Thanks Mike. Yes, it's good to know there are others who tried ;-) I read the other emails and spoken to another person wishing to contribute during the openSUSE Asia Summit. I think we'll simply start with putting more information in the wiki rather than persisting on having a separate properly documented Kubic/MicroOS page on doc.o.o. Cheers, Ish Sookun On 10/7/19 4:43 AM, Mike McCallister wrote:

Ish,

Back in March, Lana Brindley offered to work on revising/updating the openSUSE docs (https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-project/2019-03/msg00033.html). I also offered to help at that time. She ran into some issues opening communication with the SUSE Docs Team. I don't know where that initiative stands right now, but it's good to know there are others who want to help with openSUSE docs.

Another thread on this is on the opensuse-web list. I can't find that link, but it's around the same time.

Mike McCallister

On 10/6/2019 5:47 AM, Ish Sookun wrote:

...

Folks,

During the openSUSE Asia Summit's community meeting we discussed things that should be & can be done. One of those was about the openSUSE documentation.

I checked doc.opensuse.org.

I notice that all the documentation are currently copyrighted [1] by SUSE. Although the docs are granted GNU Free Documentation License it sounds proper to have the content ownership under openSUSE. Such a thing should not wait for the creation of a foundation.

It also appears that the documentation workload is currently on the shoulders of the SUSE documentation team (only). I would like to help, more specifically collaborating with Kubic/MicroOS team to have a Container documentation. How should I proceed?

Regards,

Ish Sookun

[1] https://doc.opensuse.org/documentation/leap/virtualization/book.virt_color_e...

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Hi Lana, On 10/8/19 10:13 AM, Lana Brindley wrote:

I would definitely advocate for contributing to the docs in the repo rather than the wiki, though, just to avoid silos. The whole point of open source is to give back, and we can't do that if we're contributing in our own sandbox.

Happy to help anyone who might like some pointers on using github or docbook.

Also, the docs mailing list has been reactivated, so feel free to chat further there (it's in cc).

Great! I'm glad to hear that. Will continue the conversation on the openSUSE doc ML. I'm having a look at the github repo and Docbook. Regards, Ish Sookun -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner@opensuse.org

On 10/8/19 3:23 AM, Ish Sookun wrote:

Hi Henne,

On 10/7/19 6:36 PM, Henne Vogelsang wrote:

...

There is no such thing as openSUSE, we don't have a legal entity you can assign copyright to. :-)

The footer of wiki.o.o contains:

© 2001–2019 SUSE LLC, © 2005–2019 openSUSE Contributors & others.

Can't we mention the same for doc.o.o?

Most spec files in openSUSE are also only copyright SUSE, although in some cases contributors have also added there name. Likewise currently only SUSE has provided content so the current copyright is correct, however as other contributors add content they could also add there name to the copyright. The way this is done varies greatly from project to project, in some projects the authors who have done significant work in a file have there name listed there others just maintain a list of Authors. Generally on a wiki or with source code under version control its reasonably easy to track who did which edits although this info can end up lost with migrations etc). -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner@opensuse.org

On 10/8/19 1:32 AM, Frank Sundermeyer wrote:

On Sunday, 6 October 2019 12:47:15 CEST Ish Sookun wrote:

Hi,

I am a member of the SUSE doc team and can only confirm what has already been said before:

...

During the openSUSE Asia Summit's community meeting we discussed things that should be & can be done. One of those was about the openSUSE documentation.

I checked doc.opensuse.org.

I notice that all the documentation are currently copyrighted [1] by SUSE. Although the docs are granted GNU Free Documentation License it sounds proper to have the content ownership under openSUSE. Such a thing should not wait for the creation of a foundation.

SLE and openSUSE have the same code base and this is also true for the documentation. The SLE documentation is written by the SUSE documentation team and the copyright lies with SUSE. The openSUSE documentation is generated from the same sources as the SLE documentation (https://github.com/SUSE/doc-sle).

...

It also appears that the documentation workload is currently on the shoulders of the SUSE documentation team (only). I would like to help, more specifically collaborating with Kubic/MicroOS team to have a Container documentation. How should I proceed?

