On Thursday 17 June 2010 23:33:56 Greg Freemyer wrote:
On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 5:12 PM, jdd <jdd@dodin.org> wrote:
Le 17/06/2010 20:42, Pascal Bleser a écrit :
One thing that I thought was to be taken for granted from the beginning, is that openSUSE is supposed to be a general purpose operating system for server, desktop, laptop and netbook.
That is precisely what we didn't do.
???
I think SuSE already did, and openSUSE do already!! why reduce our goals?
Because we believe that we cannot sustain the current model ad eternam. At least certainly not without more contributors (which is what I explained in my post). Maybe that's wrong ? We might of course very well end up with a strategy like what Martin proposed. But we will also have to discuss and see how realistic it is.
Did you notice we have a *new* default config (lxde) afaik mostly done by contributors?
Of course I did. And it was pretty much a one man show as far as I could see. On the other hand, we need more contributors on the maintenance, and on maintaining packages and quality in Factory, etc...
I have desktop openSUSE *and* openSUSE server, *and* laptop openSUSE of my own, and certainly don't want to have Debian as server, openSUSE as desktop and so on...
I don't know why you're implying that. The idea behind the approach we followed is that we would like to identify - what must be the main target/purpose of what we do, what we should be excellent at (e.g. developer tools, be a good server environment, or a stable and reduced core system, or compatibility and tooling in a mobile environment, or our KDE desktop, or .....) - what we need to be good at nevertheless (e.g. polished desktop, having several desktops, also provide a solid server system, ....) - what we will not do at all (e.g. not target embedded systems, not having PPC builds, not care about netbooks, not care about desktop integration, not having several desktops, not grow the amount of packages in factory, etc...) (I'm not saying I support all those things, they're merely *examples*) And that's what the whole process and discussion is going to be about, identify those. And then see what can realistically be done. And then discuss _how_ :)
The question at the core of this is whether we believe that with the current contributor base, it is realistic to try to be everything to everyone.
our base is shared between these parts, if we cut one we cut our base. and smaller base (servers) is also the more productive as contributors!
Well that's a point indeed. Fine. If most people believe we shouldn't, then we won't. That's what we're going to discuss. But by being everything and the kitchen sync and not succeeding at doing so isn't good either, as it creates frustration amongst those contributors who have an interest in a specific domain which cannot be properly supported by what we do.
If openSUSE become only a kde distro, I will certainly switch to Debian, because I *need* the same one as server and desktop.
That's your opinion, your priorities, and that's fine. Just because Marcus made a proposal (which doesn't include not being a solid server platform too, by the way) doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be what most will vote for.
desktop, laptop and netbook", the only remaining option is to reduce the scope, and focus on certain domains.
this is certainly a dead end
We believe that doing _everything_ is the dead end, because we currently don't have enough contributors to sustain that model. (well, sort of model, we currently don't really have a strategy at all :)) But again, you are implying a lot of things no one ever said. It's not because e.g. we would focus on our KDE desktop that openSUSE wouldn't still be well suited for servers.
I 100% agree with jdd, cross platform compatibility is key. I use linux on servers, workstations and laptops, and possibly a future netbook.
Sure, me too.
I have no desire to learn 3 sets of admin tools so I can run OS on the workstation and CentOS (etc.) on the server, and some light desktop on the laptop/desktop.
Don't support a strategy that would mean focusing on only the desktop then ;) (but again, I don't think that it's what Marcus meant -- defining what our main focus is doesn't mean we're not doing anything else -- even though we should also identify a few things we won't do at all). [...] cheers -- -o) Pascal Bleser <pascal.bleser@opensuse.org> /\\ http://opensuse.org -- I took the green pill _\_v FOSDEM::6+7 Feb 2010, Brussels, http://fosdem.org