-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 9/28/2015 9:35 AM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

Perhaps visit opensuse-factory where Leap is discussed. Better yet, visit opensuse-factory archives as there was quite extensive ?debate? about arch which surely does not need to be revisited.

Glad 13.1 is esr ;p - -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iEYEARECAAYFAlYOAKgACgkQLXc0gOxMc9GZAACfZoxJ23sU/19/0gOBxM618wAJ e8EAoKK2nEaT6s6ORDjSopTqvXaZY+1e =grqc -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 02/10/15 07:38, Basil Chupin wrote:

On 02/10/15 13:57, David C. Rankin wrote:

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On 9/28/2015 9:35 AM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

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Perhaps visit opensuse-factory where Leap is discussed. Better yet, visit opensuse-factory archives as there was quite extensive ?debate? about arch which surely does not need to be revisited. Glad 13.1 is esr ;p

Re Leap.

Methinks that it would be best renamed at this point in time to 'Leap of Faith' if it still has the current form of Plasma 5 with its Settings (and ?Utilities) listing(s) containing everything but the kitchen sink and the itemised contents of the dishwasher -- not to mention the absence (still!) of the ability to give different desktops each a different wallpaper, like it is now possible in oS 13.2 using KDE 4.14.9.

If 'Leap of Faith' is released in its current form I then most sincerely hope that openSUSE 13.2 will become the bestest release of openSUSE and it, too, will be maintained and become the ESR which you say 13.1 is.

(I cannot help but have this vision that 'Leap of Faith' will become the Windows Vista and Windows 8 of oS, and if it is allowed to be done and people are willing to spend time maintaining it that openSUSE 13.2 would then become the Windows XP (around and loved for ~13 years) of the Linux world.

Having stated this, I just LOVE the big green light bulb when you boot up 'Leap of Faith' Beta #1 :-) .)

BC

I have not tried Leap, especially as its a Beta, but is it not a bit too soon to start writing it off ? M -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 02/10/15 18:18, John Andersen wrote:

On October 2, 2015 12:32:32 AM PDT, michael norman wrote:

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On 02/10/15 13:57, David C. Rankin wrote:

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On 9/28/2015 9:35 AM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

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Perhaps visit opensuse-factory where Leap is discussed. Better yet, visit opensuse-factory archives as there was quite extensive ?debate? about arch which surely does not need to be revisited. Glad 13.1 is esr ;p Re Leap.

Methinks that it would be best renamed at this point in time to 'Leap of Faith' if it still has the current form of Plasma 5 with its Settings (and ?Utilities) listing(s) containing everything but the kitchen sink and the itemised contents of the dishwasher -- not to mention the absence (still!) of the ability to give different desktops each a different wallpaper, like it is now possible in oS 13.2 using KDE 4.14.9. If 'Leap of Faith' is released in its current form I then most sincerely hope that openSUSE 13.2 will become the bestest release of openSUSE and it, too, will be maintained and become the ESR which you say 13.1 is.

(I cannot help but have this vision that 'Leap of Faith' will become

On 02/10/15 07:38, Basil Chupin wrote: the

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Windows Vista and Windows 8 of oS, and if it is allowed to be done and people are willing to spend time maintaining it that openSUSE 13.2 would then become the Windows XP (around and loved for ~13 years) of the Linux world.

Having stated this, I just LOVE the big green light bulb when you boot up 'Leap of Faith' Beta #1 :-) .)

BC

I have not tried Leap, especially as its a Beta, but is it not a bit too soon to start writing it off ?

M If history is any indication, NO, it is not too soon. The sooner the better. I'm going to fire up a virtual machine and give it a try tomorrow.

If anything, too many of us have been remiss about helping out with testing, allowing the developers and packagers to think something is feature complete and ready for prime time, like KDE4 back in the day, and BTRFS just a year ago.

