On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 04:23:14PM +0200 or thereabouts, Anders Johansson wrote:

On Tue, 2003-07-08 at 16:12, gary wrote:

...

For several months now, I have posted to this group from time to time, and I have noticed that as soon as I post, there is an attempt to spam me immediately upon my post. This happens on *every* post, within a fraction of a second of posting, so it is not coincidental. This comes not from the list group per se, but from some spammers who have attached themselves or subscribed to the list, and run small scripts directing their spam upon a post, or at least mine. These are taken from my SMTP logs.

Initially, it came from one source, mail-in3.tiscali.be:62.235.13.190, and this has been going on for months.

Are you really getting spam from those? I just see connection attempts, which is a common way for mail servers to *avoid* spam, by checking if the mail was sent from a valid address. sourceforge does it too

Hi Anders, good question, and yes, regarding the above IP address. This was a long time ago when I first posted, and have since blocked it, so do not know currently. However, I refer you to spamcop for the 0/24 IP addresses.., so for me, it is a safe bet to give them a 553 SMTP block. The other IP addresses I listed, come from well known, long time spammers. http://www.spamcop.net/w3m?action=checkblock&ip=62.235.13.190 Thanks for the info regarding sourceforge, did not know that, other than I do get their email via a STARTTLS connection, if my memory servers me correctly, which is cool.. -- Gary

How do you do that, a time dated e-mail address? On Tuesday 08 July 2003 17:54, gary wrote:

On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 10:45:16AM -0500 or thereabouts, Paul Benjamin wrote:

...

I have been following this mailing list for about three months with this email address now and I got my first spam on Friday. It was Nigerian 419 scam of course. I had four or five back in January at my old email address where I lived then. I learned to use a trow away address on mailing lists because sooner or later the scum will find a way of harvesting them.

On an ezmlm list manager, which SuSE is, I usually use a time dated email address, because ezmlm goes by the envelope sender rather than the From: address, when you sign up for the list. My system bounces about 20 a day because the time dated From: has expired by the time the address has been harvested.

-- Gary

The 03.07.08 at 10:36, Christopher Mahmood wrote:

* Bart Symons (bart.symons@skynet.be) [030708 10:25]:

...

How do you do that, a time dated e-mail address?

Like this (Gary has a much more sophisticated method). As Gary pointed out, we only check the sender from to see if you are subscribed so you can put whatever you want in the header from. The header from is the only thing shown to other subscribers.

And... how can we do that, on a standard SuSE install, with pine/kmail/balsa/whatever, and postfix? -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson

The 03.07.08 at 17:40, Christopher Mahmood wrote:

* Carlos E. R. (robin1.listas@tiscali.es) [030708 17:14]:

...

And... how can we do that, on a standard SuSE install, with pine/kmail/balsa/whatever, and postfix?

Postfix and sendmail have '+' alias expansion as well. Post as 'robin1.listas+sle@tiscali.es' and filter anything delivered to that address to a junk maildir. Just don't subscribe as 'robin1.listas+sle@tiscali.es' of course.

That's very interesting: I'll have to read more about it. But it doesn't work, apparently: I just subscribed to "test-list@suse.com", with my normal name (robin1.listas), and that works (I see my mail on the list). But if I send as 'robin1.listas+fake@tiscali.es' from pine, I don't see my mail on the list, nor do I get a bounce - unless it takes some time, of course: Jul 10 14:20:41 nimrodel postfix/cleanup[6811]: DD9FC30BE1: message-id= Jul 10 14:20:42 nimrodel postfix/qmgr[5258]: DD9FC30BE1: from=, size=776, nrcpt=1 (queue active) Jul 10 14:20:42 nimrodel postfix/smtpd[6816]: disconnect from localhost[127.0.0.1] Jul 10 14:20:42 nimrodel postfix/pipe[6812]: 15C5730A05: to=, relay=vscan, delay=1, status=sent (nimrodel.valinor) Jul 10 14:20:43 nimrodel postfix/smtp[6825]: DD9FC30BE1: to=, relay=mail.suse.de[213.95.15.193], delay=2, status=sent (250 Ok: queued as 15BA714AA4) My guess is that postfix is using robin1.listas+fake both for the envelope and the normal "From". -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson

The 03.07.10 at 12:38, Christopher Mahmood wrote:

...

