Re: [yast-devel] The (near) future of AutoYaST

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Re: [yast-devel] The (near) future...

Lukas Ocilka

17 Apr 2020 17 Apr '20

11:44

On 4/17/20 10:05 AM, Bernd Ritter wrote:

...

Hi there,

thanks something I can second. I've had some runs to get to use AutoYaST but if I remember correctly I was overwhelmed but the amount of XML that is necessary to make a plain install.

Yes, you have to write quite deep-structured XML file in order to define anything. It's basically because of two things 1. YaST in general uses a very special XML (Josef currently works on a project to simplify that if possible) 2. YaST has too many options to use. Of course, you can usually omit almost everything and use the defaults BTW, the really minimal AutoYaST profile contains just the root user/password. This is the only thing we can't guess (use the defaults).

...

It would be perfect to have a default installation that represents about the experience when installation through the graphical installer.

It must be already two years since I was trying to somehow push for a simple plain file describing the expected setup. Markdown, YAML, JSON ... anything like that could be used. There wasn't a need for that so far. What would be your use case? PLS share some info :)

...

Yet the GUI has always been faster than to get into AutoYaST and make a working config file.

Looks like we've failed to educate our users, there are really simple ways how to make it work with some tools we provide with AutoYaST. Thx Lukas -- Lukas Ocilka, Systems Management Team Leader & YaST Product Owner SLE Department, SUSE Linux 🌲 Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail ☂ Handle with care - Your reply can be stored in the cloud 😱 Pie-chart is just a representation of randomly chosen data ⚠ IMPORTANT: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential. They are intended for the named recipient(s) only. If you have received this email by mistake, please, notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to anyone or make copies of thereof. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: yast-devel+owner@opensuse.org

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josef Reidinger

17 Apr 17 Apr

12:16

New subject: [yast-devel] The (near) future of AutoYaST

On Fri, 17 Apr 2020 13:44:24 +0200 Lukas Ocilka wrote:

...

On 4/17/20 10:05 AM, Bernd Ritter wrote:

...
Hi there,

thanks something I can second. I've had some runs to get to use AutoYaST but if I remember correctly I was overwhelmed but the amount of XML that is necessary to make a plain install.

Yes, you have to write quite deep-structured XML file in order to define anything. It's basically because of two things

1. YaST in general uses a very special XML (Josef currently works on a project to simplify that if possible)

2. YaST has too many options to use. Of course, you can usually omit almost everything and use the defaults

BTW, the really minimal AutoYaST profile contains just the root user/password. This is the only thing we can't guess (use the defaults).

not needed, you can specify it on cmdline - https://en.opensuse.org/SDB:Linuxrc key RootPassword Josef

...

Thx Lukas

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: yast-devel+owner@opensuse.org

Bernd Ritter

13:05

New subject: [yast-devel] The (near) future of AutoYaST

Hey Lukas, thanks for you reply! To be honest my last attempt on the documentation has been a few years ago, so maybe my lookout on this is quite dated. At work I proposed to use a linux based "embedded" system as a replacement for our former rtos realtime embedded system. These boxes are used to communicate with large truck scales. Naturally I chose opensuse as operating system of choice. And because we (mostly scale technicians not IT personnel) will install hundreds of these boxes over a very long timespan, I remembered AutoYaST and wanted it to give it a try (again). So our current planning includes: * initial base setup of storage (one disk and some flash drives), com port settings, usb settings, users, services and directory structures with AutoYaST. * After that we want to do customer specific customizations with Ansible (as it does not require a server opposed to salt). I will dig deeper into the documentation and get back to you if there is something unclear to me. Would be happy to help improve documentation there. Cheers and a nice weekend, Bernd On 17.04.20 13:44, Lukas Ocilka wrote:

...

On 4/17/20 10:05 AM, Bernd Ritter wrote:

...
Hi there,

thanks something I can second. I've had some runs to get to use AutoYaST but if I remember correctly I was overwhelmed but the amount of XML that is necessary to make a plain install.

Yes, you have to write quite deep-structured XML file in order to define anything. It's basically because of two things

1. YaST in general uses a very special XML (Josef currently works on a project to simplify that if possible)

2. YaST has too many options to use. Of course, you can usually omit almost everything and use the defaults

BTW, the really minimal AutoYaST profile contains just the root user/password. This is the only thing we can't guess (use the defaults).

...
It would be perfect to have a default installation that represents about the experience when installation through the graphical installer.

It must be already two years since I was trying to somehow push for a simple plain file describing the expected setup. Markdown, YAML, JSON ... anything like that could be used. There wasn't a need for that so far.

