:

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On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 3:14 PM, Vincent Untz

wrote:

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...

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Le vendredi 07 août 2009, à 21:49 +0200, Lubos Lunak a écrit :

...

 As far as I understood it, GNOME now has a hard dependency on Pulse Audio - could somebody please confirm or deny this?

Yes, upstream has moved to PA.

Vincent

--

Also with the new desktop kernel they are changing the HZ to 1000 which should also help things out.

Heh, that's funny. HZ should have no affect on any userspace application or usage model. No one has yet to prove otherwise...

The desktop kernel actually helps, as found in bug 526780 https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=526780

However, I bet it's neither about HZ=1000 nor PREEMPT. The suspicious culprit is rather CGROUP and GROUP_SCHED, which are disabled in the desktop kernel. These were once known to have bad side-effects...

11.2 is sticking with with v0.9.15 I suppose? there seem to be some changes for 0.9.16 using RealtimeKit so pulseaudio can run as a realtime process by default which might reduce the dropouts. 0.9.16 will be part of fedora 12 which is scheduled for release about a week before 11.2.

thanks,

Takashi

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