(I see my mail on the list). But if I send as 'robin1.listas+fake@tiscali.es' from pine, I don't see my mail on the list, nor do I get a bounce - unless it takes some time, of course:

That's a problem with pine. I don't think it lets you easily edit your headers.

Not the envelope. Otherwise, I can use any "from" I want, or any standard or invented header.

...

Jul 10 14:20:42 nimrodel postfix/qmgr[5258]: DD9FC30BE1: from=, size=776, nrcpt=1 (queue active)

Yes, that's not what you want.

Further reading you know of? -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson

The 03.07.11 at 11:20, Christopher Mahmood wrote:

...

Further reading you know of?

I don't see anyway to modify the from header within pine but hopefully someone will correct me if I'm wrong. It sort of fits with the philosophy of it though.

Well, the "From" header can be easily modified, but it is "hidden" in the configs. You only need to use "roles". A role can have a different "From" header (amongst many other settings), and you can select roles automatically on certain conditions when answering a message, or they can be selected manually. That works very well: I can answer selecting one of my several "froms". It is the envelope "from" I can not change. I thought that "+" sign had to be interpreted by postfix. Pine does send it to postfix, and postfix sends it on unmodified, plus et all, intact, to the outside. The "+" symbol is not precessed by no one here... and to know more about that, I have to read more somewhere. -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson

The 03.07.13 at 22:43, Christopher Mahmood wrote:

The '+' (or '-' or whatever you define it as) just allows you to create aliases on-the-fly. I have a feeling pine can't use different addresses form the header and envelope so I don't think this will work. Again, I might be wrong.

Ah, that seems to be the case - unfortunately. -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson

On Tue, 2003-07-08 at 17:54, gary wrote:

On an ezmlm list manager, which SuSE is, I usually use a time dated email address, because ezmlm goes by the envelope sender rather than the From: address, when you sign up for the list. My system bounces about 20 a day because the time dated From: has expired by the time the address has been harvested. I'm a bit hazy on this. What excatly is the "envelope sender?" When I setup my account in Evolution, I'm asked for only one e-mail address. If I change this to something else, the list won't accept my posts.

Does the list not show the "from" field in the message I send to the list, but instead show the "reply to" in place of the from when it resends it to the subscribers - and since I didn't fill a "reply to" in, it defaults to the "from"? Or am I missing something? What is weird is that on this e-mail address, I've only received spam that came through one of the yahoo groups - nothing directly to me - I've been using this address for two years on various different user lists. My private address, which is only used for correspondence with close friends and the odd family who's not afraid of the computer, receives heaps of spam daily. Thanks Hans

On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 10:43:05AM -0700 or thereabouts, Christopher Mahmood wrote:

* H du Plooy (linuser@ananzi.co.za) [030708 10:32]:

...

I'm a bit hazy on this. What excatly is the "envelope sender?"

The test-list-faq (email test-list-faq@suse.com) has a brief discussion of this but any good book or site about about SMTP will explain this (e.g., http://cr.yp.to/smtp.html)

Making a simple analogy... at least I will try to make it simple.., when you write a letter, you put at the top of the letter, your address, so that people will know who it is from. This is equal to the From: header in your email. Now when you want to send that letter, you put it in an envelope, and you can send it to whomever, and have the from address on the envelope, the same as you had in the inside letter of the envelope, or you can make it from anyone you wish. As you can see, they can be "from" different addresses. They do not have to be the same from address. You do not have to send the letter using your real address at the top of the letter. The SuSE lists, when you subscribed, looks at the outside envelope from address and not at the letter adddress. <g> All SuSE list email is sent to you at that private envelope address. What is shown on the list is the letter address, or From: address and not the envelope from address. So, if your MUA supports or allows you to change the envelope address separately or differently from the letter address, or From: address, you can make up any letter address you wish, and it will be posted to the group, as long as you keep the outside envelope from address the same as what you subscribed with,

...

