[opensuse] Is my machine too old for OS 12.1 ?
Hello knowledgeable people I have just installed OpenSuse 12.1 on a not very young PC with AMD Athlon processor socker 362 ; 1048 Mhz and 1.5 Gb. ram I installed LXce The usb mouse leaves a trailing suite of cursor arrows along its course The keyboard does not work unless I change to console #1 and come back to #7 my root and user passwords are recognised in Lxce but not in console mode where the machine has been given a strange name : 'Asparagus' I tried several updates, which is not easy under these circumstances but the kernel update always fails, sometimes just about 98 or 99 % which is most frustrating and I find some strange error messages in /var/log/messages; Here is a sample : Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: uc_update: Value too old: name = WebYaST/df/df-root; value time = 1332618804; last cache update = 1332618804; Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: Filter subsystem: Built-in target `write': Dispatching value to all write plugins failed with status -1. Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469794] nouveau_ratelimit: 147111 callbacks suppressed Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469806] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - NOTIFY nsource: DATA_ERROR nstatus: INVALID_STATE BAD_ARGUMENT Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469823] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - ch 1/7 class 0x0042 mthd 0x0304 data 0x20002000 Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469831] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - NOTIFY nsource: STATE_INVALID nstatus: INVALID_STATE BAD_ARGUMENT Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469844] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - ch 1/3 class 0x004a mthd 0x0404 data 0x00180018 Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.470050] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - NOTIFY nsource: DATA_ERROR nstatus: INVALID_STATE BAD_ARGUMENT What do you think of it ? Is there a way out ? -- Paul Ollion Proud Linux user SuSE 11.3 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
Paul Ollion wrote:
What do you think of it ? Is there a way out ?
I have also noticed 12.1 is sluggish. I have an AMD 64 bit CPU and 3 GB of memory and sometimes it's real slow. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Sat, 2012-03-24 at 21:43 +0100, Paul Ollion wrote:
I have just installed OpenSuse 12.1 on a not very young PC with AMD Athlon processor socker 362 ; 1048 Mhz and 1.5 Gb. ram I installed LXce The usb mouse leaves a trailing suite of cursor arrows along its course The keyboard does not work unless I change to console #1 and come back to #7 my root and user passwords are recognised in Lxce but not in console mode where the machine has been given a strange name : 'Asparagus' I tried several updates, which is not easy under these circumstances but the kernel update always fails, sometimes just about 98 or 99 % which is most frustrating and I find some strange error messages in /var/log/messages; Here is a sample : Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: uc_update: Value too old: name = WebYaST/df/df-root; value time = 1332618804; last cache update = 1332618804; Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: Filter subsystem: Built-in target `write': Dispatching value to all write plugins failed with status -1. Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469794] nouveau_ratelimit: 147111 callbacks suppressed What do you think of it ? Is there a way out ?
You could try the proprietary nvidia drivers; you are using "nouveau". The issue isn't really 'age', it is just that something isn't copasetic between the drivers and your hardware. If you are seeing ghosts of your pointer then you have some type of malfunction in X. An /sbin/lspci should list exactly what your hardware is for a start. Perhaps there is a known issue with your nVidia chipset?
On Sunday, March 25, 2012 Adam wrote :
On Sat, 2012-03-24 at 21:43 +0100, Paul Ollion wrote:
I have just installed OpenSuse 12.1 on a not very young PC with AMD Athlon processor socker 362 ; 1048 Mhz and 1.5 Gb. ram I installed LXce The usb mouse leaves a trailing suite of cursor arrows along its course The keyboard does not work unless I change to console #1 and come back to #7 my root and user passwords are recognised in Lxce but not in console mode where the machine has been given a strange name : 'Asparagus' I tried several updates, which is not easy under these circumstances but the kernel update always fails, sometimes just about 98 or 99 % which is most frustrating and I find some strange error messages in /var/log/messages; Here is a sample : Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: uc_update: Value too old: name = WebYaST/df/df-root; value time = 1332618804; last cache update = 1332618804; Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: Filter subsystem: Built-in target `write': Dispatching value to all write plugins failed with status -1. Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469794] nouveau_ratelimit: 147111 callbacks suppressed What do you think of it ? Is there a way out ?
You could try the proprietary nvidia drivers; you are using "nouveau".
The issue isn't really 'age', it is just that something isn't copasetic between the drivers and your hardware. If you are seeing ghosts of your pointer then you have some type of malfunction in X.
An /sbin/lspci should list exactly what your hardware is for a start. Perhaps there is a known issue with your nVidia chipset?
