Mailinglist Archive: opensuse-factory (710 mails)

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Re: [opensuse-factory] The road to systemd for openSUSE 12.1
  • From: Kay Sievers <kay.sievers@xxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 15:44:58 +0200
  • Message-id: <1308231899.2794.8.camel@mop>
On Thu, 2011-06-16 at 15:35 +0200, Anders Johansson wrote:
On Thursday 16 June 2011 15:21:29 Kay Sievers wrote:
What fails? Can you give some relevant examples?

Everything that uses the udev database which was populated with /usr
around but needed tools from there to do so.

Ah yes. udev is also one of your projects. Also pushed into the initrd for
absolutely no reason whatever, and the cause of so many problems because of
it
that it's not even funny

Thanks for the absolutely-no-reason-whatever expert opinion.

Network setups are known to fail. 3G modems get the wrong drivers
attached. Sound does not work. All the stuff that has deeper
dependencies on hardware/device setups.

huh? Network setups fail when /usr is readonly? What are you talking about?

With /usr not mounted. Read-only should work just fine.

Nothing complex should start before boot.localfs. It should be one of the
absolute first things to run. After that, you have a /usr and anything that
expects to be able to write to it should be fixed because it is fundamentally
broken

That's just not reality today. People work hard to get us out of the
UNIX stone age, with its mindless idea to move all random stuff
from /usr to / and do symlink games.

/ is the initramfs today, /usr is everything else. The split will very
likely be history in the near future for many very good reasons.

What do you mean by 'that thing'? I suggest to mount /usr from inside
the initramfs, just like we mount / from there, before init/udev/D-Bus
or anything which might need /usr is started, yes.

Then you have completely misunderstood the purpose of /usr

Sure, sorry, there are many things I don't understand. :)

I propose that we not allow systemd to completely rewrite the entire
userspace
setup of linux.

Noted as *your* opinion. :)

It was supposed to be a replacement for init, not a replacement for
*everything*

Did not see you involved what we define as *supposed*. You might get
involved if you don't like the current ideas. It's as always, the people
who do the work, make the decisions.

Kay

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