Ah, speaking of BTRFS then be advised that 'Faith' will, by default, format partitions in BTRFS *and* XFS when it decides where to install 'Faith' on your computer. Pay CLOSE attention when the Install reaches the part where it wants to install Leap and how it wants to format the partitions it wants to create. And before you, or David, allows Patrick to chastise you for not following discussions in Factory (or Project) I will tell you that the default use of BTRFS *was* discussed there but it was more akin to the statement at the UN that Iraq had WMT and no matter how one argued against the proposition you had no chance of sanity prevailing 'cause the decision was already made :-D . BC -- Using openSUSE 13.2, KDE 4.14.9 & kernel 4.2.2-1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX660 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 02/10/15 20:03, Carlos E. R. wrote:

On 2015-10-02 11:31, Basil Chupin wrote:

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Ah, speaking of BTRFS then be advised that 'Faith' will, by default, format partitions in BTRFS *and* XFS when it decides where to install 'Faith' on your computer. Old stuff.

13.2 already did that.

Sorry, old boy, but I had to install 13.2 only a couple of weeks or so ago and it did NOT *default* to using BTRFS or XFS to format the partitions for the installations. Yes, I do believe that both BTRFS has been available for openSUSE for a while now - even though there are NO utilities to edit this filesystem - and XFS has certainly been available for quite some time now (well before BTFRS) but neither have been *DEFAULT* file systems to be used until 'Leap'. Am I wrong? BC -- Using openSUSE 13.2, KDE 4.14.9 & kernel 4.2.2-1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX660 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 2015-10-02 12:36, Basil Chupin wrote:

On 02/10/15 20:03, Carlos E. R. wrote:

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Old stuff.

13.2 already did that.

Sorry, old boy, but I had to install 13.2 only a couple of weeks or so ago and it did NOT *default* to using BTRFS or XFS to format the partitions for the installations.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=13.2+will+use+btrfs+as+default -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" at Telcontar)

On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 9:32 AM, michael norman wrote:

I have not tried Leap, especially as its a Beta, but is it not a bit too soon to start writing it off ?

I have also been waiting a bit. The machine I can use for this is one that I need to use. Not in a production sense. But in a "I need to use this computer" sense. What is the opinion about the state of Leap? Is it possible to move to the final install from the current Beta without doing a re-install? That is, can one do updates to Leap at this time? -- Roger Oberholtzer -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 02/10/15 17:32, michael norman wrote:

On 02/10/15 07:38, Basil Chupin wrote:

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On 02/10/15 13:57, David C. Rankin wrote:

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On 9/28/2015 9:35 AM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

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Perhaps visit opensuse-factory where Leap is discussed. Better yet, visit opensuse-factory archives as there was quite extensive ?debate? about arch which surely does not need to be revisited. Glad 13.1 is esr ;p

Re Leap.

Methinks that it would be best renamed at this point in time to 'Leap of Faith' if it still has the current form of Plasma 5 with its Settings (and ?Utilities) listing(s) containing everything but the kitchen sink and the itemised contents of the dishwasher -- not to mention the absence (still!) of the ability to give different desktops each a different wallpaper, like it is now possible in oS 13.2 using KDE 4.14.9.

If 'Leap of Faith' is released in its current form I then most sincerely hope that openSUSE 13.2 will become the bestest release of openSUSE and it, too, will be maintained and become the ESR which you say 13.1 is.

(I cannot help but have this vision that 'Leap of Faith' will become the Windows Vista and Windows 8 of oS, and if it is allowed to be done and people are willing to spend time maintaining it that openSUSE 13.2 would then become the Windows XP (around and loved for ~13 years) of the Linux world.

Having stated this, I just LOVE the big green light bulb when you boot up 'Leap of Faith' Beta #1 :-) .)

BC

I have not tried Leap, especially as its a Beta, but is it not a bit too soon to start writing it off ?

