Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-project (245 mails)

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Re: [opensuse-project] Re: [opensuse-factory] status report distribution week 5
  • From: "Francis Giannaros" <francis@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 22:14:13 +0000
  • Message-id: <94dc34e40802061414v144228cse5c436723343f218@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
On Feb 6, 2008 9:11 PM, Stephan Kulow <coolo@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Am Dienstag, 5. Februar 2008 schrieb Stephan Kulow:
* the DVD5 does not have any non-oss software on it - this will
allow for a simplified EULA - the non-oss medium will continue
to have the old EULA then

Looks like Francis was the only one to actually read my status report
and it caused some discussion at the end of the IRC meeting.

So I would like to clarify some bits:
- we won't take the non-oss repo away and it will be easy to download
flash, acroread or your preferred application
- we will continue providing a non-oss addon CD with a stricter EULA
- we want to make the EULA _really_ simple in using only OSS, currently
the EULA (if you read it) forbids you to distribute copies of your
downloaded openSUSE - because of the non-oss software bundled

So the question is: do we (as project) want to set a sign in making it
a bit more difficult to install non-oss software or is the ease of use
preferred over a simply license? We're very open for your feedback, but
Michl, AJ and me as openSUSE management team would prefer to use open
source only on the default medium.

Just to clarify my concerns/problems:

* Having access to the non-oss software is certainly very handy. The
user doesn't even have to think about anything extra in the
installation, and when it's up they have things like Flash, MP3
support, and Java already up-and-running (there is hope for free
Java). These are things that at least 99% of users will be using,
without a doubt. When it's all on one medium, it's definitely easier
-- no need to download extra ISOs, burn them, check extra options
during the install, etc.

* It seems to me like this system has worked pretty well for quite a
long time: it's clear that it directly benefits 99.95% of users, and
it's not apparent that we get much stick for it (the only time I
remember is the fosdem mention from some debian people last year, but
even there I think it's more an issue of just marketing). Needless to
say, complaints about this are very rare and don't seem to be very
prominent or persistent AFAICS.

* I love software freedom and I try to avoid proprietary software at
all costs. openSUSE still (and has had for a long time) has some very
easy OSS options -- the CDs. The CDs contain no non-essential
proprietary software; anyone not wanting to download any proprietary
software (even in an ISO) could always use one of the 1 CDs. In my
opinion we're hardly doing anything different when we provide a
non-OSS add-on CD to when we have a DVD with mixed software, since
it's still very clear that you can install from the CDs for a 'purer'
OSS environment.

* Someone already made the remark that it's not easy in all places to
get access to the Internet. openSUSE Indonesia community specifically
mentioned that this is one of their major problems. For people who are
_just_ given the DVD now there's an even bigger step back.

* I know many people haven't complained about this issue yet, partly
perhaps because many don't know (I guess time on the list will tell),
but also because I believe the main complainers will come after the
release -- those who don't follow the development and don't try the
betas. My father, for example, is not so happy about it ;-)

That said, if we do decide to go fully OSS for the DVD way I don't
think it will be the most devastating thing in the world and that we
can make it better by allowing the non-OSS repo to be enabled during
the install (as we do for the CDs), and making it clear that the
packages are being downloaded from the Internet (so users don't
complain about the longer installation time).

That's all for now. Any thoughts?

Kind thoughts,
Francis Giannaros
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