When I setup my account in Evolution, I'm asked for only one e-mail address. If I change this to something else, the list won't accept my posts.

That's one of the drawbacks of using all-in-one mail applications like evolution although there may be a way to work around that.

Exactly, Evolution, Kmail (although I think Anders said he had a hack at one time ... may be mistaken), and the all-in-one MUAs, when you set up an email address, make by default, the letter and envelope from addresses the same to keep it simple and traditional. Mutt will allow you customize each header differently if you wish. HTH, -- Gary

On Sun, Aug 31, 2003 at 07:49:11AM +0100 or thereabouts, LinuxWorld999 wrote:

On Tuesday 08 July 2003 16:54, gary wrote: <snip>

...

On an ezmlm list manager, which SuSE is, I usually use a time dated email address, because ezmlm goes by the envelope sender rather than the From: address, when you sign up for the list. My system bounces about 20 a day because the time dated From: has expired by the time the address has been harvested.

-- Gary

Could you please explain how this works and this can be setup for existuing users?

This has nothing to do with existing users, but will work on any system or any user. The trick is that ezmlm uses the envelope sender address for its subscription and not the From: address... There are 2 programs that will give you a time dated From address that you can set to your choosing for the length of time. One is called qdated, and this works only with qmail as your mail server, which I use, and use this one. The second program was originally started for qmail, but has been expanded for use for any MTA, sendmail, postfix, courier, exim, and even can use it (as a client) for Windows MUAs.. it is called TMDA, and can be found here.. http://tmda.net/ It also has many more features, and is very configurable, and will not only allow a time dated header, but also key words, or other things hidden in headers to allow a auth/challange response before it hits your box. So, it can be adapted to other mailing lists that do not use ezmlm, and still give you the protection. -- Gary

On Mon, Sep 01, 2003 at 12:13:06AM +0100 or thereabouts, Terence McCarthy wrote:

On Sun, 31 Aug 2003 11:43:56 -0500 gary wrote:

...

tmda Thanks, Gary.

You are most welcome... Interestingly, over the last 36 hours, there have been over 250 attempts at spam in my servers using one of these addresses (all gleaned from the same disposable address), from all over the world, and all were rejected because of it. These were true spam, coming from known IP spam blocks, not the latest virus. To me, it is well worth the time to learn TMDA as it is so versitile, especially if you run your own mail server, or are on many lists / usenet. -- Gary Doing a job RIGHT the first time gets the job done. Doing the job WRONG fourteen times gives you job security.

The 03.08.31 at 18:34, gary wrote:

known IP spam blocks, not the latest virus. To me, it is well worth the time to learn TMDA as it is so versitile, especially if you run your own mail server, or are on many lists / usenet.

Can TDMA be used by those like my using a mail box from a normal provider, or only if we run our own mail server? -- Cheers, Carlos Robinson

I used to set console fonts (not Xwindows, just plain old console) on Yast1 and It worked just fine. Now with Yast2, I cannot set them to Turkish Fonts for instance, no matter what I try. I even edited necessary files by hand on the advice of a SuSE Installation-Help supervisor with no positive results. (According to him this is not an installation problem, therefore, no help is avaliable. İf yast2 is not an installation issue, then, what is?) On Xwindows and on, especially, Gnome applications, I can use (read or write) these fonts with no problem. A bug in Yast2? If it is, SuSE better focus on this next time. Because If they don't, they will loose one customer who pays close to 80 US dollars on every new distro. I switch to Red Hat in a jiffy after ten years of (approximately) SuSE usage. OK,. after releasing this much steam, I'd like to ask list members If they have a solution for the Yast2/Font-setting problem of mine. Thank you very much.

