[opensuse] Reply to mailing lists

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Frans de Boer

30 Jan 2009 30 Jan '09

16:16

Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address? Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something. Frans. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

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ne...

30 Jan 30 Jan

16:28

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Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something. No. We already know why. That is the way mailman is setup. openSUSE admins are not going to change this behavior so it is left to us to work around/with it. I use gmail so to reply tot he list, I have to choose 'reply to all' and switch the 'To:' and 'CC:' fields. Other listees can list what they have to do in

On Fri, Jan 30, 2009 at 16:16, Frans de Boer wrote: their mailers. ne... -- Registered Linux User # 125653 (http://counter.li.org) Now accepting personal mail for GMail invites. Laurence J. Peter - "It's better to have loved and lost than to have to do forty pounds of laundry a week." -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Randall R Schulz

16:31

On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

...

Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

This is old, old, old. Just because 99% of lists do it wrong is no reason for everyone to do it wrong.

...

Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Incorrect, you must learn how to use the available features of your mailer. Evolution is certainly capable of handling list replies.

...

Frans.

By the way, you're right about KDE 3.5 being superior to Gnome. Randall Schulz -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Frans de Boer

16:37

On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:31 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

...

On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

...
Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

This is old, old, old. Just because 99% of lists do it wrong is no reason for everyone to do it wrong.

...
Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Incorrect, you must learn how to use the available features of your mailer. Evolution is certainly capable of handling list replies.

...
Frans.

By the way, you're right about KDE 3.5 being superior to Gnome.

Randall Schulz

Ok, reply to all and remove anybodies personal address. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Randall R Schulz

16:48

On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:31 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

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On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

...
Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

...

...
Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Incorrect, you must learn how to use the available features of your mailer. Evolution is certainly capable of handling list replies.

...

Ok, reply to all and remove anybodies personal address.

If you "reply to list" (whatever it's called in Evolution) you won't have to manually remove the other, non-list recipients. Randall Schulz -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Ken Schneider

17:07

Randall R Schulz pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

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On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:31 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

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On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

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Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address? ...

...
Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something. Incorrect, you must learn how to use the available features of your mailer. Evolution is certainly capable of handling list replies.

... Ok, reply to all and remove anybodies personal address.

If you "reply to list" (whatever it's called in Evolution) you won't have to manually remove the other, non-list recipients.

Randall Schulz

With evolution you can right click in the message body and select reply-to-list unless that feature has been removed. -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

N B Day

17:43

On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 11:07 -0600, Ken Schneider wrote:

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With evolution you can right click in the message body and select reply-to-list unless that feature has been removed.

-- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998

Control-l == "reply to list" in Evo. Even easier! -- N. B. Day N 39° 28' 25" W 119° 48' 37" 1404 meters up Aurelius up 2 days 0:26, 2 users, load average: 0.29, 0.17, 0.18 2.6.27.7-9-default x86_64 GNU/Linux openSUSE 11.1 (x86_64) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Frans de Boer

19:20

On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 09:43 -0800, N B Day wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 11:07 -0600, Ken Schneider wrote:

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With evolution you can right click in the message body and select reply-to-list unless that feature has been removed.

-- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998

Control-l == "reply to list" in Evo. Even easier!

-- N. B. Day N 39° 28' 25" W 119° 48' 37" 1404 meters up Aurelius up 2 days 0:26, 2 users, load average: 0.29, 0.17, 0.18 2.6.27.7-9-default x86_64 GNU/Linux openSUSE 11.1 (x86_64)

Yes!!, that is working correctly. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Will Stephenson

4 Feb 4 Feb

20:35

On Friday 30 January 2009 18:43:00 N B Day wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 11:07 -0600, Ken Schneider wrote:

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With evolution you can right click in the message body and select reply-to-list unless that feature has been removed.

-- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998

Control-l == "reply to list" in Evo. Even easier!

In KMail, right click and select the Reply type, or R is a default reply, respecting Reply-To: A is to All shift-A is to Author L is to List HTH Will -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Frans de Boer

30 Jan 30 Jan

19:17

On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:48 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

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On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:31 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

...
On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

...
Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

...

...
Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Incorrect, you must learn how to use the available features of your mailer. Evolution is certainly capable of handling list replies.

...

Ok, reply to all and remove anybodies personal address.

If you "reply to list" (whatever it's called in Evolution) you won't have to manually remove the other, non-list recipients.

Randall Schulz

Evolution has only two options: reply and reply to all. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Mike McMullin

31 Jan 31 Jan

05:25

On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 20:17 +0100, Frans de Boer wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:48 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

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On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:31 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

...
On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

...
Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

...

...
Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Incorrect, you must learn how to use the available features of your mailer. Evolution is certainly capable of handling list replies.

...

Ok, reply to all and remove anybodies personal address.

If you "reply to list" (whatever it's called in Evolution) you won't have to manually remove the other, non-list recipients.

