Hi all, within this e-mail I'd like to inquire why the actual available package: python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm is completely outdated. An update fails with the message: You are using pip version 10.0.1, however version 21.2.4 is available. I could not find out under https://build.opensuse.org/search?search_text=python3-pip, any available update. Incomprehensible is also for me, why there is such a high difference in the release number (10.0.1 ---> 21.2.4), nor who is current maintainer for this package. Would it be possible to make an update for this package available? Kind regards M
Hello Michael, Am Dienstag, 7. September 2021, 00:41:39 CEST schrieb Michael Kasimir:
Hi all, within this e-mail I'd like to inquire why the actual available package:
python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm
is completely outdated. An update fails with the message: You are using pip version 10.0.1, however version 21.2.4 is available.
docb@X1E:~> zypper if python38-pip Repository-Daten werden geladen... Installierte Pakete werden gelesen... Informationen zu Paket python38-pip: ------------------------------------ Repository : openSUSE-Tumbleweed-Oss Name : python38-pip Version : 20.2.4-1.7 Arch : noarch Anbieter : openSUSE Installierte Größe : 10,4 MiB Installiert : Ja Status : aktuell Quellpaket : python-pip-20.2.4-1.7.src Yes, it is slightly behind the actual version, as it was mentioned already here: https://lists.opensuse.org/archives/list/python@lists.opensuse.org/thread/ R6SON5UKEGNNXN3ZUSYUPG3OITNOEBWW/
I could not find out under https://build.opensuse.org/search?search_text=python3-pip, any available update. Incomprehensible is also for me, why there is such a high difference in the release number (10.0.1 ---> 21.2.4), nor who is current maintainer for this package.
osc maintainer python-pip gives you the answer. Cheers Axel
On 9/7/21 16:15, Axel Braun wrote:
Hello Michael,
Am Dienstag, 7. September 2021, 00:41:39 CEST schrieb Michael Kasimir:
Hi all, within this e-mail I'd like to inquire why the actual available package:
python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm
is completely outdated. An update fails with the message: You are using pip version 10.0.1, however version 21.2.4 is available.
docb@X1E:~> zypper if python38-pip Repository-Daten werden geladen... Installierte Pakete werden gelesen...
Informationen zu Paket python38-pip: ------------------------------------ Repository : openSUSE-Tumbleweed-Oss Name : python38-pip Version : 20.2.4-1.7 Arch : noarch Anbieter : openSUSE Installierte Größe : 10,4 MiB Installiert : Ja Status : aktuell Quellpaket : python-pip-20.2.4-1.7.src
lp152 means that it is a leap 15.2 package that he is looking at not tumbleweed, and yes it does seem really weird, even more so because SLE-15-SP2 has a version somewhere in the 20's and I can't see an obvious reason why Leap doesn't use that version. Leap 15.3 uses a much newer version so given that 15.2 goes end of life in the next few months i'd recommend upgrading as probably the easiest solution.
I could not find out under https://build.opensuse.org/search?search_text=python3-pip, any available update. Incomprehensible is also for me, why there is such a high difference in the release number (10.0.1 ---> 21.2.4), nor who is current maintainer for this package.
osc maintainer python-pip gives you the answer.
In this case it doesn't really because it doesn't provide info about the SLE maintainer and the package should come from SLE even though it doesn't. -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
Thanks for the quick replies. Yes, Simon, I know that 15.2 is at eol. But I want to delay the move a bit, because I expect additional problems in other areas after the update to 15.3... So, is there actually a solution possible?
Am 07.09.21 um 00:41 schrieb Michael Kasimir:
Hi all, within this e-mail I'd like to inquire why the actual available package:
python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm
is completely outdated. An update fails with the message: You are using pip version 10.0.1, however version 21.2.4 is available.
I could not find out under https://build.opensuse.org/search?search_text=python3-pip, any available update.
You could try: https://software.opensuse.org/package/python3-pip --> Show python3-pip for other distributions -> show experimental packages -> devel:languages:python:backports -> https://build.opensuse.org/package/binaries/devel:languages:python:backports... There you find a pyhton3-pip-20.2.4 package. OTOH, the (rude) general recommendation for Python on Leap 15.X is: Use venvs, pip --user, or get lost. The fact that you are trying to use pip indicates that you are on the path to do something to this effect anyway. So why not update pip over pip first? Commands (untested, I don't have a Leap 15.2 with old pip lying around): $ python3 -m venv myenv $ source myenv/bin/activate (myenv) $ pip -U pip
Incomprehensible is also for me, why there is such a high difference in the release number (10.0.1 ---> 21.2.4), nor who is current maintainer for this package.
