Hi, Firstly, I know Leap is joint effect. That is, some packages are from SLE and some others are from Factory. Both sides are working great, "separately". Today I just want to talk about some leaf problems. 1. Some packages have different maintainers for the version in Factory and the version in Leap. No explanation. It is the nature of Leap. 2. The maintainers from SLE for Leap is actually unknown from build.opensuse.org eg. I am the maintainer for all the lua versions in openSUSE:Factory, and libplist/libimobiledevice stuff in hardware repository. But I don't know who is the maintainer from SLE counterpart. No one tells me. No where to find. I don't even know SLE has those packages (Because I'm not the target of SLE sales :-D) So, no communication between us, at all. But when users report bug on bugzilla, everything is assigned to me because I am the only person they know. sometimes security leaks too (our security team is brilliant, they care both openSUSE and SLE, but in different bugzilla IDs) I don't even know Leap version is none of my business, at all. (Because of #3) Even if I know, it should be my responsibility to fix it (1. I am the assignee 2. sometimes Factory fixes should go into Leap) To me, it's a brand-new and fresh bug report. It means only one bug report entry, no previous discussions, no re-assign. So I take cares of it, interact with the reporter, preparing fixes for Factory and Leap. I just following the standard procedure for bug fixes. Bang! "Sorry, XXX is from SLE, MR rejected!" This message annoys me because the fixes now look like a waste of my time. I don't know who to talk now. And the maintainer from SUSE doesn't know there's a bug here needed to be fixed by him either. It just leaves there. Let's say, even if it is from SLE, what about a bug fix backported from Factory? By nature, it should be taken care of by Factory maintainers. But you can't touch it at all. Because it will break the "sync" between SLE and Factory. There's only one-way sync: SLE to Factory. And many times, it just vanished after I reassigned it to SLE maintainer. (boo#1010089, boo#988491 and more) because Leap is not their 1st priority, leaving me the person on fire. Can you imagine that a security flaw is known by me for one month but just no way to fix it? This is just the easiest case that I think every maintainer meets. One more thing, things changed in large scale. I have 300+ packages. I have to "beg" SLE maintainers 300+ times to fix something. It will become a great burden. So, here, we eagerly need to develop a common sense/rule that let Factory/SLE maintainers continue to maintain the same package, just like the OBS development procedure that both can submit things. And it should be no email threads involved. That is, if maintenance request gets accepted, the other maintainer will automatically catch up. We don't have to know each other at all. Maintenance team have to judge, based on whether it is a valid fix, instead of whether it comes from the right origin. 3. People don't know which package is from SLE. Release team knows. We don't. Or we can't remember that much even was told. And things just get update, eg in 42.1 some packages are from Factory, in 42.2 they are from SLE because no one from the community actually care it. Or, in 42.1 some packages are from SLE but in 42.2+ they are from Factory because there's a strong reason to switch origin. Currently there's no clear indicator that tells people which package is from SLE in official Leap repositories. You have to test yourself by wasting your time preparing maintenance request to be rejected for it. 4. There is no clear rule to override packages by the one from different origin. In 42.1, I know there's an email sent here, that people who want to override SLE packages can submit directly from openSUSE:Factory to openSUSE:Leap:42.1 But today when you do so, most of the times you will be told "it is from SLE, don't do that". But sometimes things do work. We don't know why. There should be a clear rule for doing this. And both Factory and SLE maintainers should know if he's "still" responsible for that package. Or both sides will not take care of it until told to. Personally I think to expect bug fix from SLE for Leap for leaf packages is kinda like to expect you become a millionaire tomorrow. Plenty of reasons like: * Leap is 2nd class citizen for SLE maintainers. I can say more. but it is true * Bug reports go to community maiintainers who can actually do nothing * SLE maintainers can't follow upstream that tight as 7x24x365 community maintainers because they do need time off work. * One of the dependencies in Leap may be from Factory, so the same problem doesn't get reproduced in SLE * Many others like he doesn't register on bugzilla.opensuse.org, or he left his job and those packages are unmaintained now even they are from SLE Finally, I just want to say, SUSE is great. It let its maintainers do things for openSUSE Factory. So why not let community maintainers help maintaining SLE to some extent, in Leap field that can easily/flawlessly go into SLE? Greetings Marguerite -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-factory+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse-factory+owner@opensuse.org