Randall Schulz

Evolution has only two options: reply and reply to all.

Actually no, there is a third option, "Message" on the menu bar, then select Reply to _L_ist , short cut key --> Ctrl-L -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Mike McMullin

30 Jan 30 Jan

18:45

On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 17:37 +0100, Frans de Boer wrote:

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On Fri, 2009-01-30 at 08:31 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

...
On Friday January 30 2009, Frans de Boer wrote:

...
Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

This is old, old, old. Just because 99% of lists do it wrong is no reason for everyone to do it wrong.

...
Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Incorrect, you must learn how to use the available features of your mailer. Evolution is certainly capable of handling list replies.

...
Frans.

By the way, you're right about KDE 3.5 being superior to Gnome.

Randall Schulz

Ok, reply to all and remove anybodies personal address.

In Evolution, reply to the list only using Control-L. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Heinz Diehl

18:49

New subject: [opensuse] Re: Reply to mailing lists

On Fri, Jan 30, 2009 at 05:16:51PM +0100, Frans de Boer wrote:

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Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Do it like me, add a rule like this to your .procmailrc, and you're done. :0fh | ${FORMAIL} -I"Reply-To: opensuse@opensuse.org" -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kai Ponte

1 Feb 1 Feb

19:13

Frans de Boer wrote:

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Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Unfortunately, the list is broken and the admins feel it better to leave it in that state. Some email programs - like KMail - do a reply-to list automatically sometimes. At other times, there is a reply-to-list feature. I am running Thunderbird now and don't have this feature (I did but it borked the attachments.) -- kai www.perfectreign.com || www.filesite.org bis zum bitteren Ende -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Randall R Schulz

19:17

On Sunday February 1 2009, Kai Ponte wrote:

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... Some email programs - like KMail - do a reply-to list automatically sometimes. At other times, there is a reply-to-list feature. I am running Thunderbird now and don't have this feature (I did but it borked the attachments.)

But... Why run an inferior email client when a superior one is at hand?

...

-- kai

RRS -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

19:57

On 2009/02/01 11:17 (GMT-0800) Randall R Schulz composed:

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Why run an inferior email client when a superior one is at hand?

Email clients are a bit like cars, of which there are many to choose from. You pick because of some combination of features that suits you better than the others you've looked at, availability, and/or something particularly compelling to you that is missing from or poorer than others. In the case of email clients, it's so easy to right click copy from the current message's headers some email address prior to clicking the reply button that availability of a reply-to-list function is a non-issue for me even though I get over 600 messages/day from mailing lists most days. The same should be the case for those few souls who insist the right function is for replies to default to the message's composer instead of the actual sender. Most mailing lists, as this, are discussion lists, not personal question lists expecting personal replies to each question's author. Replies should default to such a group as actually sent them, for further discussion as circumstances dictate, regardless which email client is used in any particular instance. Exceptions to the general rule are better handled for a relative few cases rather than requiring a greater number to handle every reply as an exception. -- "Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up." Ephesians 4:29 NIV Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Jerry Houston

20:13

On Sunday 01 February 2009 11:57:00 Felix Miata wrote:

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On 2009/02/01 11:17 (GMT-0800) Randall R Schulz composed:

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Why run an inferior email client when a superior one is at hand?

Email clients are a bit like cars, of which there are many to choose from. You pick because of some combination of features that suits you better than the others you've looked at, availability, and/or something particularly compelling to you that is missing from or poorer than others.

Indeed, that's true. However, I don't think his suggestion was meant to imply that this is the only feature that KMail handles better than Thunderbird. I know that *I* wouldn't have changed just because of that, after years with Thunderbird. I changed because it handles lists better, the editor works better, it handles newlines properly, it's easier to create message filters, doesn't keep telling me that it thinks a daily message from my weather service is spam after I've told it hundreds of times that it's not spam, and a number of other minor annoyances from Thunderbird were missing in KMail. Since one doesn't need to remove another email client in order to give KMail a try, I'd recommend such a trial for anyone who's the least bit unhappy with their current client. Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kai Ponte

2 Feb 2 Feb

05:04

Jerry Houston wrote:

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Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight.

KMail has a lot of things going for it. It is almost as good as Outlook in my opinion. (Yes, you can set outlook to bottom post and correctly quote if you want.) However, KMail does not do HTML emails. Hey, maybe I should just run Outlook in CXOffice... -- kai www.perfectreign.com || www.filesite.org bis zum bitteren Ende -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Randall R Schulz

05:05

On Sunday February 1 2009, Kai Ponte wrote:

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Jerry Houston wrote:

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Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight.

KMail has a lot of things going for it. It is almost as good as Outlook in my opinion.

That's not funny.

...

However, KMail does not do HTML emails.

In what way does it not? It can both create and render them.

...

Hey, maybe I should just run Outlook in CXOffice...

Outlook should be outlawed.

...

