Mailinglist Archive: opensuse (3653 mails)

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RE: [SLE] Suse support not up to it
  • From: "Berge, Harry ten" <berge@xxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 08:55:26 +0200
  • Message-id: <8C6ADF4772B7D511A3E40008C7BB878A809A79@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
We've had an indoor training from SuSE Germany for a week, and whe are
pleasantly surprised with the knowledge they brought. There was'nt just some
education guru, but instead a (former) developer who knows all the in's and
out's of Linux/SuSE. And on the fly, he fixed some problems for us.

What I want to say is that the problem is not the knowledge of the SuSE
people in general. The problem is with the OEM's, but I think that the Linux
community is somewhat responsible for this.... An example. The not working
soundcard mentioned earlier in the postings. Whe want the manufacturer to
support the soundcard with a driver. But which driver for which soundsystem?
There is no uniform audio system on linux (although Alsa is included in the
2.5 kernel) so it is very hard for a manufacturer to develop a driver. On
Windows you have the uniform WDM. Every manufacturer can order some
documentation about this (I suspect they must pay for it :-) and the can
write their driver(s)....

If Linux wants to have some chance on the desktop market then there have to
be some defined standards for ALL distributions on typical desktop market
tools: scanners, audio, video, printers, ..., ...

regards Harry

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ben Rosenberg [SMTP:ben@xxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Sunday, June 16, 2002 11:06 AM
> To: suse-linux-e@xxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [SLE] Suse support not up to it
> * R. Stia (rnr@xxxxxxxxxxx) [020615 22:59]:
> ::Excuse us Ben, But that is a pretty high and mighty attitude. Now we all
> ::know how good you are. It's too bad we all don't have the great depth
> ::and expanse of knowledge that you do. Maybe you should be running
> ::slackware where your opinions would be held in higher esteem. SuSE is
> ::supposed to be "user friendly".
> My expansive knowledge has come from 5 years of screaming at the
> monitor, driving my wife nuts on a daily basis, reading the 40+ books on
> my shelf and generally digging in and asking the dumbest questions
> imaginable. What I didn't do was say things like " This doesn't do A. so
> it sucks, this doesn't do B. so I'm formatting my harddrive." I knew
> that Linux didn't have the mainstream support yet..but it would. Heck I
> bitched for 3.5 years there was no Quicken port and I screamed like a
> banshee for years that there was no Quicktime so I could watch trailers
> and other such things...CrossOver is a God sent.
> I just don't like bullshit FUD and misconceptions. I don't like people
> blaming LINUX for OEM and ISV failures to support their products such as
> printers and the like. The last figures I saw put LINUX at a higher
> desktop usage then Mac...but we STILL have issues just getting printers
> to print. I really don't like people who whine about things that with a
> little effort they can get help on..and instead they blame their own
> failings on the software they chose to use.
> If you wanna know why I don't use Slackware or's this
> simple. I started getting into Linux w/ SuSE and I like it. I see no
> reason to change. Previous to that I was a user of OS/2 and
> NeXTStep...mainly OS/2 and if that wouldn't have gone away pretty much.
> I would still be using it. I'm not trying to be arrogant and I was
> pretty jovial until I started reading things like "Niche OS" and hearing
> complaints that I hear from CNet and ZDNet MS pundits that haven't been
> true in a very long time. And when people play the " if it doesn't do
> this were going back to Windows..nanananana :P " card then I say " Hey,
> GREAT! Go back to Windows ..don't let the door hit you in the ass on the
> way out. It's not's being fed up with the same old excuses
> and crap. It took me a long time to learn the very, very little bit
> about LINUX and UNIX that I know. I'm not GURU..I just don't give up
> when stuff doesn't work and I'm not afraid to RTFM ..also if that
> doesn't work...if I'm to thick to understand what I'm reading I ask
> questions. No matter how stupid they may seem. Sometimes I need my head
> jarred.
> I realize SuSE's support rules aren't as well layed out as one would
> have them and if you don't like the $2.00 support that ya get then ask
> the question here. You may not get an instant answer...I know I answer
> questions as I can. But I do work about 70 hours a week and have about
> 20 hours of commute time a week. But I try. And so do many others. Based
> on the fact that out of $80 for a Pro box..about $5.00 of that is prolly
> what your charged for "installation" support..and that doesn't even pay
> 1 hour of a good support tech's salary. They do a pretty good job with
> hosting these mailing lists and the support database on the website is
> 1st rate. SuSE does alright by it's customers...much better then others
> yet worse then some. Them's the brakes. ;)
> ::That is pretty poor support in my book. I really don't want to get into
> ::a squabble with anyone on this list and that is all I have to say. May
> ::all of the high and mighty flame me if they must,I will not reply. I
> ::suppose now I will be "blacklisted" and receive no more help. Very
> ::dissapointing to say the least.
> Nahh..your not the first person to bitch at me or to bitch at someone
> else on the list when they loose their patience. If you ask a question
> and I know the answer..I prolly wouldn't even remember your email
> address. I'd just give ya the answer or at least a heads up about where
> to find the docs that explain it better then I could.
> Believe skin and many others around here is much thicker then you
> would think. :)
> Cheers! And remember ... Have fun!
> -=Ben
> --=====-----=====--
> mailto:ben@xxxxxxxxx
> --=====--
> Tell me what you believe..I tell you what you should see. -DP
> --=====-----=====--
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