On Sun Mar 25 09:03:43 2012 Basil wrote :
Your problem is the driver for the nVidia card. The "nouveau" driver is a piece of, ahem,....I cannot say it in polite company :-) .
Install the real - that is as in "macho" :-) NVIDIA driver and you will see a big difference.
Oh, and when you do install it, the first thing that you do is to do-
Kickoff[*]>System Settings> Desktop Effects and disable the Effects.
[*] Kickoff - the Gecko or what is known as the Start icon in Windows.
BC On Sun Mar 25 11:11:09 2012 Felix wrote :
Or use /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/70-composite.conf to disable bling globally:
Section "Extensions"
Option "Composite" "Disable"
EndSection
Thanks to you all : James, Adam, Basil, Felix I uninstalled "nouveau" and installed the appropriate nVidia driver which required a bit of search since my card is rather elderly (nVidia RIVA TNT) Then after a reboot everything was back in order. I installed Lxce to avoid too much "bling" and the machine is pretty fast ; at least faster than with OS 11.3 and kde which has become unbearably slow. Once more this list saved me. -- Paul Ollion Proud Linux user SuSE 11.3 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 25/03/12 07:43, Paul Ollion wrote:
Hello knowledgeable people
I have just installed OpenSuse 12.1 on a not very young PC with AMD Athlon processor socker 362 ; 1048 Mhz and 1.5 Gb. ram
I installed LXce The usb mouse leaves a trailing suite of cursor arrows along its course The keyboard does not work unless I change to console #1 and come back to #7 my root and user passwords are recognised in Lxce but not in console mode where the machine has been given a strange name : 'Asparagus' I tried several updates, which is not easy under these circumstances but the kernel update always fails, sometimes just about 98 or 99 % which is most frustrating and I find some strange error messages in /var/log/messages; Here is a sample : Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: uc_update: Value too old: name = WebYaST/df/df-root; value time = 1332618804; last cache update = 1332618804; Mar 24 20:53:24 atelier collectd[3031]: Filter subsystem: Built-in target `write': Dispatching value to all write plugins failed with status -1. Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469794] nouveau_ratelimit: 147111 callbacks suppressed Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469806] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - NOTIFY nsource: DATA_ERROR nstatus: INVALID_STATE BAD_ARGUMENT Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469823] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - ch 1/7 class 0x0042 mthd 0x0304 data 0x20002000 Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469831] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - NOTIFY nsource: STATE_INVALID nstatus: INVALID_STATE BAD_ARGUMENT Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.469844] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - ch 1/3 class 0x004a mthd 0x0404 data 0x00180018 Mar 24 20:53:26 atelier kernel: [ 1055.470050] [drm] nouveau 0000:01:00.0: PGRAPH - NOTIFY nsource: DATA_ERROR nstatus: INVALID_STATE BAD_ARGUMENT
What do you think of it ? Is there a way out ?
Your problem is the driver for the nVidia card. The "nouveau" driver is a piece of, ahem,....I cannot say it in polite company :-) . Install the *real* - that is as in "macho" :-) NVIDIA driver and you will see a big difference. Oh, and when you do install it, the first thing that you do is to do- Kickoff[*]>System Settings> Desktop Effects and disable the Effects. [*] Kickoff - the Gecko or what is known as the Start icon in Windows. BC -- Q. What did you do wrong if your wife keeps coming out of the kitchen to nag you? A. You made the chain too long. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2012/03/25 18:03 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
Oh, and when you do install it, the first thing that you do is to do-
Kickoff[*]>System Settings> Desktop Effects and disable the Effects.
Or use /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/70-composite.conf to disable bling globally: Section "Extensions" Option "Composite" "Disable" EndSection -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 25/03/12 20:11, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/25 18:03 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
Oh, and when you do install it, the first thing that you do is to do-
Kickoff[*]>System Settings> Desktop Effects and disable the Effects.
Or use /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/70-composite.conf to disable bling globally:
Section "Extensions" Option "Composite" "Disable" EndSection
Why go to the mountain when you can make the mountain come to you (via System Settings)? BC -- Q. What did you do wrong if your wife keeps coming out of the kitchen to nag you? A. You made the chain too long. -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2012/03/25 05:17 (GMT-0400) Basil Chupin composed:
On 25/03/12 20:11, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/25 18:03 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
Oh, and when you do install it, the first thing that you do is to do-
Kickoff[*]>System Settings> Desktop Effects and disable the Effects.
Or use /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/70-composite.conf to disable bling globally:
Section "Extensions" Option "Composite" "Disable" EndSection
Why go to the mountain when you can make the mountain come to you (via System Settings)?