-- kai

Randall Schulz -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kai Ponte

05:21

Randall R Schulz wrote:

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On Sunday February 1 2009, Kai Ponte wrote:

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Jerry Houston wrote:

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Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight.

KMail has a lot of things going for it. It is almost as good as Outlook in my opinion.

That's not funny.

Wasn't meant to be.

...

...
However, KMail does not do HTML emails.

In what way does it not? It can both create and render them.

Not quite: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86423

...

...
Hey, maybe I should just run Outlook in CXOffice...

Outlook should be outlawed.

It is one of the few good programs from MS - along with Project and Excel. However, I'll have to do a little more research. I have 2003 running under CXOffice tied to my corporate account. I want to detach that one (for reasons of possible use of public records act requests) and use another instance. -- kai www.perfectreign.com || www.filesite.org bis zum bitteren Ende -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

05:53

On 2009/02/01 21:21 (GMT-0800) Kai Ponte composed:

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Outlook should be outlawed.

...

It is one of the few good programs from MS...

Good, of course! Good for: 1-breaking threading by deleting thread references 2-confusing threads by lack of standard quoting 3-confusing threads further by inducing top posting 4-polluting archives and digests by not inducing quote and .sig trimming 5-polluting generally by inducing HTML composition -- "Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up." Ephesians 4:29 NIV Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

13:23

On Mon, February 2, 2009 06:53, Felix Miata wrote:

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On 2009/02/01 21:21 (GMT-0800) Kai Ponte composed:

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...
Outlook should be outlawed.

...
It is one of the few good programs from MS...

Good, of course! Good for:

1-breaking threading by deleting thread references 2-confusing threads by lack of standard quoting 3-confusing threads further by inducing top posting 4-polluting archives and digests by not inducing quote and .sig trimming 5-polluting generally by inducing HTML composition

You are confused between Outlook and Outlook Express. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Felix Miata

13:51

On 2009/02/02 14:23 (GMT+0100) Amedee Van Gasse composed:

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On Mon, February 2, 2009 06:53, Felix Miata wrote:

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...
On 2009/02/01 21:21 (GMT-0800) Kai Ponte composed:

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...
...
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Outlook should be outlawed.

...

...
...
It is one of the few good programs from MS...

...

...
Good, of course! Good for:

...

...
1-breaking threading by deleting thread references 2-confusing threads by lack of standard quoting 3-confusing threads further by inducing top posting 4-polluting archives and digests by not inducing quote and .sig trimming 5-polluting generally by inducing HTML composition

...

You are confused between Outlook and Outlook Express.

No confusion here. They are Outhouse (part M$ Office), and Outbreak Excess (part of M$ OS). Both stink, and both are similarly first class at creating/inducing bad email. -- "Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up." Ephesians 4:29 NIV Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Frans de Boer

14:01

New subject: [opensuse] Reply to mailing lists [stopped]

On Mon, 2009-02-02 at 08:51 -0500, Felix Miata wrote:

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On 2009/02/02 14:23 (GMT+0100) Amedee Van Gasse composed:

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On Mon, February 2, 2009 06:53, Felix Miata wrote:

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...
On 2009/02/01 21:21 (GMT-0800) Kai Ponte composed:

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...
...
...
Outlook should be outlawed.

...
...
...
It is one of the few good programs from MS...

...
...
Good, of course! Good for:

...
...
1-breaking threading by deleting thread references 2-confusing threads by lack of standard quoting 3-confusing threads further by inducing top posting 4-polluting archives and digests by not inducing quote and .sig trimming 5-polluting generally by inducing HTML composition

...
You are confused between Outlook and Outlook Express.

No confusion here. They are Outhouse (part M$ Office), and Outbreak Excess (part of M$ OS). Both stink, and both are similarly first class at creating/inducing bad email. -- "Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up." Ephesians 4:29 NIV

Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

As the originator - and having my reply a long time ago - I ask everybody to STOP this thread. The current discussion has no connection with the original question anymore (already for some days). So, please stop this thread!!!! If people want to war about the pro and cons about various e-mail clients, please go to the OT forum. Regards, Frans. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

peter nikolic

09:44

On Monday 02 February 2009, Randall R Schulz wrote:

...

On Sunday February 1 2009, Kai Ponte wrote:

...
Jerry Houston wrote:

...
Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight.

KMail has a lot of things going for it. It is almost as good as Outlook in my opinion.

That's not funny.

...
However, KMail does not do HTML emails.

In what way does it not? It can both create and render them.

...
Hey, maybe I should just run Outlook in CXOffice...

Outlook should be outlawed.

...
-- kai

Randall Schulz

You know that is one thing that should be stripped out of Kmail this darn stupid HTML mail junk it aint needed / wanted it's a PITA Email is Email not Web pages <hobbyhorse/> Pete -- SuSE Linux 10.3-Alpha3. (Linux is like a wigwam - no Gates, no Windows, and an Apache inside.) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

11:20

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Sunday, 2009-02-01 at 21:05 -0800, Randall R Schulz wrote:

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However, KMail does not do HTML emails.