Constant source of confusion. The python stack on Leap is basically left as is and only sees marginal updates where absolutely necessary. If you want up to date packages, use Tumbleweed. - Ben
On 9/7/21 17:12, Ben Greiner wrote:
Am 07.09.21 um 00:41 schrieb Michael Kasimir:
Hi all, within this e-mail I'd like to inquire why the actual available package: python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm
is completely outdated. An update fails with the message: You are using pip version 10.0.1, however version 21.2.4 is available.
I could not find out under https://build.opensuse.org/search?search_text=python3-pip, any available update.
You could try:
https://software.opensuse.org/package/python3-pip --> Show python3-pip for other distributions -> show experimental packages -> devel:languages:python:backports -> https://build.opensuse.org/package/binaries/devel:languages:python:backports...
There you find a pyhton3-pip-20.2.4 package.
OTOH, the (rude) general recommendation for Python on Leap 15.X is: Use venvs, pip --user, or get lost. The fact that you are trying to use pip indicates that you are on the path to do something to this effect anyway. So why not update pip over pip first?
Commands (untested, I don't have a Leap 15.2 with old pip lying around):
$ python3 -m venv myenv $ source myenv/bin/activate (myenv) $ pip -U pip
Incomprehensible is also for me, why there is such a high difference in the release number (10.0.1 ---> 21.2.4), nor who is current maintainer for this package.
Constant source of confusion. The python stack on Leap is basically left as is and only sees marginal updates where absolutely necessary. If you want up to date packages, use Tumbleweed.
No this is even more confusing because someone has explicitly touched it to make it older then what we are shipping everywhere else. -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
On 9/7/21 17:12, Ben Greiner wrote: OTOH, the (rude) general recommendation for Python on Leap 15.X is: Use venvs, pip --user, or get lost. The fact that you are trying to use pip indicates that you are on the path to do something to this effect anyway. So why not update pip over pip first? Ben, thank you very much for your hint to the recommendation to use a virtual environment, which I finally found at: https://docs.python.org/3/tutorial/venv.html I've upgraded pip with: $ python3 -m pip install --upgrade pip I then checked out what is actually installed on my Leap 15.2 system: $ python3 --version Python 3.6.12 $ pip3 --version pip 21.2.4 from /usr/lib/python3.6/site-packages/pip (python 3.6) $ rpm -qi python3-pip Name : python3-pip Version : 10.0.1 Release : lp152.4.6.1 Architecture: noarch Install Date: So 06 Dez 2020 17:50:05 CET Group : Development/Languages/Python Size : 9447014 License : MIT Signature : RSA/SHA256, Mo 30 Nov 2020 23:27:33 CET, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284 Source RPM : python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm Build Date : Mo 30 Nov 2020 23:26:33 CET Build Host : build73 Relocations : (not relocatable) Packager : http://bugs.opensuse.org Vendor : openSUSE URL : http://www.pip-installer.org Summary : Pip installs packages. Python packages. An easy_install replacement Description : Pip is a replacement for easy_install. It uses mostly the same techniques for finding packages, so packages that were made easy_installable should be pip-installable as well. Distribution: openSUSE Leap 15.2 $ So result is apparently that python3-pip in version 10.0.1 systemwide, and pip3 is installed locally. Then in general I checked out which different python versions are installed and where: $ ls -al /usr/bin/pytho* lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 9 13. Mär 17:29 /usr/bin/python -> python2.7 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 9 13. Mär 17:29 /usr/bin/python2 -> python2.7 -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 6304 13. Mär 17:29 /usr/bin/python2.7 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 9 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3 -> python3.6 -rwxr-xr-x 2 root root 10472 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 17 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6-config -> python3.6m-config -rwxr-xr-x 2 root root 10472 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6m -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 3440 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6m-config lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 16 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3-config -> python3.6-config lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 45 9. Jun 2020 /usr/bin/pythontex -> ../share/texmf/scripts/pythontex/pythontex.py $ Confusing! Maybe it is the best to simply follow Bens proposal to surround all possible problems and use a venv...
Am 07.09.21 um 11:11 schrieb Simon Lees:
Constant source of confusion. The python stack on Leap is basically left as is and only sees marginal updates where absolutely necessary. If you want up to date packages, use Tumbleweed. No this is even more confusing because someone has explicitly touched it to make it older then what we are shipping everywhere else.
What do you mean by "everywhere else"? Leap 15.1 and 15.2 have always shipped pip 10 and no maintenance update did change that. Didn't only Leap 15.3 start to reuse binary packages from SLE15?
On 9/7/21 19:22, Michael Kasimir wrote:
On 9/7/21 17:12, Ben Greiner wrote:
OTOH, the (rude) general recommendation for Python on Leap 15.X is: Use venvs, pip --user, or get lost. The fact that you are trying to use pip indicates that you are on the path to do something to this effect anyway. So why not update pip over pip first?