Apparently you don't know the meaning of globally -> systemwide, for all users, like everything that is or belongs in /etc. It works in KDM, GDM, KDE, Gnome, XFCE, LXDE, etc., and for every user login. In some hardware/driver environments compositing is so bad system settings isn't even reachable. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Sun, 2012-03-25 at 18:03 +1100, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 25/03/12 07:43, Paul Ollion wrote:
Hello knowledgeable people I have just installed OpenSuse 12.1 on a not very young PC with AMD Athlon processor socker 362 ; 1048 Mhz and 1.5 Gb. ram What do you think of it ? Is there a way out ? Your problem is the driver for the nVidia card. The "nouveau" driver is a piece of, ahem,....I cannot say it in polite company :-) .
This statement is extremely unfair. Nouveau works *great*, much better than the proprietary driver on lots of hardware. Just not *all* hardware. I use nouveau on my workstation [GeForce 8400 GS] and my laptop [GeForce GT 230M (NB10P GE)] - on both it works perfectly - and fast. On my laptop I can plug in an external display, have it just-work, unplug it and be left with a working single display. If I use the properietary driver connecting an external display requires me to use the nvidia tool to redetect the display and getting it to work is very hit-n-miss. Thank goodness of the awesomeness that is nouveau [provided you have the right hardware]. On the other hand - that same laptop with openSUSE 11.x - I had to use the proprietary drivers to get decent performance. Times change.
Install the *real* - that is as in "macho" :-) NVIDIA driver and you will see a big difference.
Or that makes it nearly impossible to use a secondary display.
On Monday, March 26, 2012 Adam wrote :
On Sun, 2012-03-25 at 18:03 +1100, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 25/03/12 07:43, Paul Ollion wrote:
Hello knowledgeable people I have just installed OpenSuse 12.1 on a not very young PC with AMD Athlon processor socker 362 ; 1048 Mhz and 1.5 Gb. ram What do you think of it ? Is there a way out ?
Your problem is the driver for the nVidia card. The "nouveau" driver is a piece of, ahem,....I cannot say it in polite company :-) .
This statement is extremely unfair. Nouveau works *great*, much better than the proprietary driver on lots of hardware. Just not *all* hardware.
I use nouveau on my workstation [GeForce 8400 GS] and my laptop [GeForce GT 230M (NB10P GE)] - on both it works perfectly - and fast.
On my laptop I can plug in an external display, have it just-work, unplug it and be left with a working single display. If I use the properietary driver connecting an external display requires me to use the nvidia tool to redetect the display and getting it to work is very hit-n-miss.
Thank goodness of the awesomeness that is nouveau [provided you have the right hardware].
On the other hand - that same laptop with openSUSE 11.x - I had to use the proprietary drivers to get decent performance. Times change.
Install the *real* - that is as in "macho" :-) NVIDIA driver and you will see a big difference.
Or that makes it nearly impossible to use a secondary display.
You are right I entirely agreed with Basil's opinion about Nouveau when I experienced all the troubles it caused ; but I had the most comfortable, fastest and flawless install of OS 12.1 on a recent machine on which Nouveau works so perfectly that I had not even noticed I was using it. -- Paul Ollion Proud Linux user SuSE 11.3 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 26/03/12 18:32, Paul Ollion wrote: [pruned]
You are right I entirely agreed with Basil's opinion about Nouveau when I experienced all the troubles it caused ; but I had the most comfortable, fastest and flawless install of OS 12.1 on a recent machine on which Nouveau works so perfectly that I had not even noticed I was using it.
If this noovoo driver works so pefectly why then have I had to use "nomodeset" when installing Milestone #1 and #2, and then when booting into the install, otherwise I got nowhere with the install and then the first boot? In fact, I had to add "nomodeset" in menu.lst so as to be able to login without going thru hoops to do so (until I installed the proper nVidia driver)? And my video card is not something bought at an antique shop: it is a Geforce 7600 GT card and uses the latest nVidia 295.33 driver. BC -- The more sand has escaped from the hourglass of our life, the clearer we should see through it. Niccolo Machiavelli -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-03-26 10:57, Basil Chupin wrote:
If this noovoo driver works so pefectly why then have I had to use "nomodeset" when installing Milestone #1 and #2, and then when booting into the install, otherwise I got nowhere with the install and then the first boot? In fact, I had to add "nomodeset" in menu.lst so as to be able to login without going thru hoops to do so (until I installed the proper nVidia driver)? And my video card is not something bought at an antique shop: it is a Geforce 7600 GT card and uses the latest nVidia 295.33 driver.
