On 10/02/2009 04:14 AM, Stephan Kulow wrote:
Am Freitag 02 Oktober 2009 schrieb Takashi Iwai:
At Thu, 01 Oct 2009 16:24:43 -0400, Jeff Mahoney wrote:
Quick question for you on how the kernel projects on the build service should be structured. I've noticed GNOME and KDE have :Factory projects, but I'm unclear on their uses. Are the GNOME and KDE projects the devel projects and the GNOME:Factory and KDE:Factory projects the bleeding edge? Is there a cascade effect where changes start in :Factory, then flow into the regular repo, and then into the openSUSE:Factory project? If that's the case, then my problem is easy enough to solve.
GNOME and KDE maintain their factory packages in :Factory and use it also for people who want the lasted GNOME/KDE on older distributions. So it's bleeding edge as far as openSUSE is concerned. KDE has also :UNSTABLE, which contains random svn snapshots that have no relation to factory packages. I don't think there is something similiar for GNOME.
Ok, so my understanding there was wrong then. This is a pretty common complaint about the build service from community members. There are so many projects and no clear definition as to which is which without having access to the build service to read the project description. I think having all these different projects is great and necessary for a true community driven openSUSE, but it can get confusing pretty quickly. If there is no standard convention, perhaps we'll just keep Kernel:HEAD as our "UNSTABLE" and create a new release development branch when we branch HEAD from the current factory.
With the current setup, that will end up putting untested and potentially unstable code in the devel project, which appears to be synced fairly frequently into openSUSE:Factory. That's not what we want, No, I synced it 2 times because of important bug reports. We can push to O:F from any other project like Kernel:112_BRANCH, there is no problem with that. There is no automatism that pushes :Head - it's just me :)
obviously. OTOH, the KOTD HEAD/master kernel has always been the bleeding edge and I don't want to change that either.
We can sync the 11.2 tree to Kernel:HEAD after the split, but then we lose the testing we regularly get from having that repo. OTOH, if we add another kernel package, and use that as the devel project, then we can keep Kernel:HEAD the way it is and preserve openSUSE:Factory as well. Actually I don't see the value of having 2.6.32-rc2 in master branch. And if there is, then you need to create a 112_BRANCH project _now_ and you can use it to push updates to O:F bypassing the devel project.
This is similiar to devel:languages:perl, where there is already a newer perl than what we'll have in 11.2. Perl updates are pushed now from direct factory copies.
I think this is a general problem found in other devel projects, too. As we are in the version freeze for 11.2, no development is allowed in devel project :) It'd be nice if we have a generic rule about this.
There is a reason we put 11.2 in version freeze: a) so people test a pretty fixed set of packages for a longer time b) so developers fix bugs instead of updating to unrelated versions
Don't get me wrong, but I see 75 bugs reported against "Kernel", so if someone tests 2.6.32-rc2 is the least of my worries.
With a giant upstream community producing a moving target, motivated testers are often willing to test the next prerelease to see if their problem is already fixed. Then it's *much* easier to fix the openSUSE release since the work is reduced from duplicating effort to develop a patch to just isolating the patch that fixed the problem. This is something we've historically done anyway. The only question I had was in relation to the build service. We don't expect many users to update to an early rc unless they are asked or have a reason for it. In some cases, our users want to assist in upstream development by running the vanilla kernel, so providing those packages helps us all out as Takashi's already noted. -Jeff -- Jeff Mahoney SUSE Labs -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-kernel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse-kernel+help@opensuse.org