In what way does it not? It can both create and render them.

No, it doesn't.. Not if you receive business html email which you have to reply to in same format, the result is broken and awful. It's a known feature/bug. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkmG1v4ACgkQtTMYHG2NR9WOmwCeKlegM3rY/LQovFaT02q5HkLi P3EAnj+QRkzfg1UB4Taw2YBotr+PZ7XL =5KFr -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

13:21

On Mon, February 2, 2009 06:05, Randall R Schulz wrote:

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...
Hey, maybe I should just run Outlook in CXOffice...

Outlook should be outlawed.

And what about Outlook Express? (different software, similar name) Hanged, drawn and quartered? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Jerry Houston

11:55

On Sunday 01 February 2009 21:04:29 Kai Ponte wrote:

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However, KMail does not do HTML emails.

I don't use HTML email a lot, but some folks who send email to me do. And when I've replied, it's been in HTML. What am I doing wrong? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Philipp Thomas

21:47

On Sun, 01 Feb 2009 21:04:29 -0800, you wrote:

...

(Yes, you can set outlook to bottom post and correctly quote if you want.)

But it still doesn't honour/generate In-Reply-To so still doesn't support proper threading of mails. Philipp -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Philip Dowie

22:24

...

...
(Yes, you can set outlook to bottom post and correctly quote if you want.)

But it still doesn't honour/generate In-Reply-To so still doesn't support proper threading of mails.

and for anyone who uses Outlook, the chances are they use it in a corporate setting - like me - I don't get a choice, its hooked up to an Exchange, I certainly cannot use procmail recipes, though I'd dearly love to. In the corporate environment, top posting is the way - message flow is different - I ask a question, I get a reply - I know what I wrote, I don't need to read it again, and if I do, its below.. But hey - the whole top posting / bottom posting has been beaten to death, and the list administrators have decided upon a standard for the list - it's a pain for me, because setting my Outlook to bottom post would screw up all the other corporate mail, and I'd probably actually get in trouble for replying in such a manner.. *sigh* -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Patrick Shanahan

22:31

* Philip Dowie [02-02-09 17:26]:

...

But hey - the whole top posting / bottom posting has been beaten to death, and the list administrators have decided upon a standard for the list - it's a pain for me, because setting my Outlook to bottom post would screw up all the other corporate mail, and I'd probably actually get in trouble for replying in such a manner..

Then you should be reading your personal mail at home rather than during working hours. AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there. -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

3 Feb 3 Feb

16:37

Patrick Shanahan wrote:

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* Philip Dowie [02-02-09 17:26]:

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But hey - the whole top posting / bottom posting has been beaten to death, and the list administrators have decided upon a standard for the list - it's a pain for me, because setting my Outlook to bottom post would screw up all the other corporate mail, and I'd probably actually get in trouble for replying in such a manner..

Then you should be reading your personal mail at home rather than during working hours. While I was able to install better software, others don't have that option

I have a *LOT* of spare time at work, so I use some of that time to read my email.

...

AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

18:17

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

James Knott schreef:

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Patrick Shanahan wrote:

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AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid? Kind regards, Amedee -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Boris Epstein

18:29

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 1:17 PM, Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

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James Knott schreef:

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Patrick Shanahan wrote:

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...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid?

Kind regards, Amedee -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

If TCP port 22 (or whichever port the SSH is running on) is blocked you can definitely not SSH into the box directly. What can be helpful is a VPN with the server (hub) outside of the firewalled network. That not only provides extra security but also allows one to access hosts whose existence is not even advertised in any perceptible manner out on the Internet. Boris. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Jim Henderson

18:49

New subject: [opensuse] Re: ssh from behind a corporate firewall

On Tue, 03 Feb 2009 13:29:30 -0500, Boris Epstein wrote:

...

If TCP port 22 (or whichever port the SSH is running on) is blocked you can definitely not SSH into the box directly.

But you can circumvent it fairly easily using something like httptunnel, I've had occasion to do that myself (but always with permission of those operating the network). Jim -- Jim Henderson Please keep on-topic replies on the list so everyone benefits -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

19:04

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

Boris Epstein schreef:

...

On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 1:17 PM, Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
James Knott schreef:

...
Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit. I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid?

Kind regards, Amedee -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

If TCP port 22 (or whichever port the SSH is running on) is blocked you can definitely not SSH into the box directly. What can be helpful is a VPN with the server (hub) outside of the firewalled network. That not only provides extra security but also allows one to access hosts whose existence is not even advertised in any perceptible manner out on the Internet.

Boris. Indeed. That's how do it too, with an ssh tunnel over port 443 to my server in a datacenter, and from there openvpn to my workstation at home. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

19:09

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

Boris Epstein schreef:

...