Yes, many people have to do that. People are asking every week in the forums about how they install openSUSE because they get a black screen. They think openSUSE is bad or something. Then somebody explain how to do the modeset trick and install Nvidia drivers, and things work for them. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk9wQlgACgkQIvFNjefEBxo+CQCbBKTEzPq/2PS8zPiZJgx87SWx l2kAnjSMbIwbSac3ej6lRgfL6cvd7cI1 =vC+k -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 26/03/12 21:18, Carlos E. R. wrote:
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On 2012-03-26 10:57, Basil Chupin wrote:
If this noovoo driver works so pefectly why then have I had to use "nomodeset" when installing Milestone #1 and #2, and then when booting into the install, otherwise I got nowhere with the install and then the first boot? In fact, I had to add "nomodeset" in menu.lst so as to be able to login without going thru hoops to do so (until I installed the proper nVidia driver)? And my video card is not something bought at an antique shop: it is a Geforce 7600 GT card and uses the latest nVidia 295.33 driver. Yes, many people have to do that.
People are asking every week in the forums about how they install openSUSE because they get a black screen. They think openSUSE is bad or something.
Then somebody explain how to do the modeset trick and install Nvidia drivers, and things work for them.
You know, this simply amazes me to the nth degree. It is the same as the rubbish which was argued about whether to have "close" or "restart" or "summary" as the default for YaST's Software Manager. Why not simply put in "nomodeset" as the default entry on all installs which will allow people to at least yo login or continue the installation without having a black screen facing them and not knowing what the heck is going wrong?! (Yeah, yeah, I know....go to the FATE thing, or whatever, and cast your vote on this, right? :-( . But in the meantime people think openSUSE is <enter your choice of word>.) BC -- The more sand has escaped from the hourglass of our life, the clearer we should see through it. Niccolo Machiavelli -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-03-26 13:15, Basil Chupin wrote:
Why not simply put in "nomodeset" as the default entry on all installs which will allow people to at least yo login or continue the installation without having a black screen facing them and not knowing what the heck is going wrong?!
No, because then it will not work for many others, or will work badly. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk9xECwACgkQIvFNjefEBxpm1ACcD2CAE31Na/yDKDlFp6g8n0Fh i1QAn1ZAAPRRgp9E1IRAAnWXajuWGUtH =fWjU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 27/03/12 11:56, Carlos E. R. wrote:
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On 2012-03-26 13:15, Basil Chupin wrote:
Why not simply put in "nomodeset" as the default entry on all installs which will allow people to at least yo login or continue the installation without having a black screen facing them and not knowing what the heck is going wrong?! No, because then it will not work for many others, or will work badly.
Please educate me: why would it not work for many or work badly? BC -- The more sand has escaped from the hourglass of our life, the clearer we should see through it. Niccolo Machiavelli -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-03-27 03:01, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 27/03/12 11:56, Carlos E. R. wrote:
Please educate me: why would it not work for many or work badly?
It is so. I don't remember the cause. It may be that makes revert to vesa on some/many machines at 640*480 resolution. It was explained on a similar discussion to this a year or two ago. Someone else may explain better. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk9xE4AACgkQIvFNjefEBxp7LwCfTCiLoHfbHEWEW+m4LuFZ//lh NPQAoI//QzXPRJquFKFLR2fsCWWyk8uR =/tLj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 27/03/12 12:10, Carlos E. R. wrote:
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On 2012-03-27 03:01, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 27/03/12 11:56, Carlos E. R. wrote: Please educate me: why would it not work for many or work badly? It is so. I don't remember the cause. It may be that makes revert to vesa on some/many machines at 640*480 resolution. It was explained on a similar discussion to this a year or two ago.
Someone else may explain better.
OK, it would be nice to know. My monitor is 1920x1080p and when I used "nomodeset" in the past recent weeks installing MS #1 and #2 my screen defaulted to 1240xsomething and not to anythink like 640x480 - but that was for me so others' experiences will no doubt be different. BC -- The more sand has escaped from the hourglass of our life, the clearer we should see through it. Niccolo Machiavelli -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-03-27 03:56, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 27/03/12 12:10, Carlos E. R. wrote:
Someone else may explain better.
OK, it would be nice to know.
Yep :-)
My monitor is 1920x1080p and when I used "nomodeset" in the past recent weeks installing MS #1 and #2 my screen defaulted to 1240xsomething and not to anythink like 640x480 - but that was for me so others' experiences will no doubt be different.