On Tue, 2003-07-08 at 12:45, Togan Muftuoglu wrote:

* Rifat Albayrak; on 08 Jul, 2003 wrote:

...

OK,. after releasing this much steam, I'd like to ask list members If they have a solution for the Yast2/Font-setting problem of mine.

Please specify the exact problem as I have not understood what the problem is.

Here is what I understood.

1) On the Xwindow system you have no problem with the Turkish characters displayed by the fonts.

Sort of. See below explanation.

2) on console system (not the xterm or whatever opened) you can not see the turkish characters.

This one requires some explaining then. Here it is. Let's say you have Xwindow and most are fine on Xwindow. No complaints.. Do a ctrl+alt+F2, you will be at a console. Log on to this console. You're at rifatal@oaktree for instance. This is the console I am talking about. (Maybe I should have said 'Text Console' to be easily understood) Now type Ğ or ğ. You will not get a Ğ or ğ. You will get a sign similar to = sign but with three lines instead of two. Type letter Ü, no problem But type letter Ş, you will get a little square with inside filled... And so on. So, Turkish characters I am having trouble with are:Ğ,ğ,İ,ı (no problem with i or I) Now go back Xwindow system with alt+F7. You are in Xwindows and most applications will work fine (read or type). Mozilla reads and write Turkish characters and so does the mail and news clients I use on Xwindows allright. But Xwindows is not completely trouble free either. For instance, rxvt and xterm and aterm won't type above mentioned characters Ğğİ and ı at all. Eterm will put some other signs in place of these characters. But, as long as I can use mail, news clients and read mozilla in Turkish characters on Xwindow, I don't have too big of a problem with it. And I don't think I can be any more specific than this. What did I do to solve it: 1) Yast2-->System-->Editor for /etc/sysconfig-->Hardware-->Console--> CONSOLE_FONT. (Default was "" and I selected from file /usr/share/kbd/consolefonts lat5-14.psfu.gz file) Also they are talking about KBD_TTY setting from Hardware/Keyboard also applies here. Checked this setting too: Default Value is tty1 thru tty20 and left it like it is. 2) Hit Finish. ıt reports 'modified variables': CONSOLE_ENCODING is ISO-8859-9 and CONSOLE_FONT lat5-14.psfu.gz Well, OK by me. 3) Close Yast2 and reboot. Result : Same as described above. No Ğ,ğ etc. on the 'text console'

If "yes", "no", "sort of" then explain the problem along with the support suggested changes.

SuSE Help Support only gave me the opportunity to change CONSOLE_FONT with an editor as root manually. Of course I had the same negative result. On both methods I tried to modify, boot messages said it was loading this font but still no YUMUŞAK G anyway Thank you for reading. :-) rıfat

--

Togan Muftuoglu Unofficial SuSE FAQ Maintainer http://dinamizm.ath.cx

On Wed, 2003-07-09 at 02:20, Togan Muftuoglu wrote:

* Rifat Albayrak; on 09 Jul, 2003 wrote:

...

Do a ctrl+alt+F2, you will be at a console. Log on to this console. You're at rifatal@oaktree for instance. This is the console I am talking about. (Maybe I should have said 'Text Console' to be easily understood) Now type Ğ or ğ. You will not get a Ğ or ğ. You will get a sign similar to = sign but with three lines instead of two. Type letter Ü, no problem But type letter Ş, you will get a little square with inside filled... And so on.