It was already pointed out that https://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Kubic is THE place for Kubic documentation. In case you want to contribute to the standard openSUSE documentation, above mentioned GitHub repository is the place to start. If you have got questions, feel free to contact me by PM.

I somewhat disagree here, from the discussions we've had in openSUSE it would be great if we had the documentation all in one place that means not half on the wiki and half in docbook. If openSUSE contributors can write documentation to an acceptable standard I don't see why we shouldn't have chapters on kubic or KDE or XFCE or any other openSUSE software that people are willing to contribute. My understanding is it should be simple enough to build these chapters just for openSUSE. Maybe there needs to be some modifications to how the repo is organized if the current setup can't handle that. It wouldn't be hard to for example move the openSUSE documentation into openSUSE's github and merge in the changes from the SUSE documentation given there probably won't be much overlap. There are parts of the openSUSE community that would like to be translating the documentation and providing parts of it in printed form to students and lecturers and in my opinion at least docbook is a far better format. This is one of the main things that came out of our community discussions on Friday. So if openSUSE contributors such as Ish would like to work toward adding new sections to the openSUSE docbook then I think that's something to be encouraged rather then telling people to go back to the wiki. If the SUSE documentation team doesn't have time to help getting this setup that's understandable but there are also people in the community happy to help with that part as well (It's just no one has started working on additional content creating the need for it). Cheers -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner@opensuse.org

On 10/8/19 7:36 PM, jdd@dodin.org wrote:

Le 08/10/2019 à 09:59, Simon Lees a écrit :

...

So if openSUSE contributors such as Ish would like to work toward adding new sections to the openSUSE docbook then I think that's something to be encouraged rather then telling people to go back to the wiki.

sure, but the wiki is almost free form and docbook is a hell to configure (or at least is was not so long ago), better the wiki than nothing :-)

Yes but at the same time the wiki does not lend itself to producing professional looking printed documents. There has been a suggestion to bridge the two for example the PHP documentation contains the "officially generated" documentation followed by a "User Contributed Notes" section which allows the best of both worlds and keeps everything in one location. (Example [1]) The board discussed this issue at our face to face meeting last year, however with all the other discussions going on its ended up on the back burner (we also thought it might be easy to wait until hosting stuff started to move away from Provo). Potentially a simple way to achieve such a setup would be to embed a discourse [2] thread onto each page of our existing documentation. Our initial discussions started around the idea of creating an "openSUSE Knowledge Base" with the realisation we have a tonne of good (and occasionally less good) documentation / guides / how too's spread between the documentation provided by SUSE, the wiki and the openSUSE forums then to a lesser extent sites like stack overflow. There are many users who know about one or maybe two of these resources but there are many more that don't know they exist so the idea was to bring as much as possible into a central location. This is not something the current board has time to drive but i'm mentioning it now because if others would like to take it on and drive it, it would benefit the whole community. 1. https://www.php.net/manual/en/language.expressions.php 2. https://www.discourse.org/ -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner@opensuse.org

Le 08/10/2019 à 13:15, Carlos E. R. a écrit :

Maybe a text that explains how to configure and use docbook would help.

Time ago I wrote things using LyX and docbook, and not everything worked.

I used to coordinate this: http://tldp.org/ nearly dead long ago :-( jdd -- http://dodin.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner@opensuse.org

Le 08/10/2019 à 12:59, Simon Lees a écrit :

Yes but at the same time the wiki does not lend itself to producing professional looking printed documents.

who cares of printing documents nowadays!! print a page to pdf and store it in a cloud...

Our initial discussions started around the idea of creating an "openSUSE Knowledge Base"

but there is already one, part of the wiki is (was?) well organized as SDB: The work on the wiki *stopped* when it was decided to use mandatory organization some years ago. We *need* data. We have many users that are even frightened by writing free form page (I mean really free form, that is only add two CR between paragraphs and no more). don't get them out. I advocated then the fact that the documentation team main work should be to give a form to free form pages, that is lurk a new pages and add all the setup necessary. I was not heard. Bingo. I don't care, but I guess I was right, the (always small) wiki team did a very hard work to normalize the wiki, then couldn't cope one have to understand Google is much better to find info than any organization you can do. That said any initiative is good to take and people that work is the best entitled to choose how :-) jdd -- http://dodin.org -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner@opensuse.org