That's it. Even for you a drop to 1240 is a loss, you would notice that something was amiss. I understood that not enabling nomedeset was a compromise - as almost everything in engineering. It is an unfortunate situation. If nouveau worked always or mostly, and better, it would be a wonderful world. No more recompiling drivers on kernel change, no problems of sudden black screens, no more downloading drivers on install. But it is not so and many need the proprietary driver. If I'm not mistaken (I haven checked lately) I can use both, I'm fortunate. Almost, because the nouveau did not hibernate well for me, and did not have hardware accel. And it is not easy to test once you are using the proprietary driver, no bootup switch to choose one or the other at full power, to check on their improvements. - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk9xJxMACgkQIvFNjefEBxrJPACgysgQEoNBRO7cffnT48xTIkVu sbcAoNApl6b6H0GTr6W3AsZ3uJ4n2B8o =hu2q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 27/03/12 13:33, Carlos E. R. wrote:
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On 2012-03-27 03:56, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 27/03/12 12:10, Carlos E. R. wrote:
Someone else may explain better. OK, it would be nice to know. Yep :-)
My monitor is 1920x1080p and when I used "nomodeset" in the past recent weeks installing MS #1 and #2 my screen defaulted to 1240xsomething and not to anythink like 640x480 - but that was for me so others' experiences will no doubt be different. That's it. Even for you a drop to 1240 is a loss, you would notice that something was amiss.
This may be so but at least I was able to get the damn installation to proceed instead of the 'CD' simply spinning ad nauseum and the screen coming up ad nauseum with "No Signal"! Once I put in "nomodeset" I got something to look at on the screen and I could proceed with the installation. I am sure that it is better to even look at a 640x480 image than stare at a totally black screen. [pruned] BC -- The more sand has escaped from the hourglass of our life, the clearer we should see through it. Niccolo Machiavelli -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-03-27 05:20, Basil Chupin wrote:
This may be so but at least I was able to get the damn installation to proceed instead of the 'CD' simply spinning ad nauseum and the screen coming up ad nauseum with "No Signal"!
Once I put in "nomodeset" I got something to look at on the screen and I could proceed with the installation.
I am sure that it is better to even look at a 640x480 image than stare at a totally black screen.
Absolutely! - -- Cheers / Saludos, Carlos E. R. (from 11.4 x86_64 "Celadon" at Telcontar) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.16 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk9xquUACgkQIvFNjefEBxroZwCgv+Y2nKTdOHs2UxRk1kYAiOVa NMIAoMDo9B+ryNUrIFAPnB9bPA9KHxjp =KD9Z -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 27/03/12 03:33, Carlos E. R. wrote:
On 2012-03-27 03:56, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 27/03/12 12:10, Carlos E. R. wrote:
Someone else may explain better.
OK, it would be nice to know.
Yep :-)
My monitor is 1920x1080p and when I used "nomodeset" in the past recent weeks installing MS #1 and #2 my screen defaulted to 1240xsomething and not to anythink like 640x480 - but that was for me so others' experiences will no doubt be different.
That's it. Even for you a drop to 1240 is a loss, you would notice that something was amiss. I understood that not enabling nomedeset was a compromise - as almost everything in engineering.
It is an unfortunate situation.
If nouveau worked always or mostly, and better, it would be a wonderful world. No more recompiling drivers on kernel change, no problems of sudden black screens, no more downloading drivers on install. But it is not so and many need the proprietary driver.
If I'm not mistaken (I haven checked lately) I can use both, I'm fortunate. Almost, because the nouveau did not hibernate well for me, and did not have hardware accel. And it is not easy to test once you are using the proprietary driver, no bootup switch to choose one or the other at full power, to check on their improvements.
Are the nouveau drivers involved during boot? Systemd/sysinitv are just outputting plain text messages to the console screen. I had to invoke 'nomodeset' on my Dell Inspiron 1525 laptop to see these messages, as I have an encrypted /home, and I have no way of knowing when cryptsetup requests the passphrase, apart from lack of activity of the hard drive light. My display chipset is Intel Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller, not Nvidia. I'm running openSUSE 12.1 with KDE4. Bob -- Bob Williams System: Linux 3.1.9-1.4-desktop Distro: openSUSE 12.1 (x86_64) with KDE Development Platform: 4.7.2 (4.7.2) "release 5" Uptime: 06:00am up 1 day 12:02, 3 users, load average: 0.01, 0.05, 0.05 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2012/03/30 17:11 (GMT+0100) Bob Williams composed:
Are the nouveau drivers involved during boot? Systemd/sysinitv are just outputting plain text messages to the console screen.
When nomodeset is not invoked, the native driver is initialized early during init.
I had to invoke 'nomodeset' on my Dell Inspiron 1525 laptop to see these messages, as I have an encrypted /home, and I have no way of knowing when cryptsetup requests the passphrase, apart from lack of activity of the hard drive light.