OK check the following

/etc/sysconfig/keyboard

KEYTABLE=trq.map.gz ( assuming you are using Turkish Q keyboard) COMPOSETABLE="winkeys shiftctrl" YAST_KEYBOARD="turkish"

/etc/sysconfig/console

CONSOLE_FONT="lat5-16.psfu" CONSOLE_UNICODEMAP="" CONSOLE_ENCODING="ISO-8859-9" (see my notes below) CONSOLE_SCREENMAP=""

/etc/sysconfig/language

If you want to have the whole system in tr_TR.ISO-8859-9 then DEFAULT_LANGUAGE="tr_TR.ISO-8859-9" (see my notes below) RC_LANG="tr_TR.ISO-8859-9"

I am using UTF-8 environment so the following is different CONSOLE_ENCODING="UTF-8"

Also rather then playing with /etc/syconfig/language variables I have the following under $HOME/.profile

export LANG=tr_TR.UTF-8 export LC_MESSAGES=en_US ( I want the messages to be in English) export LC_TIME=POSIX ( same with time as above) export LC_COLLATE=tr_TR.UTF-8

...

So, Turkish characters I am having trouble with are:Ğ,ğ,İ,ı (no problem with i or I)

Probably you have a problem with "Ş" "ş" (S Cedilla). Try with the above to see if the problems are solved. Of course remember to run SuseConfig for the changes to be affective and logout & login

OK. It works now. I changed only two items from the above lists: 1) CONSOLE_FONT="lat5-16.psfu" Mine had a "lat5-16.psfu" 2) COMPOSETABLE="winkeys shiftctrl" Of which mine had a "clear latin1.add" I also would like to emphesize that, I reversed the above changes and still it works. ;-) I will work on the below at a later time. Thank you very much for the valuable help. rıfat

...

Now go back Xwindow system with alt+F7. You are in Xwindows and most applications will work fine (read or type). Mozilla reads and write Turkish characters and so does the mail and news clients I use on Xwindows allright. But Xwindows is not completely trouble free either. For instance, rxvt and xterm and aterm won't type above mentioned characters Ğğİ and ı at all.

Xterm should not have an issue however a problem free (almost) terminal program is "mlterm" Just to be sure you have the correct locale in an xterm (or gnome terminal whatever) type locale

toganm@earth:~> locale LANG=tr_TR.UTF-8 LC_CTYPE="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_NUMERIC="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_TIME=POSIX LC_COLLATE=tr_TR.UTF-8 LC_MONETARY="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_MESSAGES=en_US LC_PAPER="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_NAME="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_ADDRESS="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_TELEPHONE="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_MEASUREMENT="tr_TR.UTF-8" LC_IDENTIFICATION="tr_TR.UTF-8"

also try "locale charmap" toganm@earth:~> locale charmap UTF-8

If you have set your LANG to tr_TR.ISO-8859-9 then the locale charmap output will be "ISO-8859-9"

...

On both methods I tried to modify, boot messages said it was loading this font but still no YUMUŞAK G anyway

Try the above and let's see what is happening

ps: No To or CC or BCC is necessarry as I am already receiving the mail from the mailing list --

Togan Muftuoglu Unofficial SuSE FAQ Maintainer http://dinamizm.ath.cx

Rifat Albayrak wrote, On 07/09/2003 12:20 AM:

I used to set console fonts (not Xwindows, just plain old console) on Yast1 and It worked just fine.

Now with Yast2, I cannot set them to Turkish Fonts for instance, no matter what I try. I even edited necessary files by hand on the advice of a SuSE Installation-Help supervisor with no positive results. (According to him this is not an installation problem, therefore, no help is avaliable. İf yast2 is not an installation issue, then, what is?)

Did you "hand edit" via Yast Editor for /etc/sysconfig files, or an outside editor? If outside, did you run SuSEconfig afterwards? I would recommend trying the Yast sysconfig editor. Let us know what you find.

A bug in Yast2?

Not enough info given to determine. -- Joe Morris New Tribes Mission Email Address: Joe_Morris@ntm.org Web Address: http://www.mydestiny.net/~joe_morris Registered Linux user 231871 God said, I AM that I AM. I say, by the grace of God, I am what I am.