On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 1:17 PM, Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
James Knott schreef:

...
Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit. I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid?

Kind regards, Amedee -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

If TCP port 22 (or whichever port the SSH is running on) is blocked you can definitely not SSH into the box directly. What can be helpful is a VPN with the server (hub) outside of the firewalled network. That not only provides extra security but also allows one to access hosts whose existence is not even advertised in any perceptible manner out on the Internet.

Boris.

I don't know if this has already been asked on this list, but why did I get two copies of this email? </sarcasm> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

19:16

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...

I don't know if this has already been asked on this list, but why did I get two copies of this email? </sarcasm>

Some people find it necessary to send a reply to both the list and the individual. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

19:28

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

James Knott schreef:

...

Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
I don't know if this has already been asked on this list, but why did I get two copies of this email? </sarcasm>

Some people find it necessary to send a reply to both the list and the individual.

And some people find it irritating to receive the same message twice. I will respect your feelings on this subject, if you will be considerate of my feelings. Agreed? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

20:13

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...

James Knott schreef:

...
Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
I don't know if this has already been asked on this list, but why did I get two copies of this email? </sarcasm>

Some people find it necessary to send a reply to both the list and the individual.

And some people find it irritating to receive the same message twice.

I will respect your feelings on this subject, if you will be considerate of my feelings. Agreed?

It is not my usual custom to send duplicates. I was merely demonstrating what often happens. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Ken Schneider

19:17

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

Amedee Van Gasse pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

Boris Epstein schreef:

...

...
I don't know if this has already been asked on this list, but why did I get two copies of this email? </sarcasm>

Because Boris uses gmail and uses reply-to-all and is too lazy to remove the private email address. -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Patrick Shanahan

22:13

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

* Amedee Van Gasse [02-03-09 14:09]:

...

Boris Epstein schreef:

...
I don't know if this has already been asked on this list, but why did I get two copies of this email? </sarcasm>

Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 13:29:30 -0500 From: Boris Epstein To: Amedee Van Gasse Cc: opensuse@opensuse.org Subject: Re: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall -- Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USA HOG # US1244711 http://wahoo.no-ip.org Photo Album: http://wahoo.no-ip.org/gallery2 Registered Linux User #207535 @ http://counter.li.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

18:46

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...

James Knott schreef:

...
Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid?

I was speaking in a general sense. I have no problem using SSH or VPN to connect from work to my home network. However, there are many places where such "unauthorized" use is prohibited or blocked. As an example, the public library in my city has free WiFi access for library card holders. It works fine for accessing the web or library catalog, but they block both SSH and OpenVPN, so I cannot connect to my home network from the library. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

19:07

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

James Knott schreef:

...

Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
James Knott schreef:

...
Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid?

I was speaking in a general sense. I have no problem using SSH or VPN to connect from work to my home network. However, there are many places where such "unauthorized" use is prohibited or blocked. As an example, the public library in my city has free WiFi access for library card holders. It works fine for accessing the web or library catalog, but they block both SSH and OpenVPN, so I cannot connect to my home network from the library.

If you can connect to the web, you can tunnel over http or https. If you can ping to any random host on the web, then you can use icmptx. If you can make dns queries, then you can use nstx. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

19:14

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...

James Knott schreef:

...
Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
James Knott schreef:

...
Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid?

I was speaking in a general sense. I have no problem using SSH or VPN to connect from work to my home network. However, there are many places where such "unauthorized" use is prohibited or blocked. As an example, the public library in my city has free WiFi access for library card holders. It works fine for accessing the web or library catalog, but they block both SSH and OpenVPN, so I cannot connect to my home network from the library.

If you can connect to the web, you can tunnel over http or https. If you can ping to any random host on the web, then you can use icmptx. If you can make dns queries, then you can use nstx.

Regardless of what can technically be done, there's still corporate security policy to worry about. If you have an employer that bans such activity, will you do it? Also, many companies have "locked down" computers, where users cannot add any unauthorized software. They are all too often stuck with Outlook. -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

19:24

New subject: [opensuse] ssh from behind a corporate firewall

James Knott schreef:

...

Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
James Knott schreef:

...
Amedee Van Gasse wrote:

...
James Knott schreef:

...
Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...
...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

I assume that there is some kind of firewall? And that it blocks port 22? Are they using a mandatory proxy? I may be able to help you, if you give me more details. Are they using ISA or Squid?

I was speaking in a general sense. I have no problem using SSH or VPN to connect from work to my home network. However, there are many places where such "unauthorized" use is prohibited or blocked. As an example, the public library in my city has free WiFi access for library card holders. It works fine for accessing the web or library catalog, but they block both SSH and OpenVPN, so I cannot connect to my home network from the library.

If you can connect to the web, you can tunnel over http or https. If you can ping to any random host on the web, then you can use icmptx. If you can make dns queries, then you can use nstx.