My display chipset is Intel Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller, not Nvidia. I'm running openSUSE 12.1 with KDE4.
nomodeset is not a correct way to get boot messages displayed. Instead, modify /boot/grub/menu.lst get rid of quiet, and change splash=silent to splash=verbose. Do the same in /etc/sysconfig/bootloader if you want to keep it that way when kernels are updated. My Intel 945 and 915 chipset desktop machines work OK, so your newer 965 laptop should be no worse if running at full power. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 30/03/12 17:31, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/30 17:11 (GMT+0100) Bob Williams composed:
Are the nouveau drivers involved during boot? Systemd/sysinitv are just outputting plain text messages to the console screen.
When nomodeset is not invoked, the native driver is initialized early during init.
I had to invoke 'nomodeset' on my Dell Inspiron 1525 laptop to see these messages, as I have an encrypted /home, and I have no way of knowing when cryptsetup requests the passphrase, apart from lack of activity of the hard drive light.
My display chipset is Intel Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller, not Nvidia. I'm running openSUSE 12.1 with KDE4.
nomodeset is not a correct way to get boot messages displayed. Instead, modify /boot/grub/menu.lst get rid of quiet, and change splash=silent to splash=verbose. Do the same in /etc/sysconfig/bootloader if you want to keep it that way when kernels are updated.
My Intel 945 and 915 chipset desktop machines work OK, so your newer 965 laptop should be no worse if running at full power.
Well, I tried your suggestion, and I'm sorry to say, it didn't work. A lot of messages scrolled rapidly down the screen, then the screen went black. When the hard drive light stopped flickering I entered the encryption password, and the system continued booting to the login screen. So, I think I'll stay with the 'quiet' and 'nomodeset' options. Bob -- Bob Williams System: Linux 3.1.9-1.4-desktop Distro: openSUSE 12.1 (x86_64) with KDE Development Platform: 4.7.2 (4.7.2) "release 5" Uptime: 18:00pm up 2 days 0:02, 3 users, load average: 0.03, 0.15, 0.19 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2012/03/30 18:54 (GMT+0100) Bob Williams composed:
On 30/03/12 17:31, Felix Miata wrote:
nomodeset is not a correct way to get boot messages displayed. Instead, modify /boot/grub/menu.lst get rid of quiet, and change splash=silent to splash=verbose. Do the same in /etc/sysconfig/bootloader if you want to keep it that way when kernels are updated.
My Intel 945 and 915 chipset desktop machines work OK, so your newer 965 laptop should be no worse if running at full power.
Well, I tried your suggestion, and I'm sorry to say, it didn't work. A lot of messages scrolled rapidly down the screen, then the screen went black. When the hard drive light stopped flickering I entered the encryption password, and the system continued booting to the login screen.
So, I think I'll stay with the 'quiet' and 'nomodeset' options.
It's not unusual for laptops to provide defective EDID to the driver. Adding video=1024x768@60 (or whatever resolution you prefer or need) may prevent the blackness. Nomodeset is bad news. It forces X to fall back to a slow generic driver that does not support desktop bling. video= only works when KMS is enabled (by default). With nomodeset, the console modes are controlled by the legacy vga= framebuffer parameters, and also with KMS for the early seconds of init prior to Intel driver initialization, after which video= takes over. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 30/03/12 19:11, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/30 18:54 (GMT+0100) Bob Williams composed:
On 30/03/12 17:31, Felix Miata wrote:
nomodeset is not a correct way to get boot messages displayed. Instead, modify /boot/grub/menu.lst get rid of quiet, and change splash=silent to splash=verbose. Do the same in /etc/sysconfig/bootloader if you want to keep it that way when kernels are updated.
My Intel 945 and 915 chipset desktop machines work OK, so your newer 965 laptop should be no worse if running at full power.
Well, I tried your suggestion, and I'm sorry to say, it didn't work. A lot of messages scrolled rapidly down the screen, then the screen went black. When the hard drive light stopped flickering I entered the encryption password, and the system continued booting to the login screen.
So, I think I'll stay with the 'quiet' and 'nomodeset' options.
It's not unusual for laptops to provide defective EDID to the driver. Adding video=1024x768@60 (or whatever resolution you prefer or need) may prevent the blackness.
Nomodeset is bad news. It forces X to fall back to a slow generic driver that does not support desktop bling. video= only works when KMS is enabled (by default). With nomodeset, the console modes are controlled by the legacy vga= framebuffer parameters, and also with KMS for the early seconds of init prior to Intel driver initialization, after which video= takes over.
