Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-factory (602 mails)

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Re: [opensuse-factory] Re: [PLEASE SPEAK UP] Disabling legacy file systems by default?
Dear Michal K, every time anyone tries to silence someone else with an
argument of authority, especially if that argument is being the holder
of truth, I'll see that person as a moron. Sorry to you all if it
didn't seem like well justified rebound, maybe I did overreact. e2fs
was only in the progs package name in my vocabulary, never the file
system itself, so here are all those mistakes.

Michal S, I don't see disabling a feature that's been available for a
long time as "not removing support for it" unless you did something as
easy to unlock as what browsers do to prevent you from accessing sites
with old certificates, that doesn't stop normal users from consciously
overriding it. If it's disabled for most people, then for most people
support is not present anymore. I'm sorry we disagree in that. Also
the thread says "disable by default" and not "disable optionally" or
something that doesn't break mounting as root. When I tried it just
failed.

About the RTFM part, mostly because of YaST I regard openSUSE as one
of the few distros that really anyone can use. In my view it's way
better than Ubuntu in that, except that more people heard about the
latter. I only meant to express that I hope it remains a very
user-friendly distro. If that doesn't hold then my hope is lost.
Manuals are things that only people that are truly versed in Linux
will ever be able to read and understand, and in fact will ever open
it as well. I'll say it again: please don't assume that just because
it's system infrastructure that it's not software for people that
won't ever read any software manual. Please remember that most
people's experiences with software help or manuals is nothing alike
what we have with man, info and everything. Not because open source
programmers are geniuses and corporate people aren't, but because
manpages were mostly written for and by programmers, and that is also
why so many tech people from other areas that aren't versed in that
particular jargon really can't read a manpage. I myself usually think
and reread for dozens of minutes to really dig each argument in
manpages for standard c functions. I'm happy nobody ever told me to
start learning C from these sources, so I ask of you to rethink about
that part where people should learn SUSE from manpages at the first
time they can't mount a drive. Don't just say RTFM for newbies. Please
keep teaching Linux in openSUSE fun! I see I'm not the only one that
enjoys it here.

And for those questioning the utility of new users: a system with no
users is dead, so you just must keep at least a minimum throughput of
people learning it over time. It's not optional, it's need. With that
many distro options just don't take it for granted, especially in the
long run.

Please someone clarify me: How preventing users from mounting as root
from where they could gain no further escalation could be more
damaging than a myriad of other mistaken or bad informed commands when
ran as root? I don't understand why can't this blacklist affect only
auto mount or other mount commands issued from a GUI application ran
by the a normal user. Is it just that hard to do it where it matters
most, or blocking root access is really intended here? I don't intend
no critic here, I'm just not seeing the whole picture that you're
arguing really. If someone has sudo or my root password I really can't
avoid that they are able to jeopardize the system even without any
flash drive. Is it really intended to prevent wilful people that
really should be able to mount it from doing so?

I guess it's getting a nicer error message or addendum, but what about
an analog for GUI actions, is it possible? At least something that
gets propagated over file manager apps that come in the DVD. I'm sorry
if it's already mentioned, the thread has gone way to long and here I
am making it worse.

Also, if I am not wrong this time, f2fs is the only officially
supported way you can install apps as opposed to only some app data to
an external SD card in Android. Some phones since version 6.0 if I
recall correctly have an easy "transfer app" option that does fsck on
the external drive. Can it be really that obscure even if it's so easy
to make in a considerable amount of Android devices? But then maybe
that doesn't matter, does it?

Best regards and have a good day,
Raphael
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