Regardless of what can technically be done, there's still corporate security policy to worry about. If you have an employer that bans such activity, will you do it? Also, many companies have "locked down" computers, where users cannot add any unauthorized software. They are all too often stuck with Outlook.

If my customer doesn't allow me to use the tools I need for the contract they are paying me to do, bad luck for them. They will still be invoiced. Anyway I will follow every rule that the customer *gives* me in writing, but I'm not going to look up their corporate security that is hidden somewhere deep on their intranet. You know, those documents that everybody *should* have read but nobody knows that they exist. -- Amedee -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kai Ponte

20:25

New subject: SSH (WAS: Re: [opensuse] Reply to mailing lists)

James Knott wrote:

...

...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

Trivial, no. However, it is easy. I seriously doubt your corporate firewall is blocking port 22. Not that I would *ever* do such a thing, but I imagine that if you had a machine at home running sshd you could write a simple script like I might have that simply goes: ssh -C2qTnN -D 8080 my_user@my.home.ip.address and then tunnel into that machine through your corporate firewall. For a browser, I imagine you could then have a browser - say seamonkey - that you don't normally use (or use foxyproxy) and set it to point to a SOCKS proxy at 127.0.0.1 under port 8080. I'm sure email clients have similar functionality. On the home side, you would just need to forward incoming port 22 requests on your internet router to the internal IP of the machine running SSHD. Were I to do this, I'd have my router set to forward port 22 to the openSUSE laptop running ssh at 192.168.0.102. Check this article out: http://www.linux.com/feature/119744 and this one: http://www.thisblogblo.ws/tunneling-into-your-home-network-via-ssh/ Tell me if it works, I'd love to try it someday, so I could actually get on Facebook and youtube from work. :P -- kai www.perfectreign.com || www.filesite.org bis zum bitteren Ende -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Philip Dowie

20:25

New subject: SSH (WAS: Re: [opensuse] Reply to mailing lists)

...

I seriously doubt your corporate firewall is blocking port 22.

during my days at university, the machines had no outside access, web access was only by authenticated proxy, and only to national web sites (national traffic was free, international not so, so it was blocked).. But there were servers available from the outside.. I wrote a web cgi type scripty thing (that's the technical term) that I'd feed my current machine's name to, which would then ssh to the externally available machine, carrying port 3128 and 22 back, and then onwards again to my local machine.. Then I wrote a proxy autoconfig that caused me to use the university proxy for the national sites and my own proxy for the international sites. So yeah, it can be done.. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

James Knott

21:11

New subject: SSH (WAS: Re: [opensuse] Reply to mailing lists)

Kai Ponte wrote:

...

James Knott wrote:

...
...
AND, it's trivial to ssh into your home box and access an email client there.

Assuming the corporate network & security will permit.

Trivial, no.

However, it is easy.

I seriously doubt your corporate firewall is blocking port 22.

Not that I would *ever* do such a thing, but I imagine that if you had a machine at home running sshd you could write a simple script like I might have that simply goes: ssh -C2qTnN -D 8080 my_user@my.home.ip.address and then tunnel into that machine through your corporate firewall.

For a browser, I imagine you could then have a browser - say seamonkey - that you don't normally use (or use foxyproxy) and set it to point to a SOCKS proxy at 127.0.0.1 under port 8080.

I'm sure email clients have similar functionality.

On the home side, you would just need to forward incoming port 22 requests on your internet router to the internal IP of the machine running SSHD. Were I to do this, I'd have my router set to forward port 22 to the openSUSE laptop running ssh at 192.168.0.102.

Check this article out: http://www.linux.com/feature/119744 and this one: http://www.thisblogblo.ws/tunneling-into-your-home-network-via-ssh/

Tell me if it works, I'd love to try it someday, so I could actually get on Facebook and youtube from work. :P

I have already provided one example of how my local library blocks access. Many companies will do the same. Some are easily bypassed, some are not. However, with some employers, attempting such bypasses may be reason for disiplinary action. An I mentioned in another note, I have no problem accessing my home network from work as there have never been any barriers and since I'm the one who controls the firewall, there will not be, unless required by the management. . -- Use OpenOffice.org http://www.openoffice.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Jerry Houston

00:39

On Monday 02 February 2009 14:24:32 Philip Dowie wrote:

...

But hey - the whole top posting / bottom posting has been beaten to death, and the list administrators have decided upon a standard for the list - it's a pain for me, because setting my Outlook to bottom post would screw up all the other corporate mail, and I'd probably actually get in trouble for replying in such a manner..

I have the same issue at work. We develop Windows software, and our infrastructure is all Windows, including Exchange and Outlook. But I simply use Thunderbird for my personal email. It's easy enough to run it from a USB key, and I do so even though our IT department doesn't prohibit personal email. I could install it on a hard drive, but I like to be able to remove the USB key and take it with me, if I want. One of these days, KMail will be available for Windows, and I'll probably change to it at work, as I have on my Linux machines at home. For now, though, using Thunderbird beats the crap out of Outlook for list mail. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.