What would be your use case? PLS share some info :)

...
Yet the GUI has always been faster than to get into AutoYaST and make a working config file.

Looks like we've failed to educate our users, there are really simple ways how to make it work with some tools we provide with AutoYaST.

Thx Lukas

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: yast-devel+owner@opensuse.org

josef Reidinger

13:42

New subject: [yast-devel] The (near) future of AutoYaST

On Fri, 17 Apr 2020 15:05:04 +0200 Bernd Ritter wrote:

...

Hey Lukas,

thanks for you reply! To be honest my last attempt on the documentation has been a few years ago, so maybe my lookout on this is quite dated.

At work I proposed to use a linux based "embedded" system as a replacement for our former rtos realtime embedded system. These boxes are used to communicate with large truck scales.

Naturally I chose opensuse as operating system of choice. And because we (mostly scale technicians not IT personnel) will install hundreds of these boxes over a very long timespan, I remembered AutoYaST and wanted it to give it a try (again).

So our current planning includes:

* initial base setup of storage (one disk and some flash drives), com port settings, usb settings, users, services and directory structures with AutoYaST.

Hi Bernd, thanks for sharing your use case. I think part can be done, part you need to do yourself using script option in autoyast like usb and com settings.

...

* After that we want to do customer specific customizations with Ansible (as it does not require a server opposed to salt).

salt can also run without server - https://docs.saltstack.com/en/latest/topics/tutorials/quickstart.html it is called salt masterless

...

I will dig deeper into the documentation and get back to you if there is something unclear to me. Would be happy to help improve documentation there.

That would be great. Especially regarding storage part, which is quite new and also non-trivial due to various storage technologies. Thanks Josef

...

Cheers and a nice weekend, Bernd

On 17.04.20 13:44, Lukas Ocilka wrote:

...
On 4/17/20 10:05 AM, Bernd Ritter wrote:

...
Hi there,

thanks something I can second. I've had some runs to get to use AutoYaST but if I remember correctly I was overwhelmed but the amount of XML that is necessary to make a plain install.

Yes, you have to write quite deep-structured XML file in order to define anything. It's basically because of two things

1. YaST in general uses a very special XML (Josef currently works on a project to simplify that if possible)

2. YaST has too many options to use. Of course, you can usually omit almost everything and use the defaults

BTW, the really minimal AutoYaST profile contains just the root user/password. This is the only thing we can't guess (use the defaults).

...
It would be perfect to have a default installation that represents about the experience when installation through the graphical installer.

It must be already two years since I was trying to somehow push for a simple plain file describing the expected setup. Markdown, YAML, JSON ... anything like that could be used. There wasn't a need for that so far.

What would be your use case? PLS share some info :)

...
Yet the GUI has always been faster than to get into AutoYaST and make a working config file.

Looks like we've failed to educate our users, there are really simple ways how to make it work with some tools we provide with AutoYaST.

Thx Lukas

-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: yast-devel+owner@opensuse.org

Ancor Gonzalez Sosa

15:31

New subject: [yast-devel] The (near) future of AutoYaST

On 2020-04-17 15:42, josef Reidinger wrote:

...

On Fri, 17 Apr 2020 15:05:04 +0200 Bernd Ritter wrote:

...
I will dig deeper into the documentation and get back to you if there is something unclear to me. Would be happy to help improve documentation there.

That would be great. Especially regarding storage part, which is quite new and also non-trivial due to various storage technologies.

Well, actually the storage part is new... under the hood. But we have not changed the traditional structure of the AutoYaST profile. We have indeed extended the existing AutoYaST syntax to also offer the new kind of devices, but we haven't done a full rewrite of the documentation and we haven't restructured the AutoYaST profile format. The good thing is that now we could consider to do so. Cheers. -- Ancor González Sosa YaST Team at SUSE Linux GmbH -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: yast-devel+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: yast-devel+owner@opensuse.org

Imobach González Sosa

16:05

New subject: [yast-devel] The (near) future of AutoYaST

El vie, 17-04-2020 a las 15:05 +0200, Bernd Ritter escribió:

...

Hey Lukas,

thanks for you reply! To be honest my last attempt on the documentation has been a few years ago, so maybe my lookout on this is quite dated.

Thanks a lot for your feedback! The documentation is now better, but there is room for improvement. The current one is basically a reference, and it would be nice to have something example oriented. [..]

...

* After that we want to do customer specific customizations with Ansible (as it does not require a server opposed to salt).

Salt can run in 'stand-alone' mode too. Actually, AutoYaST offers Salt integration through the 'configuration management' module. You can check the docs[1] for more info. Basically, you can provide a tarball containing the configuration and AutoYaST will take care of configuring the system using Salt during the installation.

...