Interesting stuff. Adding video=1280x800@76 didn't get rid of the blackness, but it did have the beneficial side effect of stopping the mouse pointer from flickering. I suppose that was a result of the downgraded video driver forced by nomodeset that you refer to above. Many thanks, Bob -- Bob Williams System: Linux 3.1.9-1.4-desktop Distro: openSUSE 12.1 (x86_64) with KDE Development Platform: 4.7.2 (4.7.2) "release 5" Uptime: 18:00pm up 2 days 0:02, 3 users, load average: 0.03, 0.15, 0.19 -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 31/03/12 03:31, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/30 17:11 (GMT+0100) Bob Williams composed:
Are the nouveau drivers involved during boot? Systemd/sysinitv are just outputting plain text messages to the console screen.
When nomodeset is not invoked, the native driver is initialized early during init.
I had to invoke 'nomodeset' on my Dell Inspiron 1525 laptop to see these messages, as I have an encrypted /home, and I have no way of knowing when cryptsetup requests the passphrase, apart from lack of activity of the hard drive light.
My display chipset is Intel Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller, not Nvidia. I'm running openSUSE 12.1 with KDE4.
nomodeset is not a correct way to get boot messages displayed. Instead, modify /boot/grub/menu.lst get rid of quiet, and change splash=silent to splash=verbose. Do the same in /etc/sysconfig/bootloader if you want to keep it that way when kernels are updated.
And how do you do all this to the KDE LIVE CD so one can get the os to even boot may I enquire? BC -- Why isn't there mouse-flavoured cat food? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2012/03/31 11:47 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
Felix Miata wrote:
nomodeset is not a correct way to get boot messages displayed. Instead, modify /boot/grub/menu.lst get rid of quiet, and change splash=silent to splash=verbose. Do the same in /etc/sysconfig/bootloader if you want to keep it that way when kernels are updated.
And how do you do all this to the KDE LIVE CD so one can get the os to even boot may I enquire?
Your guess is as good as mine. The only live Linux CD I routinely use comes from the premier authority on and original producer of live CDs, Klaus Knopper. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 31/03/12 12:06, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/31 11:47 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
Felix Miata wrote:
nomodeset is not a correct way to get boot messages displayed. Instead, modify /boot/grub/menu.lst get rid of quiet, and change splash=silent to splash=verbose. Do the same in /etc/sysconfig/bootloader if you want to keep it that way when kernels are updated.
And how do you do all this to the KDE LIVE CD so one can get the os to even boot may I enquire?
Your guess is as good as mine. The only live Linux CD I routinely use comes from the premier authority on and original producer of live CDs, Klaus Knopper.
Are you saying that the Live CD from Factory is not kosher? BC -- Why isn't there mouse-flavoured cat food? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2012/03/31 12:09 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
Your guess is as good as mine. The only live Linux CD I routinely use comes from the premier authority on and original producer of live CDs, Klaus Knopper.
Are you saying that the Live CD from Factory is not kosher?
I wouldn't know. The first time I needed a live CD many many moons ago I downloaded Knoppix. I've never used any other live Linux CD that I can recall. I only use them for a limited number of certain things, and don't need to be guessing what's different or not if I was to use anything else. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 31/03/12 12:51, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/31 12:09 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
Your guess is as good as mine. The only live Linux CD I routinely use comes from the premier authority on and original producer of live CDs, Klaus Knopper.
Are you saying that the Live CD from Factory is not kosher?
I wouldn't know. The first time I needed a live CD many many moons ago I downloaded Knoppix. I've never used any other live Linux CD that I can recall. I only use them for a limited number of certain things, and don't need to be guessing what's different or not if I was to use anything else.
I am not sure that we are on the same wavelength here. Milestone #2, for example, comes on Live KDE/Gnome CD and using this CD one can also install the Milestone. I don't know what CDs you are talking about but I am talking about the Milestone CDs (or even the final releases of oS which come in LIVE CD form). BC -- Why isn't there mouse-flavoured cat food? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 2012/03/31 13:52 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
I am not sure that we are on the same wavelength here.
Milestone #2, for example, comes on Live KDE/Gnome CD and using this CD one can also install the Milestone.
I don't know what CDs you are talking about but I am talking about the Milestone CDs (or even the final releases of oS which come in LIVE CD form).