02:02

On Monday 02 February 2009 18:39:52 Jerry Houston wrote:

...

On Monday 02 February 2009 14:24:32 Philip Dowie wrote: One of these days, KMail will be available for Windows.

IIRC, KMail *is* available for Windows: http://techbase.kde.org/Projects/PIM/MS_Windows http://windows.kde.org/ -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. bss@iguanasuicide.net ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.net/ \_/

Jerry Houston

02:23

On Monday 02 February 2009 18:02:48 Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote:

...

On Monday 02 February 2009 18:39:52 Jerry Houston wrote:

...
On Monday 02 February 2009 14:24:32 Philip Dowie wrote: One of these days, KMail will be available for Windows.

IIRC, KMail *is* available for Windows: http://techbase.kde.org/Projects/PIM/MS_Windows http://windows.kde.org/

Sounds like they're making good progress. However, "KDE on Windows is not in the final state, so applications can be unsuitable for day to day use yet." I'm patient, though. And looking forward to a stable version. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Will Stephenson

4 Feb 4 Feb

20:39

On Tuesday 03 February 2009 03:23:36 Jerry Houston wrote:

...

On Monday 02 February 2009 18:02:48 Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote:

...
On Monday 02 February 2009 18:39:52 Jerry Houston wrote:

...
On Monday 02 February 2009 14:24:32 Philip Dowie wrote: One of these days, KMail will be available for Windows.

IIRC, KMail *is* available for Windows: http://techbase.kde.org/Projects/PIM/MS_Windows http://windows.kde.org/

Sounds like they're making good progress. However, "KDE on Windows is not in the final state, so applications can be unsuitable for day to day use yet." I'm patient, though. And looking forward to a stable version.

Right. I've seen Kontact running on Windows and Mac, and there's a dedicated project around these ports, so expect the KDE PIM suite to be one of the first KDE apps to stabilise on these OSes. Will -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Robert Smits

04:36

On February 1, 2009 09:04:29 pm Kai Ponte wrote:

...

Jerry Houston wrote:

...
Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight.

KMail has a lot of things going for it. It is almost as good as Outlook in my opinion. (Yes, you can set outlook to bottom post and correctly quote if you want.)

However, KMail does not do HTML emails.

What are you talking about? Kmail does HTML just fine, thank you. Kmail/Settings/Security -- Bob Smits bob@rsmits.ca -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kai Ponte

05:29

Robert Smits wrote:

...

On February 1, 2009 09:04:29 pm Kai Ponte wrote:

...
Jerry Houston wrote:

...
Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight.

KMail has a lot of things going for it. It is almost as good as Outlook in my opinion. (Yes, you can set outlook to bottom post and correctly quote if you want.)

However, KMail does not do HTML emails.

What are you talking about? Kmail does HTML just fine, thank you.

Kmail/Settings/Security

It does a lot of great things - I still would prefer using is. But this has become a show-stopper: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=86423 If I knew C++, I'd hack at it myself. -- kai www.perfectreign.com || www.filesite.org bis zum bitteren Ende -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

John Bennett

2 Feb 2 Feb

05:11

On Mon, Feb 2, 2009 at 6:13 AM, Jerry Houston wrote:

...

On Sunday 01 February 2009 11:57:00 Felix Miata wrote:

...
On 2009/02/01 11:17 (GMT-0800) Randall R Schulz composed:

...
Why run an inferior email client when a superior one is at hand?

Since one doesn't need to remove another email client in order to give KMail a try, I'd recommend such a trial for anyone who's the least bit unhappy with their current client.

Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

So, does kmail have a Windows version that can work with the same data source (ie on the same computer, dual booting) I dual boot and need a mail program that can work in either/or from a single data directory..... John. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Sven Burmeister

10:19

Am Montag, 2. Februar 2009 06:11:55 schrieb John Bennett:

...

So, does kmail have a Windows version that can work with the same data source (ie on the same computer, dual booting) I dual boot and need a mail program that can work in either/or from a single data directory.....

You can try it out: http://windows.kde.org/ Sven -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Jerry Houston

11:57

On Sunday 01 February 2009 21:11:55 John Bennett wrote:

...

...
So, does kmail have a Windows version that can work with the same data source (ie on the same computer, dual booting) I dual boot and need a mail program that can work in either/or from a single data directory.....

Sadly, not yet. But someone on the KDE list has implied that they will soon. It just hasn't been at the top of their priorities list, for obvious reasons. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Robert Smits

4 Feb 4 Feb

04:34

On February 1, 2009 12:13:41 pm Jerry Houston wrote:

...

Be forewarned, though: KMail versus Thunderbird just isn't a fair fight.

That's right. Kmail wins hands down. -- Bob Smits bob@rsmits.ca -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

G T Smith

2 Feb 2 Feb

07:58

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Felix Miata wrote:

...