M

When you ask a question as the one you just did, you need to state which version of openSUSE you are using when posting your message. But if you read my post carefully, I am not "writing it off" because the final version is still to be released in the first week of November. There is still time to make adjustments - or at least advise everyone that changes *will* be made post release of Leap. Expressing one's concern about a distribution one has loved and used for many years does not equate to "writing it off". Criticism of adopting wrong directions is often taken by the unimaginative and anal retentive people doing the adopting as requiring the need to "shoot the messenger" or putting fingers into the ears and crying, "I cannot hear you!" :-) . (BTW, I have my tin hat on :-) . You are the first one to shoot at me with an air gun, but now for the Howitzers...... 8-) .) BC -- Using openSUSE 13.2, KDE 4.14.9 & kernel 4.2.2-1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX660 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org

On 02/10/15 19:41, michael norman wrote:

On 02/10/15 10:03, Basil Chupin wrote:

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On 02/10/15 17:32, michael norman wrote:

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On 02/10/15 07:38, Basil Chupin wrote:

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On 02/10/15 13:57, David C. Rankin wrote:

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On 9/28/2015 9:35 AM, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

...

Perhaps visit opensuse-factory where Leap is discussed. Better yet, visit opensuse-factory archives as there was quite extensive ?debate? about arch which surely does not need to be revisited. Glad 13.1 is esr ;p

Re Leap.

Methinks that it would be best renamed at this point in time to 'Leap of Faith' if it still has the current form of Plasma 5 with its Settings (and ?Utilities) listing(s) containing everything but the kitchen sink and the itemised contents of the dishwasher -- not to mention the absence (still!) of the ability to give different desktops each a different wallpaper, like it is now possible in oS 13.2 using KDE 4.14.9.

If 'Leap of Faith' is released in its current form I then most sincerely hope that openSUSE 13.2 will become the bestest release of openSUSE and it, too, will be maintained and become the ESR which you say 13.1 is.

(I cannot help but have this vision that 'Leap of Faith' will become the Windows Vista and Windows 8 of oS, and if it is allowed to be done and people are willing to spend time maintaining it that openSUSE 13.2 would then become the Windows XP (around and loved for ~13 years) of the Linux world.

Having stated this, I just LOVE the big green light bulb when you boot up 'Leap of Faith' Beta #1 :-) .)

BC

I have not tried Leap, especially as its a Beta, but is it not a bit too soon to start writing it off ?

M

When you ask a question as the one you just did, you need to state which version of openSUSE you are using when posting your message.

But if you read my post carefully, I am not "writing it off" because the final version is still to be released in the first week of November. There is still time to make adjustments - or at least advise everyone that changes *will* be made post release of Leap.

Expressing one's concern about a distribution one has loved and used for many years does not equate to "writing it off". Criticism of adopting wrong directions is often taken by the unimaginative and anal retentive people doing the adopting as requiring the need to "shoot the messenger" or putting fingers into the ears and crying, "I cannot hear you!" :-) .

(BTW, I have my tin hat on :-) . You are the first one to shoot at me with an air gun, but now for the Howitzers...... 8-) .)

BC

Peace brother. FWIW I have used openSUSE and SUSE before it since probably SUSE 5 (its a long time ago) at the moment I have 13.1 and 13.2. I suspect you could say pretty much the same thing

My posted reaction was badly phrased. No offense to you was intended.

I take the point you and others make that the time is now to influence how the next release turns out.

I will try and contribute to that process.

M

No offence, in any shape or form, taken, M :-) . But I am still waiting for "In-coming!" from the Howitzer brigade (America is still in "Noddy land" and Europe is in the middle of having their lunch and about to start their afternoon siestas) :-) . Another way to see what one will get in Leap is to run Tumbleweed KDE Live where you will see Plasma 5 in all of its gory - er, sorry - glory :-) . But about the comment that, "...the time is now to influence how the next release turns out.". Sorry wrong! 'Leap of Faith' is due out in first week of November - that's only 4 weeks away. There can be no major changes to the distro. at this point in time - it's just too late for that and which is why I mentioned makding it known that changes will be made after the release. Discussions were held in Factory and Project but not everybody subscribes to these lists and so the number of people who can discuss changes is limited. Besides, not everybody reading those lists participates, and those who do dare to make a comment are sometimes considered as "trouble makers". BC -- Using openSUSE 13.2, KDE 4.14.9 & kernel 4.2.2-1 on a system with- AMD FX 8-core 3.6/4.2GHz processor 16GB PC14900/1866MHz Quad Channel RAM Gigabyte AMD3+ m/board; Gigabyte nVidia GTX660 GPU -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org