Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-project (783 mails)

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Re: [opensuse-project] Re: openFATE feature 306967, KDE default
  • From: Juan De Vincenzo <juandevincenzo@xxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2009 00:31:22 -0300
  • Message-id: <2c6dc0b00908032031o9998584hd043d287ea27c8ee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
This is as well my first e-mail to -project, and first of all I want
to clarify that I'm just a plain, rather new OpenSUSE user, but a lot
has been said and I just wanted to add a couple of concepts, if I may.
I'm also not sure if something of what I say here was already
proposed, I apologize in that case.

1.- As a new user, one of the things that caused me a very good first
impression two weeks ago when I installed OpenSUSE was the fact that
both desktops were available, as well as the option for KDE 3.5, which
still has many fans who dislike KDE 4. This first impression was given
by the fact that I come from a distro that not only defaults to KDE,
but has completely removed support for it (Slackware). The points is
that a really interested user would probably try both of them.

2.- To avoid the conflict about what is listed first, couldn't the
desktop selection screen be modified to show the two primary options
aligned horizontally instead of vertically? I understand that from a
design point of view that could trigger a conflict about which should
go right and which should go left, because there would be the issue of
where do the eyes go first, but I think it might help to put both on
the same level, meaning, eliminating the possibility of having
somebody assuming one is better than the other because it is listed on


On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 10:03 PM, Kevin "Yeaux"
Dupuy<kevin.dupuy@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Sent from Kevin Yeaux's mobile device.

On Aug 3, 2009, at 5:19 PM, Charles Kerr <charles@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

This is my first post to -project, so before I dive in, a quick
I wrote and maintain the Qt /and/ GTK+ versions of Transmission, and
Dekstops every few weeks.  I sympathise with both sides -- as both a user
a developer -- and have been reading this thread with interest.

I think two unchecked radiobuttons are both fair, defensible ideas.
I'm sure everyone can see why GNOME people would prefer GNOME to go first.
I'm sure everyone can see why KDE people would prefer KDE to go first.
Jean's Belgian solution seems like a great compromise suggestion to me.
Some GNOME users' (such as Jim's) concession saying "put KDE at the top"
seems like an earnest attempt to keep the peace, and to keep balance.

Lubos and a couple of others keep slapping down those suggestions based
on reasoning that seems shaky to me.  The argument is that users don't
have to choose bash vs zsh, or emacs vs vim, and so on; therefore,
making users choose between KDE and GNOME is inherently biased to GNOME.
But that's apples and oranges -- choosing a Desktop also chooses a raft
of default applications, such as (say) KTorrent or Monsoon.  That's a
choice compared to a shell or MUA.  They're not even in the same ballpark.

First off, welcome Charles! I agree, as a GNOME user who doesn't want to see
a desktop selected by default, your comments are spot on.

I don't, and I think most people here don't care which desktop is first. In
fact, the current setup was an attempt to make the selection fair (G before
K, so GNOME before KDE). This was fair to me - after all, I work in
politics, and at least in the area I live in I've never seen a ballot where
the candidates weren't listed in alphebetic order. I don't think anyone
accuses openSUSE of supporting GNOME because it's on top, just as no one I
know accused the board of elections of supporting John McCain because his
name was above Barack Obama's on the ballot. If someone has a problem with
that reasoning, they should go talk to the alphabet.

And on your second point, thanks for bringing up that when we choose a
desktop, you're not just choosing a UI for selecting applications. You're
choosing a suite of apps that manage your computing life. The main reason I
use GNOME is because of Banshee, F-Spot, Tomboy, Beagle, and other apps that
are IMHO better than what you get on any other OS, including Win7 or OS X.
Yes, I could install and run those in KDE, but then they don't look right or
integrate as well with the desktop. So this is a bigger decision than what
email program you want to use, this is basically what type of complete
experiance do you want from openSUSE, the one GNOME gives you or the one KDE
gives you?
Kevin "Yeaux" Dupuy
openSUSE Project Member
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