On Wed, 2020-08-12 at 16:05 +0200, Pierre Böckmann wrote:
I find it very interesting you took my observations as 'accusations'. After all, I feel my observations are easily justifiable.
Observations might be justifiable but sometimes the way and methods chosen are questionable.
What possibly could be questionable about the 'way and method' chosen? I read your platform and commented about the contents of it on the very mailinglist where discussions about elections are meant to take place. What 'way and method' would you have preffered a contributor like me to have taken?
In your platform, the "Why you shoud vote for me.." section ONLY states the No-Confidence Vote. There is no mention of the Foundation in that section at all.
This section is maybe incomplete, that is fair enough - therefore I now edited that part. I am now stating in it that you should also vote for me because of my goals. Somehow I thought that would only be logical...
That mentioned "My Goals" section btw. puts up numerous other reasons why you should vote for me. Maybe you should also have a look at the goals of a candidate to make a reasonable decision whom you'd vote for.
That is good advice, but I can assure you I consider far more than just what a Board candidate says when deciding how I vote. For example, my evaluation of an individuals attitude and character is a huge aspect I consider. I've seen far too many Board members of the Project say one thing and mean another. I've been deeply and personaly hurt by the deceptive actions of past Board members. I only want to give my vote to Board members I feel I can trust, and trust can't come from only one post on a wiki page. Discussions like this certainly help to paint a fully picture, and I appreciate that opportunity and the time you've given in replying so far.
The "Current Issues" section dedicates a large paragraph to the No- Confidence Vote. That paragraph calls the work of your potential teammates 'unncessary' and 'disgraceful'.
Please give me a cite where you read that out or rather read that into. That's exactly one of those points you'd call "justifiable observations" but in fact are nothing more but untrue and unprovable / unproven accusations.
In your platform there is a clear reference reference to "The unnecessary and disgraceful retaliation against a former board member is not what I want to see from an elected institution..." https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Ad_hoc_Board_election_2020_platform_crowbyt... The actions you refer to in that sentance as "unnecessary and disgraceful" are actions taken by the whole Board after significant consideration and much effort by the very individuals you wish to call team mates. Hence my observation. There is nothing 'untrue', 'unprovable' or 'unproven'. You said those things. There is nothing accusatory in my obsevation. I don't even include my opinion on the actions. You made that statement in your election platform about work done by the same individuals you wish to call teammates if you are elected. That is a fact. The fact you now seem to be suggesting that you never made such statements in your platform does somewhat undermine any effort you might be making here to establish my trust in you. How is anyone meant to trust a Board member who publicly declares a contributors view to be "untrue" when its precisely based on exact statements made by that candidate in their election platform?
But, only to stress it out just in case my words made the impression I had only criticism for the current board and potential teammates to others as well: That's definitely not the case! There sure are things regarding their work that I have to criticise and that is what I have to focus on because those are the points that I see need improvement. That on the other hand does not implicate that they are only delivering "unnecessary or disgraceful" work. Words by the way you would not be able to find anywhere in my mails for good reasons.
I never said nor meant to imply that you declared _all_ of the work the Board does as unnecessary or disgraceful. But the decisions you were referring to were most certainly _work_, of the very type of dispute resolution that is the _core responsibilty_ of the openSUSE Board. The public record on that is clear and has been shared in exhausting detail. I do not challenge your right to declare that dispute resolution work done by the Board to be "unnecessary or disgraceful". I do feel however that if you're going to make such statements regarding any actions of other contributors to the Project, the least you should is having such a statement noted in a respectful manner as I did. Furthermore I would expect that someone running so forcefully on their opinion of past decisions by the current Board would be sharing a more fleshed out vision of how they intend to build bridges with the people they wish to work with. If you are elected I think you are going to need more than a self- declared "passion for openSUSE" to be able to establish a working rapport with the team you'll be joining.
I find it exceptionally telling that, once realising that we had a difference in opinion regarding the content of your platform, that the discussion has evolved the way it has.
A discussion consists of two parties. And regarding the point that I can't see much more than accusations from your side, it is really hard to still call it a real discussion where I'd be able not to be put into bad light by the way you formulate your questions and the way you do your "observations".
The purpose of posting your platform is to invite comment on it from potential voters. Like the other candidate, I commented on the content of your platform and gave feedback on areas I felt were deficient and areas I had been hoping for more detail from the outset. I asked you the same questions I asked the other Candidate. I do not think there is much ground to suggest I'm going out to cast you in a bad light. You started this discussion on exactly the same foot as your competitor.
Maybe we got each other on the wrong foot. I don't see that continuing this discussion on the current way it is, therefore I am open to anyone asking me further questions but for this thread I will leave it at that.
@Richard: A proposal: please let's get in personal touch to maybe clear out at least some of our misunderstandings and difficulties we are seeming to have with this style of communication. Maybe another and more personal communication channel like a call is able to improve our mutual understanding.
Unfortunately, events over the last years have taught me that individuals sometimes call for such a personal communication and then later misrepresent the contents of such private discussions in a public forum to further their own goals. It's a technique I have seen used to my detriment on more than one occation. While I have no substantive reason to suspect you might be wishing to act in such a way, I wish to avoid placing myself in such a compromisable position. Therefore I insist that any discussion we have on the topic of your potential election to the Board is conducted in this public manner so there is an unambiguous record of exactly what we both said to each other. If you are not willing to continue talking to me in a public venue, I will respect your decision. I do not see much grounds for a continued back and forth anyhow, especially if this email successed in clearing up any remaining confusion regarding my statements todate.
I would have hoped a Board member would have taken the opportunity to look inward, and ask themselves how a voting Member like myself got such an impression.
I am a thoughtful and considerate person, at least thinking twice or rather more than twice about what I write and how I write it, always thinking about how the words might be received and understood by the reader. I am sorry if that failed you.
I appreciate that sentiment, thank you. -- Richard Brown Linux Distribution Engineer - Future Technology Team Phone +4991174053-361 SUSE Software Solutions Germany GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, D-90409 Nuernberg (HRB 36809, AG Nürnberg) Geschäftsführer: Felix Imendörffer -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: opensuse-project+unsubscribe@opensuse.org To contact the owner, email: opensuse-project+owner@opensuse.org