Ben, thank you very much for your hint to the recommendation to use a virtual environment, which I finally found at: https://docs.python.org/3/tutorial/venv.html
I've upgraded pip with: $ python3 -m pip install --upgrade pip
I then checked out what is actually installed on my Leap 15.2 system:
$ python3 --version Python 3.6.12
$ pip3 --version pip 21.2.4 from /usr/lib/python3.6/site-packages/pip (python 3.6)
$ rpm -qi python3-pip Name : python3-pip Version : 10.0.1 Release : lp152.4.6.1 Architecture: noarch Install Date: So 06 Dez 2020 17:50:05 CET Group : Development/Languages/Python Size : 9447014 License : MIT Signature : RSA/SHA256, Mo 30 Nov 2020 23:27:33 CET, Key ID b88b2fd43dbdc284 Source RPM : python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm Build Date : Mo 30 Nov 2020 23:26:33 CET Build Host : build73 Relocations : (not relocatable) Packager : http://bugs.opensuse.org Vendor : openSUSE URL : http://www.pip-installer.org Summary : Pip installs packages. Python packages. An easy_install replacement Description : Pip is a replacement for easy_install. It uses mostly the same techniques for finding packages, so packages that were made easy_installable should be pip-installable as well. Distribution: openSUSE Leap 15.2 $ So result is apparently that python3-pip in version 10.0.1 systemwide, and pip3 is installed locally.
Then in general I checked out which different python versions are installed and where:
$ ls -al /usr/bin/pytho* lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 9 13. Mär 17:29 /usr/bin/python -> python2.7 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 9 13. Mär 17:29 /usr/bin/python2 -> python2.7 -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 6304 13. Mär 17:29 /usr/bin/python2.7 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 9 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3 -> python3.6 -rwxr-xr-x 2 root root 10472 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 17 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6-config -> python3.6m-config -rwxr-xr-x 2 root root 10472 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6m -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 3440 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3.6m-config lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 16 19. Feb 2021 /usr/bin/python3-config -> python3.6-config lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 45 9. Jun 2020 /usr/bin/pythontex -> ../share/texmf/scripts/pythontex/pythontex.py $
Confusing! Maybe it is the best to simply follow Bens proposal to surround all possible problems and use a venv...
Yeah, using a venv is always a good idea if your not using system packages having said that we might be able to fix it by adding the SLE package to Leap if that isn't likely to break too many other things at the same time if the old package is unusable because its too old then that should be resolved. -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
On 9/7/21 19:36, Ben Greiner wrote:
Am 07.09.21 um 11:11 schrieb Simon Lees:
Constant source of confusion. The python stack on Leap is basically left as is and only sees marginal updates where absolutely necessary. If you want up to date packages, use Tumbleweed. No this is even more confusing because someone has explicitly touched it to make it older then what we are shipping everywhere else.
What do you mean by "everywhere else"? Leap 15.1 and 15.2 have always shipped pip 10 and no maintenance update did change that. Didn't only Leap 15.3 start to reuse binary packages from SLE15?
While only 15.3 started using binary packages from SLE, we have used the source packages from SLE for an increasingly large number of packages since Leap was started. From 15 we have tended to take the SLE package sources by default unless there is a really good reason not to. For pip there could have been a good reason or it could have been missed somehow. SLE got an update from 10.X to 20.X during 15-SP1 with a couple of updates since one was in 15-SP2, it shouldn't be too hard to take the sources for that package and ship them as an update for Leap unless there is a really good reason not to have a newer version like it would break lots of things for lots of people, but it already seems broken. -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
Am 07.09.21 um 12:59 schrieb Simon Lees:
SLE got an update from 10.X to 20.X during 15-SP1 with a couple of updates since one was in 15-SP2, it shouldn't be too hard to take the sources for that package and ship them as an update for Leap unless there is a really good reason not to have a newer version like it would break lots of things for lots of people, but it already seems broken.
I have no insight into why SLE15-SP1 got that update, but I would not consider pip broken for Leap <= 15.2 If you use pip, you have already decided to populate either a user site or a virtual environment. If that is the case, you can always use the system pip 10 to install a more recent pip into the user site or venv. Never use pip as root. System packages normally don't need pip on runtime. If there was one in Leap, which does not work with pip10, it would have been broken from the beginning. Ben
Am 07.09.21 um 11:52 schrieb Michael Kasimir:
I've upgraded pip with: $ python3 -m pip install --upgrade pip
I then checked out what is actually installed on my Leap 15.2 system:
$ python3 --version Python 3.6.12
$ pip3 --version pip 21.2.4 from /usr/lib/python3.6/site-packages/pip (python 3.6)
That looks bad. Despite your prompt saying, that you executed `python3 -m pip install ...` as normal user, you were able to overwrite files in the system sitelib.
