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Re: [opensuse-project] Re: [opensuse-factory] The road to systemd for openSUSE 12.1
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On 06/17/2011 11:14 AM, Greg KH wrote:
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 04:33:58PM +0200, Guido Berhoerster wrote:
* Kay Sievers <kay.sievers@xxxxxxx> [2011-06-16 16:20]:
and with Debian and Ubuntu two
major distros have already opted out of that.

'That' means systemd? Debian is very active in systemd development, and
Ubuntu hasn't decided anything, besides the fact that the original
author from Canonical has left, and is no longer developing Upstart.

AFAIK Debian plans to offer it as an option but as default due to
systemd being Linux-only,

Debian offers _everything_ as an option, so that's not an issue here.

from a quick glance at the upstart repo it seems that upstart is
actively maintained.

It has minor bug fixes but no new development. It is essentially

So the major
distributions participating in this "standardiaztion" seem to be
Fedora, oS, and possibly Mageia/Mandriva.

You forgot about Gentoo and Arch and a raft of other minor distros that
have all contributed to systemd development and integrated it into their
systems already.

So please, this isn't an issue at all, the entire rest of the Linux
community is moving to systemd, as a chance to standardize a lot of the
cross-distro differences, we can not, and should not, ignore that at

My big concern with all of the systemd discussion is how much
flexibility that we (and UNIX generally) have classically had and are
losing with systemd. It's like the Apple/GNOME-ification of the boot
process and that's not necessarily a good thing. How many feature
requests have we seen to take functionality away? Many of the things
that are just being handwaved away as "no longer necessary" use the
extremely simplistic environment of a smartphone or tablet as an
example. Real world deployments of a full-fledged Linux distribution
tend to be a bit more complex.

Then we're met with the "want X functionality? Put it in the initramfs."
at the same time that there are *other* people actively trying to
*eliminate* the initramfs.

I'm not sold on the systemd community speaking for all of Linux-dom.

- -Jeff

- --
Jeff Mahoney
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