A "live Linux CD" is any CD (or DVD) that boots to its own fully functional Linux text and GUI environment, including common apps/utilities/tools, regardless whether the booted hardware includes any other storage or installed OS.[1] The ability to install from the live media to HD would be just another included utility or app on that CD. Except for Knoppix, I've never installed any distro from "live" media, as they have a tradition of offering a limited subset of installation options incapable of meeting my requirements. Most of my installs are from no "media". In most cases I just use an installation kernel and initrd from a NET iso or normal installation ISO and start an HTTP or NFS installation using Grub. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LiveDistros -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 31/03/12 16:51, Felix Miata wrote:
On 2012/03/31 13:52 (GMT+1100) Basil Chupin composed:
I am not sure that we are on the same wavelength here.
Milestone #2, for example, comes on Live KDE/Gnome CD and using this CD one can also install the Milestone.
I don't know what CDs you are talking about but I am talking about the Milestone CDs (or even the final releases of oS which come in LIVE CD form).
A "live Linux CD" is any CD (or DVD) that boots to its own fully functional Linux text and GUI environment, including common apps/utilities/tools, regardless whether the booted hardware includes any other storage or installed OS.[1] The ability to install from the live media to HD would be just another included utility or app on that CD.
Except for Knoppix, I've never installed any distro from "live" media, as they have a tradition of offering a limited subset of installation options incapable of meeting my requirements. Most of my installs are from no "media". In most cases I just use an installation kernel and initrd from a NET iso or normal installation ISO and start an HTTP or NFS installation using Grub.
The definition of what "Live CD" means is admirable. But, as you say, you have never installed any other distro except Knoppix using a Live "media". Which is fine. I have no quarrels with this. But what I am talking about, and have stated, is that the LIVE "CD" of 12.2 MS #1 and #2 - which is not really a CD because it won't burn to an normal CD - will not boot and play nice unless you write "nomodeset" on the kernel boot line - EXCEPT for MS #2 Build #302 where nothing as far as I have tried will get it to "go Live" or anything else. BC -- Why do people order double cheeseburgers, large French fries, and Diet Coke? -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On Mon, 2012-03-26 at 19:57 +1100, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 26/03/12 18:32, Paul Ollion wrote: [pruned]
You are right I entirely agreed with Basil's opinion about Nouveau when I experienced all the troubles it caused ; but I had the most comfortable, fastest and flawless install of OS 12.1 on a recent machine on which Nouveau works so perfectly that I had not even noticed I was using it. If this noovoo driver works so pefectly why then have I had to use "nomodeset" when installing Milestone #1 and #2,
(a) Milestones aren't releases, so they don't count towards anything. (b) You were using specific hardware. Don't abstract (b) to apply to all cases. This was your experience on the specific video chipset that you have. No one here stated that nouveau worked perfectly on all hardware - just that it does on some [and thus does *not* on other hardware].
and then when booting into the install, otherwise I got nowhere with the install and then the first boot? In fact, I had to add "nomodeset" in menu.lst so as to be able to login without going thru hoops to do so (until I installed the proper nVidia driver)? And my video card is not something bought at an antique shop: it is a Geforce 7600 GT card and uses the latest nVidia 295.33 driver.
-- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
On 26/03/12 23:09, Adam Tauno Williams wrote:
On Mon, 2012-03-26 at 19:57 +1100, Basil Chupin wrote:
On 26/03/12 18:32, Paul Ollion wrote: [pruned]
You are right I entirely agreed with Basil's opinion about Nouveau when I experienced all the troubles it caused ; but I had the most comfortable, fastest and flawless install of OS 12.1 on a recent machine on which Nouveau works so perfectly that I had not even noticed I was using it. If this noovoo driver works so pefectly why then have I had to use "nomodeset" when installing Milestone #1 and #2, (a) Milestones aren't releases, so they don't count towards anything.
Oh? They don't count, eh? Why then are all the devs hard at work trying to get Milestone #2 out to be followed by MS #3 and so on? They are obviously misguided lot of people whose efforts don't count towards anything.
(b) You were using specific hardware.
My motherboard is an ASUS which contains NVIDIA chips for both the North and South bridges and it was manufactured in 2004. That's now 8 years ago. (The Nth and Sth bridges probably have little or no effect on the video but at least nVidia knew about the mobo at that time.) My Geforce 7600 GT video card was released in March 2006. That's 6 years ago. Now, if nVidia cannot come up with a default driver which can handle hardware which has been around for that length of time then I conclude that the noovoo driver is <enter your choice of word>. BC -- The more sand has escaped from the hourglass of our life, the clearer we should see through it. Niccolo Machiavelli -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, e-mail: opensuse+owner@opensuse.org
participants (7)
-
Adam Tauno Williams -
Basil Chupin -
Bob Williams -
Carlos E. R. -
Felix Miata -
James Knott -
Paul Ollion