So result is apparently that python3-pip in version 10.0.1 systemwide, and pip3 is installed locally.
No, the system-wide pip 10.0.1 was overwritten by the manual pip install. Of course rpm does not know about this yet. Never use pip as root. Ben
Ok Ben, many thanks for your justified warnings and recommendations. Meanwhile I've removed pip 21.2.4 sucessfully from my Leap 15.2 system. So there is again only python-pip-10.0.1-lp152.4.6.1.src.rpm ...
For the recommended installation of the python virtual environment I could find the openSUSE package: python-virtualenv-16.1.0-lp152.2.4.src.rpm and installed it. It is now working! @Ben Thank you so much for the essential hints. Kind Regards M.
Am 07.09.21 um 23:07 schrieb Michael Kasimir:
For the recommended installation of the python virtual environment I could find the openSUSE package: python-virtualenv-16.1.0-lp152.2.4.src.rpm
Mind you, you have always been referring to source packages. If any, you actually want to install the python3-foo binary packages. Furthermore, you don't need virtualenv. The venv module is part of the Python 3 standard library. https://docs.python.org/3/library/venv.html https://packaging.python.org/guides/installing-using-pip-and-virtual-environ... Forget Python 2. Python 3 is the way to go, even on Leap 15.2. Ben
@Ben Thank you again so much for the additional hints. With the https://packaging.python.org/guides/installing-using-pip-and-virtual-environ... up to now it has NOT come clear to me, that for building the virtual environment there is a substancial diff: venv (= Python 3) and virtualenv (= Python 2) Such a clarification could not be found on the openSUSE page https://software.opensuse.org/package/python3-virtualenv It has not been my intention to still work with python2... Unfortunately in the openSUSE wiki is no information page regarding the python virtual environment subject.
On 9/7/21 23:25, Ben Greiner wrote:
Am 07.09.21 um 12:59 schrieb Simon Lees:
SLE got an update from 10.X to 20.X during 15-SP1 with a couple of updates since one was in 15-SP2, it shouldn't be too hard to take the sources for that package and ship them as an update for Leap unless there is a really good reason not to have a newer version like it would break lots of things for lots of people, but it already seems broken.
I have no insight into why SLE15-SP1 got that update, but I would not consider pip broken for Leap <= 15.2
If you use pip, you have already decided to populate either a user site or a virtual environment. If that is the case, you can always use the system pip 10 to install a more recent pip into the user site or venv.
Yes but if most people are required to use pip to update to a newer pip because the old one doesn't work with many libraries anymore I'd consider that broken and certainly worth upgrading, at an extreme point if pip 10 could no longer update to the latest version this would be very very broken. Being broken in such a way as described above would be more then enough reason to ship a maintenance update to a newer version. On the other hand if almost all pypi packages still work with pip10 then it might not be worth updating because of the risk of it breaking something.
System packages normally don't need pip on runtime. If there was one in Leap, which does not work with pip10, it would have been broken from the beginning.
Yeah this I am well aware of, I was more thinking of the risk that if we upgrade from pip10 to pip20 there is a chance that it will break a users setup or workflow that was created with pip10. Again if we believe the risk of a pip10->pip20 update breaking existing pip setups is really low then it would make sense to do the update because it will obviously benefit some users. While for many things we are very conservative on our update policy with leap if something is pretty much at the point of no longer functioning properly we do have scope to update it, especially in cases like this where the package isn't using the sources from SLE. Cheers -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
On 9/8/21 19:33, Michael Kasimir wrote:
@Ben Thank you again so much for the additional hints.
With the https://packaging.python.org/guides/installing-using-pip-and-virtual-environ... up to now it has NOT come clear to me, that for building the virtual environment there is a substancial diff: venv (= Python 3) and virtualenv (= Python 2) Such a clarification could not be found on the openSUSE page https://software.opensuse.org/package/python3-virtualenv
It has not been my intention to still work with python2...
Unfortunately in the openSUSE wiki is no information page regarding the python virtual environment subject.
I can't see any reason why the following wouldn't work on openSUSE, hopefully its helpful https://docs.python.org/3/library/venv.html -- Simon Lees (Simotek) http://simotek.net Emergency Update Team keybase.io/simotek SUSE Linux Adelaide Australia, UTC+10:30 GPG Fingerprint: 5B87 DB9D 88DC F606 E489 CEC5 0922 C246 02F0 014B
participants (4)
-
Axel Braun -
Ben Greiner -
Michael Kasimir -
Simon Lees