On 2009/02/01 11:17 (GMT-0800) Randall R Schulz composed:

...
Why run an inferior email client when a superior one is at hand?

Email clients are a bit like cars, of which there are many to choose from. You pick because of some combination of features that suits you better than the others you've looked at, availability, and/or something particularly compelling to you that is missing from or poorer than others.

I would agree with this in general. I have over time used EMail clients on VAX/VMS, Symbian/PSION, Linux, IBM VM, Windows and DOS. Some were truly horrible. The strength of Thunderbird is that is cross platform, and if you need use both Windows and Linux the benefits of having a similarly configured Mail client on both platforms to my mind outweighs any advantages of using the 'best' mail client for each. (If you need to know IMHO this is Evolution in Linux, and TheBat or Pegasus on MS). For a multi-platform solution not using a Web Client Thunderbird is better than any alternative I know of. I am not certain of the current status of Eudora (but I never liked it so that is irrelevant to me), and anyone using the EMACS mail client must be a masochist by definition :-). - -- ============================================================================== I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my telephone. My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone. Bjarne Stroustrup ============================================================================== -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkmGp78ACgkQasN0sSnLmgI/SgCfQ8uX8OV+buVRjT7g6o5KyGs4 72gAoPmKZmig3ff7xGYogHGAi+FvdGmu =8w2M -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Amedee Van Gasse

13:18

On Sun, February 1, 2009 20:57, Felix Miata wrote:

...

On 2009/02/01 11:17 (GMT-0800) Randall R Schulz composed:

...
Why run an inferior email client when a superior one is at hand?

Email clients are a bit like cars, of which there are many to choose from. You pick because of some combination of features that suits you better than the others you've looked at, availability, and/or something particularly compelling to you that is missing from or poorer than others.

There should be a Top Gear for email clients. You can be Jeremy, I'll be Captain Slow. ;-) -- Amedee -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Ken Schneider

1 Feb 1 Feb

19:18

Kai Ponte pecked at the keyboard and wrote:

...

Frans de Boer wrote:

...
Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Unfortunately, the list is broken and the admins feel it better to leave it in that state. Some email programs - like KMail - do a reply-to list automatically sometimes. At other times, there is a reply-to-list feature. I am running Thunderbird now and don't have this feature (I did but it borked the attachments.)

Edit--->Preferences Advanced Config Editor Change Mailnews.clobber_list_reply to true And use reply-to-all for a list only reply, as has been posted numerous in the last month! -- Ken Schneider SuSe since Version 5.2, June 1998 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Kai Ponte

2 Feb 2 Feb

05:05

Ken Schneider wrote:

...

And use reply-to-all for a list only reply, as has been posted numerous in the last month!

I do that. However, intuitively, I should just hit "reply" and it should default to the list. -- kai www.perfectreign.com || www.filesite.org bis zum bitteren Ende -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Steve Jeppesen

12:03

On Sun, 01 Feb 2009 21:05:20 -0800 Kai Ponte wrote:

...

However, intuitively, I should just hit "reply" and it should default to the list.

it does for me and I did not have to modify any settings - it just works. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Carlos E. R.

1 Feb 1 Feb

23:02

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Sunday, 2009-02-01 at 11:13 -0800, Kai Ponte wrote:

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feature. I am running Thunderbird now and don't have this feature (I did but it borked the attachments.)

You can have the feature without the plugin or the attachment problem, as already been told recently here. - -- Cheers, Carlos E. R. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkmGKf0ACgkQtTMYHG2NR9V7egCfdxtDDgFgP/hU2YDLV6W2fimz 0jMAnRRjXgMPzvvnGoFZEoQMr+Cj4PEV =mFKI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org For additional commands, e-mail: opensuse+help@opensuse.org

Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.

2 Feb 2 Feb

19:21

On Friday 30 January 2009 10:16:51 Frans de Boer wrote:

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Question: are you also wondering why the mailing lists on opensuse.org not automatically insert the right forum address as an reply address?

This question is actually answered in the mailing lists documentation (http://en.opensuse.org/Mailinglists). A more complete discussion is http://woozle.org/~neale/papers/reply- to-still-harmful.html but be sure to read the references, particularly the Internet standards (RFCs).

...

Now, I must manually change the reply address when I send something.

Not if you use a good MUA. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. bss@iguanasuicide.net ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.net/ \_/

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participants (26)

Amedee Van Gasse
Boris Epstein
Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.
Carlos E. R.
Felix Miata
Frans de Boer
G T Smith
Heinz Diehl
James Knott
Jerry Houston
Jim Henderson
John Bennett
Kai Ponte
Ken Schneider
Mike McMullin
N B Day
ne...
Patrick Shanahan
peter nikolic
Philip Dowie
Philipp Thomas
Randall R Schulz
Robert Smits
Steve Jeppesen
Sven Burmeister
Will Stephenson